Law School Discussion

I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools

I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools
« on: December 24, 2007, 05:08:37 PM »
I really need some help with my choices. Assume I get into all of them and no scholarships. Ideally, I would like to work in Chicago, although I'm cool with Minneapolis, DC, and Boston (hence the schools listed). I am also very interested in a joint program because I think it is an interesting field, would make me more employable, and opens up the teaching route.

Illinois: good placement in Chicago, could do a joint degree, but I don't like CU so much.

Minnesota: I like the TCs, but I am very worried about being shut out of Chicago options that the other schools open

Wisconsin: I love the building and the school, would have access to a great joint program, but my major concern is placement outside of Wisconsin. Does someone outside of the top 1/3 have no shot at midlaw in Chicago or Minneapolis?

Boston College: It would seem to be on the weaker end for Chicago employment and I've heard negative things about its placement even on the East Coast.

American: I'd rather not attend, but it'd be a good link to the DC market if GW doesn't pan out. I'd be pretty much locked into DC and couldn't even get a joint program out of the deal.

Loyola: I like the downtown location, couldn't do the joint program, and it's the lowest ranked of the bunch. Even in Chicago, the "lowest ranked" (Wisconsin) still fares better from what I am told.

What do you think? How different are the employment prospects between Illinois-Minnesota-Wisconsin? That upper-midwest sure has a lot of nont14 but exceptionally strong regional schools! These are my choices if I am shut out of some higher ranked schools, but I am willing to attend any of the above.

I appreciate the help.

rsr28

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Re: I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools
« Reply #1 on: December 24, 2007, 06:02:19 PM »
Iowa is probably closer to a national school than any of those you listed (perhaps with the exception of BC).  Illinois probably has the best prospects in Chicago itself.  Minnesota will do great in the (limited) market of the Twin Cities because there is no competition and it is a decent legal market.

Loyola is fourth fiddle to UChicago, NW, and Illinois.  American is fourth fiddle in a smaller market to UVA, GULC, GW.  Going to a school with that much local competition is very risky.

That is why many people might choose Minnesota or Wisconsin out of this list -- their home markets aren't huge, but they face absolutely no competition there.  Iowa doesn't have a market at all, so it falls in behind NW and around UIUC in the Chicago market.  However, it would give you the best chance out of the schools on that list of getting NYC (except for BC).  BC won't do much for you in Chicago.

Re: I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools
« Reply #2 on: December 24, 2007, 06:34:01 PM »
Thanks for the reply. I am surprised to hear the ringing endorsement of Iowa. I looked at their stats, have spoken to a few recruiters, and read through Vault, and Iowa was never given too much discussion. You mentioned that it would give me a shot at NYC, but due to the COL there, NYC isn't really on my list...

The way I am seeing this Chicago market -- obviously something I'd love to hear about from some Chicago/Midwest-area people -- is like this:

NU/Chicago/Michigan
UIUC/ND/WUSTL
Wisconsin/MN/Iowa
Indiana/other chicago schools

Although, I think more % of the class from Wisconsin goes to Chicago than WUSTL and Wisconsin/MN numbers may be thrown off when comparing it to Illinois because so many stay in Minneapolis or Wisconsin.

rsr28

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Re: I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools
« Reply #3 on: December 24, 2007, 06:38:36 PM »
Thanks for the reply. I am surprised to hear the ringing endorsement of Iowa. I looked at their stats, have spoken to a few recruiters, and read through Vault, and Iowa was never given too much discussion. You mentioned that it would give me a shot at NYC, but due to the COL there, NYC isn't really on my list...

The way I am seeing this Chicago market -- obviously something I'd love to hear about from some Chicago/Midwest-area people -- is like this:

NU/Chicago/Michigan
UIUC/ND/WUSTL
Wisconsin/MN/Iowa
Indiana/other chicago schools

Although, I think more % of the class from Wisconsin goes to Chicago than WUSTL and Wisconsin/MN numbers may be thrown off when comparing it to Illinois because so many stay in Minneapolis or Wisconsin.

If you do get a firm job in NYC, COL shouldn't really be an issue.

Re: I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools
« Reply #4 on: December 24, 2007, 07:00:18 PM »
I'd rather have 140K in Chicago than 160K in NYC. But I was writing in some serious shorthand. QOL issues and a general desire to be in Chicago influence the selection of schools and lack of NYC interest.

Btw, nice job (saw the LSN link).

Any UIUC, UMN, and Wisco students/alum hanging around the boards would be particularly helpful here. Especially to provide some class rank numbers. I hear generally top 1/3 @ UIUC is key for Chicago biglaw but top half can pull down midlaw. Harder to find this information on UMN and Wisco.

Re: I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools
« Reply #5 on: December 24, 2007, 07:11:50 PM »
Hey! Really helpful reply. Thank you. As for ND, I have applied, but don't consider it as safe of a school (these choices listed were if everything else fails) but I really don't like South Bend. And I'm Jewish, so maybe I'm slightly biased.

One thing I really like about Wisco is that strength in Milwaukee if I need a backup should Chicago not work out. At UIUC, I'd be forced into Chicago or bust. Any sort of class rank speculation for biglaw/midlaw in Chicago from UIUC vs Wisconsin? I've heard generally 1/3 at UIUC and 1/4 at Wisconsin for biglaw while top half at UIUC and top 1/3-40% at Wisconsin for midlaw. Very difficult to find that Wisconsin information on the internet, imho. I'm worried that turning down UIUC or UMN for Wisconsin, because of its rank, could be an error in judgement.

Once again, thanks for the help.

Re: I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools
« Reply #6 on: December 24, 2007, 09:16:02 PM »
I'm interested in this topic too.  I have serious ties to Milwaukee and Minneapolis but I also like Chicago.

Cutoff-wise, how do the big Milwaukee and Minneapolis firms treat Wisconsin, Illinois, Minnesota, Iowa, Indiana and WUSTL?  I assume, given local ties, all of these would be treated about the same.  I once heard anecdotally that Minnesota is worse for Minneapolis than some of these others since everyone near the top of Minnesota's class wants the same few jobs.

Re: I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools
« Reply #7 on: December 25, 2007, 10:10:10 AM »
If you're looking for Milwaukee or Minneapolis, you've got to think that Minnesota and Wisconsin are the obvious choices. I really doubt Indiana, Iowa, Illinois, etc have the alumni connections.

Re: I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools
« Reply #8 on: December 25, 2007, 11:25:27 AM »
It all depends on where you want to end up.  Iowa kind of scatters your chips. 

El_Che

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Re: I really need some help with these t15-40 midwest schools
« Reply #9 on: December 25, 2007, 03:42:57 PM »
Is Kent any better than Loyola in this discussion?