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Messages - yoyodawg

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1
Incoming 1Ls / Re: Small offices of big firms
« on: April 30, 2008, 03:54:35 PM »
I know that concrete data on this is probably impossible to find, but I'm wondering if anybody has ever talked with a partner at a big firm about the likelihood of making partner in a small market office.  I'm talking about the 20 lawyer offices of the 500+ lawyer firms.  I'm sure being in the small office is a disadvantage, but do the associates in these positions have any shot?

Dude, they promote people within that office to partner. They don't make an associate at the "big office headquarters" a partner, and then move that new partner down to the small office. And why is this? Because to make partner, (at least an equity partner), you've got to have a large book of business. If your clients are centered in another city, it doesn't make any sense for them to move someone down to another office where they can't make money for the firm from the clients that they no longer have access to. Its all about economics when it comes to making partner. Its about how much money you make for the firm.

This is the number one thing that pre-law people don't get about biglaw and law firms in general. After a few years its not about where you went to school, or what your class rank was, all that matters for biglaw is "how much money" you are bringing into the firm. Its not about location, or "market rate" or any of this other silly crap. Its about how profitable for the firm you are.

You'll probably have a better chance of making partner at the smaller office because you've got less competition for your clients from within your own firm than at the larger office.

So yes, they have a shot.

2
Choosing the Right Law School / Re: What's the Deal With Valparaiso?
« on: April 30, 2008, 12:35:45 PM »
What's the deal With Valparaiso?  Why is it only a T4?  It's been around for 129 years and hasn't been able to clean up its act?  Has pretty good bar passage rates and employment rate is ok.  Anyone have any real thoughts about this.  Thanks.

I'm not exactly sure. It's probably has something to do with the fact that they're located in Valparaiso, Indiana. Not exactly a metropolis. Further, they also don't play the "game" like other schools. They keep their LSAT and GPA requirements pretty much the same each year, so they're not trying to actively move up in rankings every year through this. Mercer's law school has been around the same amount of time, and they're still just barely Tier 2. University of St. Louis' law school is one of the oldest law school's in America, and they're not very highly ranked in Tier 2 either. It probably has more to do with the rankings game than anything about Valpo itself.

I'd imagine that if you wanted to practice in Indiana you'd be ok coming from there. The top of the class there probably even gets you a decent gig in Chicago. People can be successful coming from there though. Heck, University of Houston's new Dean is an alumni.

3
And what "work" will you be doing? I can't imagine they will let you do anything substantive. So what will you be doing? Working in the file room? Making copies?

Its a bad idea in my opinion to work for either one of these places as a 0L. Take your summer off and enjoy yourself. You won't really be doing yourself any favors by working at either place. Some people may know your name, so you might help yourself out slightly in terms of getting summer employment there later. But you could also get a bad rep there and screw yourself out of summer employment at either place. If you're dead set on wasting your time, I'd work at the place you feel more comfortable with the people.

4
Financial Aid / Re: Graduating with debt
« on: April 25, 2008, 01:35:31 PM »
Looks like 80-100k depending on 2L summer.

Wait, what's so special about 2L summer??

Your best shot at a paying summer job.

Does it really pay all that much more than 1L summer?

If you are interested in "biglaw" large firm work, yes, yes it does, roughly 3K a week.

But it doesn't really matter if you don't save any money. I made a pretty obscene amount of money my 2L summer, yet I didn't save a dime of it. Its been my experience that most people really don't save any of their summer associate money. So its not like it will "help you out" towards your debt like some people have alluded to.

Out of curiosity, are you married or engaged? How old are you? I ask not to make a moral judgement, just that I don't see myself as a 29 year old married man burning through 30K in 13 weeks. Now if I was 24 and single... Must have been a fun summer...  ;D

I'm engaged. With your situation, it would be a lot easier to save. (with a wife in your ear telling you what to do with the money  ;))

That being said, you do have to think about the other expenses rolled into a SA position. Also, not every market is going to pay 3 grand a week. Most markets don't pay this. It can be anywhere from 1200 a week to 3000 a week. You're also going to have to be paying double rents in many cases, and paying for two sets of utilitites unless you sub-let your other apartment/house. Then you tend to go out more, and with more of a disposable income you're going to spend more. Buy more things you wouldn't, and go out more because of the people around you. Its a lot easier to go out during the week when you don't have to worry about studying.

All I'm saying is don't think you'll be saving a lot of money with your summer associate position. You may save some, but it probably won't be enough to make it so you don't have to take out a lot less loans.

And this is all assuming that you're going to get a SA position...they really just don't give them away, and a lot of firms are cutting back on SA classes right now. Bottom line is to not count your chickens before they hatch.

5
Financial Aid / Re: Graduating with debt
« on: April 25, 2008, 09:45:26 AM »
Looks like 80-100k depending on 2L summer.

Wait, what's so special about 2L summer??

Your best shot at a paying summer job.

Does it really pay all that much more than 1L summer?

If you are interested in "biglaw" large firm work, yes, yes it does, roughly 3K a week.

But it doesn't really matter if you don't save any money. I made a pretty obscene amount of money my 2L summer, yet I didn't save a dime of it. Its been my experience that most people really don't save any of their summer associate money. So its not like it will "help you out" towards your debt like some people have alluded to.

6
Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Any comments on these schools?
« on: April 22, 2008, 03:42:19 PM »
Yeah, I've heard FAMU is shaky but with its low tuition cost, it is tempting.  I just received an acceptance letter from FIU, which was T3 last year but got bumped to T4 this year.  Again, their tuition is very low at around $6500 for p/t students.

Valparaiso still intrigues me though.  It's been around for a while and looks to be one of the most respected T4 schools.  I'm just turned-off by their horrendous curve, location and job prospects.

UALR and Loyolar-NO interest me alot because of their rankings, programs and clinics, and good transfer rates if I can do it.

Loyola is a good school. They place very well in New Orleans, and are very respected there. There job placement gets a little iffy outside of New Orleans, but they should still place you throughout La. If they weren't literally across the street from Tulane (their main campus is really right beside Tulane), they would probably be a Tier 2 school.

7
Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Any comments on these schools?
« on: April 22, 2008, 08:52:42 AM »
What's the cost difference in Ark-LR and FAMU? Also, where do you want to work? I imagine both (actually all of your list) will have job options in their areas (and maybe not much elsewhere) and that those jobs will probably pay similarly. (But your research on the schools' numbers may say something different and more accurate...) That means US News tiers probably shouldn't be decisive here; cost and location would be big factors for me.

I can't speak on Ark-LR, but it has to be better than FAMU. FAMU is literally the worst law school in Florida. (and there are 10 of them) It consistently has one of the lowest bar passage rates, and job placement isn't great at all. It does have a new building (but then again, its a new school, so it should have a new building...), but that's all it has for it. The school is still only provisionally acreddited, and this may not even last because of the new ABA rule.

So stay away from FAMU.

8
Incoming 1Ls / Re: Law Students: Which laptop do you recommend????
« on: April 20, 2008, 03:59:21 PM »
MacBook Pro is the norm these days.


Really? I'd say probably only 1 out of 10 people at my law school have a Mac.

Macintosh just wishes it was the norm. In reality, its still far behind the PC.

9
Incoming 1Ls / Re: Law Students: Which laptop do you recommend????
« on: April 20, 2008, 01:33:38 PM »
I found a really good one that I can recommend. Here's a link:

http://inventors.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://oldcomputers.net/osborne.html

10
I don't understand why "super-queer" and "really-really-queer" didn't make the approved list

I knew I left something out... I will let your post serve as a proxy for making an amendment to my approved list.

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