Law School Discussion

Poll

Do you believe women should be placed into/allowed into combat situations in the US military?

No, the army is not societyís testing ground
No, itís unfair, but it is too much of a distraction for male soldiers in dangerous situations
No, other reasons
Yes, there is no justifiable reason women should be discriminated against
Yes, women can be more capable than men in this area
Yes, other reasons
Yes, but ONLY if they are held to equal standards

Women in combat situations

Ever

Re: Women in combat situations
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2006, 10:43:39 AM »
Wonder when they will get around to draft eligibility...

Jinx

Re: Women in combat situations
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2006, 11:04:11 AM »
hmmm, so far no one has said no.

maybe if you rephrased it and asked if it was their/your daughter?
'


Ummm, so what?

opinions might change then.

Seems like a cheap shot to me. Quite frankly, your daughter will and should do whatever she wants to when she becomes an adult.

What if your daughter wanted to be a firefighter? A cop? An astronaut? An underwater welder?

SO WHAT!?

Shouldn't she be allowed to make her own decisions? You were.

guyminuslife

Re: Women in combat situations
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2006, 11:13:52 AM »
I want Annie Oakley in the US Army.

wannaB1L

  • ****
  • 752
  • Mike Nifong '08
    • View Profile
Re: Women in combat situations
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2006, 01:05:38 PM »

Also if a woman does 17 pushups she passes her PT test, but a male can fail with 38 push-ups. Who would you rather depend on to pull your bloodied body out of a ditch and hump you back to the rear? A human that can do 38 push-ups, or one that can only do 17? It's all about keeping my ass alive!

An an 18 year old man has to run 2 miles in 15 minutes.  A 40 year old man has to run 2 miles in 20 minutes.  Using your logic old people can't go to combat?

Have ou have ever done pushups in combat?  NO!  Becuase The physical fitness test measures physical fitness, not combat readiness.  That's what ranges, exercises, drills, etc. are for.  And when it comes time to start carrying around heavy machine guns, putting them together, and firing on the enemy, that's when it matters.  And in situations like that, I've seen women do just fine.

I've also seen men emotionally break down and ask to be reassigned to non-combat positions.  Again, based on the wonderful musings by wannaB1L (whose posts always crack me up), examples of these men breaking down mean all men shouldn't be allowed in combat.


perhaps you were blinded by anger, so maybe you missed my point

*the most decorated soldier I have ever seen said he peed his pants during his first fire fight. So I already conceded that combat is hard on anyone.

*I did say that some women are up to the task, but most are not. I did mention that one female whoi was a real warrior, and how I felt sorry for her, because the other girls were too lame, thus making her look bad.

*Push ups in combat are a must. When the lead flies you hit the dirt. Then you have to spring up with all your TA-50 (gear) and rush forward and hit the dirt again, followed by...you guessed it another push up with 25 pounds of TA-50. So actually push ups are a MAJOR part of combat. I am no hero, when lead flies- hit the dirt.

*physical fitness is a mojor part of combat. Have you ever been out in the field for a week? Humping 15 miles in a day, carrying all your gear, only to have to pull guard at night for an hour or two. Yeah physical fitness is an important part of combat readiness. Until you have fallen asleep standing up with your eyes open on several occasions you don't know squat about what role physical fitness plays in combat.

*YOU are WRONG about a 40 year old male's APFT run time. The bare minimum is 18 minutes and 18 seconds. So the difference between a 22 year old male and a 40 yo male is 1 minute and 40 seconds. That is not as big a gap as 17 pushups versus 40. The male has to do twice as much as a female. This is not a very good comparison to a 40 yo man running an 18:18 versus a 16:38 for a young buck.

* People like this always make me laugh, so thanks!

*Those two women in the military agreed with me (the second of my posts). One said that a women cannot even carry another woman. I don't want my buddies life to depend of your PC social engineering. Combat is too serious an endeavor to let you prove a point.

PS your facts and comparisons were off of the mark Lasse.

guyminuslife

Re: Women in combat situations
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2006, 03:18:08 PM »
Again, everyone, you should exclude people because they don't meet requirements, but a pair of testicles shouldn't be one of them.

I think that this all goes back to the social construction (especially in military circles) of conflating femininity with weakness. It's the same reason why a lot of them get all huffy about gays in the military. (Incidentally, the most hardcore Marine I've ever met---a huge, muscular, viscious mofo who'd been in several combat situations in Iraq---was gay. He'd be your worst nightmare in prison.) So even if women are held to the same standards for active combat duty as men, it's still disruptive of the prejudices created in the military establishment.

tzip

Re: Women in combat situations
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2006, 05:33:18 PM »
not all comat is the same. where i served, women serve combativly as artiliary and AA gunners, MPs, border police, combat medics, and pilots, and do just as well as their male counter-parts. even in artilarry where you gotta be strong enough to pick up shells, some women do well, but these same women can also probably play football for Cal. there are also women in combative infantry, and there exprience had proven pretty poor. the problem isn't with strength, its with putting men and women together in combat, with issues of disipline and authority. don't forget that today combat isn't always 24 hours of war, there are many hours of just sitting around and waiting, and two guys might pass dead hours in the middle of the desert differently from a guy and a girl. women can physically be in combat, but there are some jobs that benefit from having all guys. i was a tanker, and couldnt imagine having a woman on my crew, not because i think she would not be good crewmember (though to be honest, being a loader or driver could be very tough for most women), but because you spend sometimes a week straight in a tank together, and get so close that you can tell who farted by the smell alone. its very important for the survival of the team to be that close, and that kind of comfort can't exist in co-ed teams.

->Soon

  • *****
  • 18818
    • View Profile
Re: Women in combat situations
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2006, 05:36:38 PM »
the Israeli army has lady soldiers.

they seem to do ok...

redemption

Re: Women in combat situations
« Reply #17 on: October 27, 2006, 05:38:11 PM »
the Israeli army has lady soldiers.

they seem to do ok...

A devastating argument that cuts through the cant.

tzip

Re: Women in combat situations
« Reply #18 on: October 27, 2006, 05:38:42 PM »
i served in the IDF, and i just addressed that topic.

tzip

Re: Women in combat situations
« Reply #19 on: October 27, 2006, 05:39:36 PM »
i should say, i did meet my girlfriend there (she out ranked me), so its not all bad.