Process of Transferring From COOLEY

[Nova Juris]

If you havn't started yet and plan to transfer don't go. Just raise your LSAT and (if possible) try to take a few extra classes that are blow off to raise your undergrad GPA. (If going to cooley I am guessing you don't have your full BA)

There are going to be people there who have a 160 LSAT and 4.0 undergad GPA who are attending just for the full ride. They will be the top 10% of your class. They won't want to transfer but will be the only ones other school truely want. The curve will make that happen.

If you can't stand Cooley don't go. If you go, plan to graduate and plan to go part time since if your LSAT is under 160 you can't handle a 15 credit load and not be academicly dismissed. You just can't. Expect 5 years at Cooley if you go.

You act as if there's a perfect correlation between one's LSAT score and law school success. While it's true that the LSAT is a very dependable indicator of one's academic ability, it is far from perfect. For instance, when in law school have you ever been asked to perform the same task that is asked of test takers on LSAT logic games? Never, I suspect.

The LSAT is a gatekeeper, which is purposely designed to generate a bell-curved distribution of scores.

gatekeeper, based on curve..... what do you think the top 10% is based on? Low GPA and Low LSAT statisticly lower the odds of the curve helping you. Sorry if it hurts your feelings somehow. 90% of people think they can be the top 10%. Math doesn't allow it. Not that the bottom half know how to do that type of math mind you.

[Nova Juris]

I agree, it's a statement with no basis in reality. Many law schools have a median/average LSAT score below 160, and yet maintain low academic attrition.

but that wasn't the question was it? It was about transfering out. Seperate issues.

[Nova Juris]

FutureLSStudent, if you're goal is to finish your law degree at a school other than Cooley then you'd probably be better off foregoing school in the fall and retake the LSAT in an attempt to score into the school of your choice.

As Roald pointed out, finishing in the top 10% is unlikely. In fact, you have a 90% chance of not finishing in the top 10%. The odds are stacked precariously against you. And in many ways, how well you do your first year is largely out of your control. The forced curve is brutal. Professors try to grade objectively (one can hope), but complete objectivity is impossible given the subjective nature of legal analysis. It's not as though every question has a clear right or wrong answer; there are many shades of gray in the law. A professor, for example, might mark you down because you chose to flesh out an argument that he thought was of little importance, even though reasonable minds could disagree as to its legal relevance.   

If you move forward with your current plan, you're placing your fate mostly in the hands of your professors and fellow students. Law school is fiercely competitive. It's unlike college in almost every imaginable way. You could conceivably spend 18 hours a day in the library and still end up with a pedestrian gpa that's well outside of the top 10%.

In my humble opinion, you'd be better off devoting the time and energy that you ostensibly plan to exert in your studies this fall to retaking (and mastering) the LSAT.

so now you agree with me. Awsome. Buzz must have faded?

[Nova Juris]

Everybody is right so far, it seems.  I just thought I'd mention that you don't have to be in the top 10% to transfer per se.  I know plenty of people (even with those pedestrian gpas) who transferred from Cooley a couple years ago.  It really entirely depends on where you are applying and who else is applying to transfer to that school.  In fact, I know someone who transferred to a tier 2 from Cooley who was ranked in the top 40%.  Just something to keep in mind. 

That being said, waiting and getting a higher LSAT score is probably the best move.  Like everyone said, there is no guarantee when you're talking about transferring.  Random hits on your other questions next....

I took 12 units a semester instead of 15 when at Cooley.  I found it very manageable, especially compared to fellow students taking 15. 
You will likely need a letter from a professor.  I found it somewhat difficult to get one from a professor at Cooley (some wouldn't do it at all while others required you receive an A in their class).
I don't think you can reasonably expect to transfer after 2 yrs.  Most schools cap the amount of units you can transfer (usually around 30-34).  I guess it may be possible, but you'd be wasting 30 units you paid for.   

Definitely call schools you are considering and see what is generally required for an acceptance.  I think LSAC contains this information as well.

where did they transfer to and what was their cumulative gpa?

[FutureLSStudent]

Thanks everyone for your advice. You have given me a lot to think about. I agree that I shouldn't go to Cooley if I expect to transfer. The odds are stacked against me and I should be ok with spending the next 3 years there if I have to. I know people who do go their now and do like it. I also have heard some good things regardless of its reputation. I think I can be ok with getting my law degree there, and Ill probably go part time.

I guess I am leaning toward the unlikely idea of being able to transfer because I don't want to wait and take the lsat again: mostly because I don't want to have to start paying back my student loans from undergrad since I won't be enrolled in school (btw...I did get my BA, Nova Juris ).

I need to be realistic about this decision and I will continue to do my research, including contacting specific schools about their transfer process. Basically its not impossible to transfer but just really really hard. This was very helpful and Im going to consider alot of things before I make a decision. THANKS

For future reference: Nova Juris, there is way to be helpful in a respectful way. You are really condescending. Just something to think about.

[cerealkiller]

I agree, it's a statement with no basis in reality. Many law schools have a median/average LSAT score below 160, and yet maintain low academic attrition.

but that wasn't the question was it? It was about transfering out. Seperate issues.

You made it an issue when you stated that if the OP scored below 160 he wouldn't be able to handle a 15 credit-hour course load.

[cerealkiller]

FutureLSStudent, if you're goal is to finish your law degree at a school other than Cooley then you'd probably be better off foregoing school in the fall and retake the LSAT in an attempt to score into the school of your choice.

As Roald pointed out, finishing in the top 10% is unlikely. In fact, you have a 90% chance of not finishing in the top 10%. The odds are stacked precariously against you. And in many ways, how well you do your first year is largely out of your control. The forced curve is brutal. Professors try to grade objectively (one can hope), but complete objectivity is impossible given the subjective nature of legal analysis. It's not as though every question has a clear right or wrong answer; there are many shades of gray in the law. A professor, for example, might mark you down because you chose to flesh out an argument that he thought was of little importance, even though reasonable minds could disagree as to its legal relevance.   

If you move forward with your current plan, you're placing your fate mostly in the hands of your professors and fellow students. Law school is fiercely competitive. It's unlike college in almost every imaginable way. You could conceivably spend 18 hours a day in the library and still end up with a pedestrian gpa that's well outside of the top 10%.

In my humble opinion, you'd be better off devoting the time and energy that you ostensibly plan to exert in your studies this fall to retaking (and mastering) the LSAT.

so now you agree with me. Awsome. Buzz must have faded?

Are you enjoying the anonymity of cyberspace, young Nova? Good. The world desperately needs more pricks. Keep up the great work!

[kjw5029]

Everybody is right so far, it seems.  I just thought I'd mention that you don't have to be in the top 10% to transfer per se.  I know plenty of people (even with those pedestrian gpas) who transferred from Cooley a couple years ago.  It really entirely depends on where you are applying and who else is applying to transfer to that school.  In fact, I know someone who transferred to a tier 2 from Cooley who was ranked in the top 40%.  Just something to keep in mind. 

That being said, waiting and getting a higher LSAT score is probably the best move.  Like everyone said, there is no guarantee when you're talking about transferring.  Random hits on your other questions next....

I took 12 units a semester instead of 15 when at Cooley.  I found it very manageable, especially compared to fellow students taking 15. 
You will likely need a letter from a professor.  I found it somewhat difficult to get one from a professor at Cooley (some wouldn't do it at all while others required you receive an A in their class).
I don't think you can reasonably expect to transfer after 2 yrs.  Most schools cap the amount of units you can transfer (usually around 30-34).  I guess it may be possible, but you'd be wasting 30 units you paid for.   

Definitely call schools you are considering and see what is generally required for an acceptance.  I think LSAC contains this information as well.

where did they transfer to and what was their cumulative gpa?

They had a 3.0 and transferred to a tier 2.  I can't imagine why you'd need more information than that. 

[Nova Juris]

Thanks everyone for your advice. You have given me a lot to think about. I agree that I shouldn't go to Cooley if I expect to transfer. The odds are stacked against me and I should be ok with spending the next 3 years there if I have to. I know people who do go their now and do like it. I also have heard some good things regardless of its reputation. I think I can be ok with getting my law degree there, and Ill probably go part time.

I guess I am leaning toward the unlikely idea of being able to transfer because I don't want to wait and take the lsat again: mostly because I don't want to have to start paying back my student loans from undergrad since I won't be enrolled in school (btw...I did get my BA, Nova Juris ).

I need to be realistic about this decision and I will continue to do my research, including contacting specific schools about their transfer process. Basically its not impossible to transfer but just really really hard. This was very helpful and Im going to consider alot of things before I make a decision. THANKS

For future reference: Nova Juris, there is way to be helpful in a respectful way. You are really condescending. Just something to think about.

wow, the person who barely passed undergrad and can't master the lsat with cooley as their best option giving me life advise. Thanks. That's swell.

[Nova Juris]

FutureLSStudent, if you're goal is to finish your law degree at a school other than Cooley then you'd probably be better off foregoing school in the fall and retake the LSAT in an attempt to score into the school of your choice.

As Roald pointed out, finishing in the top 10% is unlikely. In fact, you have a 90% chance of not finishing in the top 10%. The odds are stacked precariously against you. And in many ways, how well you do your first year is largely out of your control. The forced curve is brutal. Professors try to grade objectively (one can hope), but complete objectivity is impossible given the subjective nature of legal analysis. It's not as though every question has a clear right or wrong answer; there are many shades of gray in the law. A professor, for example, might mark you down because you chose to flesh out an argument that he thought was of little importance, even though reasonable minds could disagree as to its legal relevance.   

If you move forward with your current plan, you're placing your fate mostly in the hands of your professors and fellow students. Law school is fiercely competitive. It's unlike college in almost every imaginable way. You could conceivably spend 18 hours a day in the library and still end up with a pedestrian gpa that's well outside of the top 10%.

In my humble opinion, you'd be better off devoting the time and energy that you ostensibly plan to exert in your studies this fall to retaking (and mastering) the LSAT.

so now you agree with me. Awsome. Buzz must have faded?

Are you enjoying the anonymity of cyberspace, young Nova? Good. The world desperately needs more pricks. Keep up the great work!

kettle meet stove