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Black Law Students / Re: Black Law Student Discussion Board
« on: July 07, 2004, 05:17:30 PM »
Hi everyone, I took the June  lsats and scored 173.I'm quite pleased with myself (thanks testmasters!). I want to know what are some of the benefits of attending Howard Law when it is ranked 3rd or 4th tier? Wouldn't attending a 1st tier school and being black/Afro-American make you stick out more to big firms? Thanks!

You are my inspiration! Woo hoo! OK, I'm going back to studying. I'm wasting too much time reading this board.
Anyway, what Burning Sands said. Go to Yale. Please!!! I may need your spot at Howard if I can't move my pratice score (164) any higher. :)

Law School Admissions / Re: Blacks and the legal field
« on: July 07, 2004, 03:54:12 PM »
"When you think about it, it would seem that a person with true 'black pride' would be against AA - are you really content to eat the scraps from the white man's table?"

LTB, you seem to forget that for any group of people to pull themselves up they have to start at the bottom. The Irish started out doing the dirtiest work, living in the poorest slums, and eating worse than the scraps from the white man's table. Thanks to their white skin, eating those scraps have gotten them almost to the head of the table with the white man (as you yourself have pointed out.)

It's hard to eat scraps and it's hard to be talked about by racist students, professors, adcomms etc. But that's just part of being black in America and that's something you could never understand. It's dehumanizing and degrading -- and trust me you need a whole lot more than pride to survive these kinds of racist attitudes. But that's how it is and it's nothing new. That's how lunch counters were desegregated in the South. They didn't want us there either but we didn't stop going.

I'm sticking my nose where it doesn't belong but LTB and HBCU, I think you guys are too smart to be going down this neverending road. Let it rest.

Law School Admissions / Re: Blacks and the legal field
« on: July 07, 2004, 02:58:15 PM »
Many people (myself included) are bitter at the fact that URMs can get into schools that I can't with worse numbers. It's not racism, in fact it's the exact opposite. URMs are underrepresented as lawyers for the simple reason that few apply to law school. It isn't that they can't get in, they have a much easier time getting into good schools than a suburban white kid.

Example: Does the URM with a 3.5/165 deserve to go to law school? Most definitely. Do they deserve to get into Harvard just because they are a minority? Of course not, but they do anyways.

In short, be thankful and don't whine.


No one DESERVES to go to Harvard or Yale or Stanford or even Cooley. Life just doesn't work that way, WStaffor. These are private institutions and they'll take whomever they want, much the same way they flat out refused to consider a lot of URMs for a very, very long time.

Even if Harvard rejected every single URM with stats lower than 3.9/180 that doesn't exponentially increase the probability that a white guy with those numbers would get in. There's an analogy that says affirmative action is like having three handicapped spots reserved in a huge parking lot full of spaces. Everyone who has to park elsewhere gets angry that they can't park close to the building because of those three spots held for those handicapped folks. But then even if you didn't have those three spots reserved for handicapped people that doesn't mean that a whole lot more people will get to park up close to the building, would it? And what makes you think that you would be one of the three to get one of those spots?

You guys have to see the bigger picture when it comes to AA. It really is not what's keeping you out of HYS. It's the fact that those schools look for exceptional people and 3.9/170 on its own doesn't make you that exceptional if you're the typical, overachieving upper middle class white recent college grad that makes up more than half the student body at HYS. Go out and do something spectacular and it will be as easy for you to get in. My white friend had no problem getting into HLS with her 167 LSAT and 3.48 GPA from a top 10. But she knew what she wanted right after college so she worked, traveled, and volunteered in three countries and that's what made her stand out. You can't be average and expect to hang with the above-average crowd. And a 165+ score for most URMs is above average and that's why he/she would be a good candidate for HLS.

And there's nothing to be "thankful" for. Nobody's handing out any favors here. Those schools and this country are better off because of the URMs they have trained. I assure you that I'm studying as hard as you are to get a decent score on the LSAT (probably even harder.) And I have as much of a right to whine about injustice as you do -- especially when you make it so plain that I'll have to deal with it on a daily basis in law school and beyond.

Hi NYBound. Yes, five months is a long time to study. But I've been out of school for a while and I haven't sat through an exam in a looong time. I don't want to leave anything to chance. For me, this would be a career change and I have to get into a Tier One school else this whole thing won't make sense financially -- salary wise anyway.

I will take some of the advice offered above and slow down a bit and really analyze why I keep getting some answers wrong on LR and probably go through the games bible again.

And yes, I worry constantly that I'm going to burn out and have a brain meltdown on test day. But what are you gonna do??

I've been studying and practicing for the Oct. LSAT since May. I've already been through the entire 10 Actual and I'm halfway through the 10 More. I just got the 10 Next in the mail. My fear is that I started practicing too early and that I'll run out of practice tests by Sept. Is anyone facing the same thing? And do you have any ideas on how to deal with this? I don't really want to slow my momentum because I don't want my score to drop back to what it was when I first started. Is it worth it to study with those "made up" LSAT tests from Kaplan and those other guys. I read somewhere that they were unrealistic. Is there any value in retaking tests I've already taken a month or two later? All answers are appreciated.

Law School Admissions / Re: 3 years & 125K -- all for a backup plan
« on: June 17, 2004, 02:27:09 PM »
Superior, I'm a journalist for a large newspaper and I've just sold my second novel. And I'm so fed up with journalism and disgusted with the publishing business that I won't care if I never sell another book in my lifetime. That's why I'm going to law school. I don't expect the work to be inspiring and it probably won't be a hell of a lot fulfilling, but I do expect and hope it will be interesting and challenging.

I think you becoming a freelance writer would be a fool's errand -- unless you really enjoy starving, being without health insurance, lack of a steady and predictable source of income, and being at the mercy of henpecked editors, etc. All these artistic aspirations you mentioned are just wish fulfillment; people who live in the real world go to an office everyday, slave away, and try to make tons of money -- then they do the fun stuff on the weekends.

Go to law school. You obviously have the LSAT-taking skills to get in.  :-\ Work your tail off for five or six years in BIGLAW, save your money, and then move to some small town in the Midwest or South and write your blockbuster novel. Who knows, you might turn out to be bigger than Grisham -- and he doesn't even really know how to write, but those years as a lawyer sure gave him tons of material.

General Off-Topic Board / Re: Are black people better athletes?
« on: June 10, 2004, 10:23:59 PM »
I'm relatively new here and I try, really, really hard to stay away from these discussions but this one....

I kinda believe in the whole natural selection/survival of the fittest angle. But I think one of the biggest factors behind all of this is economics. As someone who has lived in a low-income neighborhood I can tell you that there are a whole lotta kids who see the NBA or NFL as their only way out of poverty. So, while overprivileged kids are getting violin and French lessons in preschool to bulk up their resumes for the Ivy League, these other kids are playing street ball and that's where a lot of them "get good." Who wants to put their body through that kinda hell for years and years? Someone who doesn't see many other outlets for success that are not fraught with discrimination and an uneven playing field (think higher education.) A lot of the teachers in poor city schools even encourage this by not pushing the kids to focus more on academics and instead they dangle a future of stardom in professional sports. I'm a tall BF and I can't tell you how many people ask me if I played basketball in high school or in college. I didn't and I never wanted to and I don't know if I'd be any good at it cuz I'm awfully uncoordinated. I think if more poor black kids saw the equal opportunities for success in the traditional path of education/job/middle class lifestyle, then I'm willing to bet the demographics in professional sports would be quite different. If more white men were faced with the prospect of facing racism day in and day out for the rest of their lives in a $40,000 a year crappy corporate job they'd try harder to get in the NBA too; if they couldn't play basketball they'd LEARN and they'd teach their kids and their grandkids and sooner or later all white males would be pretty good at basketball.

How many middle-class blacks do you know of who play professional sports besides Grant Hill and a few others? Not many... I don't think it's that blacks are better athletes I think it's a matter of a group of people finding an area where they can be successful (and that offers a pseudo escape from that pesky hardship, racism) and then dominating the heck out of it. Sorta like how upper-class whites are really good at running corporate America and protecting it from others who wanna get in. :) How did they do that? Dunno. They found their niche and got really good at protecting it. If others had equal opportunity at every level to compete with them, there'd be more Asians, Blacks, Hispanics at the upper echelons in corporate America. And why are Asians supposedly so good at engineering and math? Is that natural ability too? Really, I'd like to know the answer.

All of this is JMHO

Interesting discussion. Hope it doesn't turn nasty.

« on: May 31, 2004, 09:20:54 PM »
Hey Skittles, I have no doubt that hotsauce will hold his own at HYS.

My comments above pertained to the person on LSN who SAID he/she got into Harvard with a 3.1/158. Based on those numbers alone I don't think that person will have an easy time competing with the 4.0/175 set. But I don't know that person's entire story either. Who knows? He/she may be a molecular biologist hard at work on a cure for diabetes/cancer/common cold while documenting the dialects of obscure tribes along the Amazon and thus was too busy to study for the LSAT. In that case, I humbly stand corrected.  :-\

« on: May 31, 2004, 03:33:09 PM »
Sentence should have read:

I'm a BF and I wouldn't go to H with that poster's stats (unless I had a secret weapon and some really good reason for that GPA) only because I DO NOT want to be among sharks if I'm not one myself. I attended a very competitive grad school and I felt terrible for the people there who didn't know their stuff because they got killed every day!! Not to mention treated like crap by those resentful, bitter anti-AA zealots. 

« on: May 31, 2004, 03:29:36 PM »
WAIT! So I can go to Harvard too???

Not trying to start anything, but it seems really terrible to let someone in with a 158/3.1, knowing full well that they're gonna be hard up against 4.0/175+ for three grueling years. I think some of the LSN people are big liars. Or if this is true Harvard really doesn't care about these students at all and only wants to maintain its rep as most-diverse Ivy. I'm a BF and I wouldn't go with that poster's stats only because I DO NOT

Yeah, I know LSAT doesn't indicate future succcess in law school. But if you don't have the high LSAT score you should at least have the high GPA. Oh, well.

That said, I think I'n going to apply to Harvard in the fall and see how it turns out. He he he.

My Profile/stats: URM, 3.58 GPA, taking Oct. LSAT (highest practice score so far 160 but I have a tutor now.) 10 years as a journalist at national newspapers, author of one novel, tons of community work.  And Georgetown on my mind.

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