Law School Discussion

How to go from a 147 to a 169

Re: How to go from a 147 to a 169
« Reply #10 on: January 23, 2008, 08:15:12 PM »
I understand your criticism that you already know the answers for memory, but the point is not getting the answers. The point is getting to the place where you KNOW THAT YOU KNOW how to perfectly attack each game.

I also really think it is really helpful to do the same type one after the other after the other....you'd be surprised how many similarities you'll see within the micro-categories. Many of the games have characteristics that are unique to that type.
Here are the categories...(source: Powerscore Logic Games Bible)

In regard to memory of past problems, it is not the memory of which answer is correct, but the path that I found the answer in the path.  If I struggle with a problem, I am much more likely to remember exactly how I overcame that problem, which is usually missing a critical deduction.  When I rework the problem, I remember "there's something that restricts this pair of variables," which prompts me to find that.  On a fresh game, I don't have that thought lingering in the back of my mind.  I do try to prove to myself that the wrong answers are wrong as well as definitively proving my selection is correct.

I will break the games down further, I think seeing the similarities may help me.  So far this week, I have done each of the grouping games twice.  My timing and accuracy have improved, even when I make sure to eliminate all the wrong answers, but I am not sure if that is because I am familiar with the questions. 

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

chucky

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Re: How to go from a 147 to a 169
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2008, 08:16:05 PM »
This post is for those of you, who are depressed right now about your prep test scores,
Good luck and God bless.


Good stuff mainly, but for debate, reality, fun, whatever, I have to comment about a few things.

If you think you will have much time to use that 420hp car in your tar with a Big law job somewhere so you can rev it up and roll, you are in for a shock.  You just won't have much free time for recreation.  It's a nice fantasy though.

Doing all the homework?  Yep. Lot's of people flake out on that and think that because they paid the $ and show up for most of the classes that that is enough.  Oops.

I think your main point is that it takes motivation and dedication outside of class?  If so, YES!  That is a big key to it.  Just getting a class paid for and driving there and hanging out will not do it.  Doesn't matter what class anybody signs up for if they think that is all it takes and don't do the homework.

2hrs for a section is ok at first when everything is brand new, but is to much time for each one except for during the 'virgin' time.  A couple of weeks into it one should not be spending nearly that much time to just do one section, except for review/dissection purposes. 

You were obviously motivated to do the work and it sounds like that was a big part of your success, so let's focus on that part and emphasize it.

(there is not one catch all formula that will accomplish it for everyone without hard work /outside of class study and practice time if one needs to improve a score substantially)

That part is a huge part of it.   Congrats on your success.

I like the praying part too, it can help, or at the least it will comfort your soul!


I agree with everything you said....this definitely isn't a formula, as there are many different paths that people have taken and succeeded with this test. This is just what worked for me.

Also, "by 2hrs/ section" I meant completely forget about the time element..it just as well could have been "5hrs/section or whatever"...the point was to forget about the timed element all together until you have mastered each question type.....and yes, it does make sense that as you progress you will naturally become faster. I think many people have a hard time letting the time element go though (at least others in my class did)...so that is what I said 2hrs/section...now that I think about it though, for my first couple I probably took at least that or longer...when it was a month before the test though, it would have driven me crazy to spend that amount of time on each section....so ya, I agree with what you were saying about this too.

chucky

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Re: How to go from a 147 to a 169
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2008, 08:19:58 PM »

In my class I think only myself and another girl actually did everything.


 I love those people. 


haha...this unbelievable...can you imagine :D....very funny to me.

he he,  those are just 2 of many stories.  At many times I have been thinking "Why are we even here, this is not a bar to pick up women at, why did you 'forget' to bring your books AGAIN? You figured out how to find the place, could you figure out how to bring the little book with you and try to time traffic too?"

Comfortably Numb-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=invo5D6SuBQ

Common mentality:  'I paid the $$ for the class and got here a few times, that should be enough'   :D



Haha...I love it. :D

chucky

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Re: How to go from a 147 to a 169
« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2008, 08:41:15 PM »
I understand your criticism that you already know the answers for memory, but the point is not getting the answers. The point is getting to the place where you KNOW THAT YOU KNOW how to perfectly attack each game.

I also really think it is really helpful to do the same type one after the other after the other....you'd be surprised how many similarities you'll see within the micro-categories. Many of the games have characteristics that are unique to that type.
Here are the categories...(source: Powerscore Logic Games Bible)

In regard to memory of past problems, it is not the memory of which answer is correct, but the path that I found the answer in the path.  If I struggle with a problem, I am much more likely to remember exactly how I overcame that problem, which is usually missing a critical deduction.  When I rework the problem, I remember "there's something that restricts this pair of variables," which prompts me to find that.  On a fresh game, I don't have that thought lingering in the back of my mind.  I do try to prove to myself that the wrong answers are wrong as well as definitively proving my selection is correct.

I will break the games down further, I think seeing the similarities may help me.  So far this week, I have done each of the grouping games twice.  My timing and accuracy have improved, even when I make sure to eliminate all the wrong answers, but I am not sure if that is because I am familiar with the questions. 

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

I think you'll be fine...you sound like you're on the right track.

Whatever you do, before you move on to the next game ask yourself this..."Do I own this game?" If you can say yes, then you're fine. For me it took me the 4 Step 1hr ish process I mentioned. Good luck.

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Re: How to go from a 147 to a 169
« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2008, 03:37:46 PM »
6. IF YOU ARE STRUGGLING WITH GAMES...READ THIS. I went from getting 7 correct on my first diagnostic to getting 100% on this section on my actual test. (This advice was given to my by Liz and Linbergh...thanx guys…also read all of Liz’s stuff when you get the chance…she is a sweety and if you read the material in her posts, your score will improve…period).

A) Ok, go to the back of the Games Bible and you'll see all the games up to about 2002 (I think) broken down by game type. Eg. Basic Linear - defined; Advanced Linear - overloaded, undefined etc.)

B) Take all the games and group them according to game type. (put all the basic linear games together...all the grouping games together etc. I made a list in Word and crossed the games off as I went along)

C) Then do all the games of one type and master it before you move on to the next type. Eg. Do each "basic linear – defined” one after the other. I would also recommend doing each game about 3 or 4 times before moving to the next one (my rule was one hour per game…maybe 45min for the easy ones). If you do this for every game type you will be a master at them. Also, follow the approach in the Bibles…I also bought the ultimate setup guide and sometimes it helped….once in a while I would miss an inference shown in it. Honestly, doing this while taking the course is absolute GOLD. If you ever get bogged down on a particular game type the teacher is there to walk you through it. So ya, this is the best way to attack the games in my opinion…hopefully that helps.

I categorized all of the games according to the LGB in a spreadsheet and also separated all of the games into individual games and then sorted those according to type.  I just did the main categories: linear basic, linear advanced, grouping, grouping/linear, and then grouped the others together.  If you are looking at a single game for an hour, what are you doing in that time?  After you have found the missing rule/deduction that you were not applying, what else did you do to maintain productivity?  If I do the same game two or three times in a row, I am to the point where I am just working from memorization as to the steps to take.  Did you experience the same?

Here is what I did for each game (the breakdown of 1hr ish per game)

1. Timed: Do the game timed (6-10min)

2. Untimed: Erase and redo the game untimed, this time not only proving the correct answer, but also proving every incorrect answer wrong (20min+)

3. Explore: Erase and try using different set ups and approaching the game in ways you normally wouldn't. Also, use the Ultimate Setup Guide to ensure you didn't miss anything. Doing this may sound strange, but trust me...you'll begin to feel like you OWN the game, and you'll recognize patterns. Eg. After you draw out the rules, and you have a setup, try finding a few hypotheticals that would have helped with a number of the questions...try identifying the templates...in some cases try using a different set of variables as the base etc. If you do this, you'll absolutely rip through other games that are similar.  (20min+)

4. Perfectly Efficient timed (5-8min). Erase, and now that you know the game, redo it with perfect efficiency.


I understand your criticism that you already know the answers for memory, but the point is not getting the answers. The point is getting to the place where you KNOW THAT YOU KNOW how to perfectly attack each game.

I also really think it is really helpful to do the same type one after the other after the other....you'd be surprised how many similarities you'll see within the micro-categories. Many of the games have characteristics that are unique to that type.
Here are the categories...(source: Powerscore Logic Games Bible)

Basic Linear (Balanced)
Basic Linear (Unbalanced – Overloaded); big inferences in these
Basic Linear (Unbalanced – Underfunded)
Advanced Linear (Balanced)
Advanced Linear (Unbalanced – Overloaded)
Advanced Linear (Unbalanced – Underfunded)* key is to identify temps
Grouping/Linear Combo (Harder Category with less inferences)
Grouping (Defined-Fixed, Balanced) (Average Difficulty)
Grouping (Defined-Fixed, Unbalanced – Overloaded)
Grouping (Defined-Fixed, Unbalanced – Underfunded)
Grouping (Defined – Moving, Balanced)
Grouping (Defined – Moving, Unbalanced – Overloaded)
Grouping (Partially Defined)
Grouping (Undefined)


I think there are 125+ individual games that I did this with...anyways, by the end, I felt almost excited for the games section, (and this is coming from a guy who only got 7 correct in the games on my first diagnosic....


This is great stuff...you should post it as a separate post so people can find it....My guess is this would solve anyone's game problems if they would actually do it all.

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Re: How to go from a 147 to a 169
« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2008, 03:55:24 PM »
haha...you're exactly right. :D

Tetris

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Re: How to go from a 147 to a 169
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2008, 04:42:20 PM »
Best advice: take as many practice tests as you (think in the ballpark of 30), timed, and go over wrong answer and find out why its wrong.

chucky

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Re: How to go from a 147 to a 169
« Reply #17 on: January 25, 2008, 01:41:23 PM »
haha...you're exactly right. :D

Yeah, and a lot of those are the same people that whip out the credit card for last minute tutoring.  It is heartbreaking but good for biz I guess.  With people, First off I have to quickly assess "Is this a day care discipline case or a fine tuning case with someone that has been working the stuff?"  and then angle it from there.   

I've blown off a bunch of last minute and other people that wanted to pay and foregone income because they were clearly in the 'day care' group.  That type can be rather recalcitrant and I just don't feel right wasting my time and taking their $$ when I can see that it is going to go nowhere.    Those people also tend to be the ones that are really bitter about prep services they received once they get their score and just want to point the finger and shift blame in sometimes very angry ways and talk poo about it.  Oh well, such is life..


Ya, it is too bad you can't just buy a great lsat score...(maybe they should auction off a 175 or two every year...bidding starts at 100k...;)

chucky

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Re: How to go from a 147 to a 169
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2008, 01:42:36 PM »
6. [....[/color]

This is great stuff...you should post it as a separate post so people can find it....My guess is this would solve anyone's game problems if they would actually do it all.



Alright...maybe tomorrow though, because I'm in a bit of a rush.

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Re: How to go from a 147 to a 169
« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2008, 09:19:38 AM »
bump...for all of you who are just starting your prep for June, you MUST read this thread. Good luck to all.