Law School Discussion

ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools

Re: ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools
« Reply #10 on: December 23, 2007, 09:51:56 PM »
I've always thought of Biglaw as 250+ attorneys, not just per branch, but overall.

law123

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Re: ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools
« Reply #11 on: December 23, 2007, 09:55:04 PM »
If you considered Biglaw to be only firms that pay $160K you would be excluding from Biglaw every law firm in the city of Philadelphia

botbot

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Re: ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools
« Reply #12 on: December 23, 2007, 10:03:09 PM »
I would consider "biglaw" as a firm that pays at or near what the biggest firms in its market pays.  This is $160K for the biggest cities but can be much lower for smaller cities.

I realize it's impossible to create an exact standard, but it's probably possible to create guidelines for each market and school.

As far as Tulane, that's much more generous than I've heard from someone I know who was at Tulane.  He was in the top half and makes around $60K in insurance defense in a secondary Southern city.  He says top 10% had access to NYC, top 20% had access to NOLA (whatever is left of that market anyway) and good luck going anywhere else (like Texas) unless you had serious ties.

He was median pwned.  (maybe in denial about it and venting?)

Most that go to NYC, Houston, Dallas, NOLA, etc all have some connections to the city.  I personally know two Houston BIGLAW firms that will interview top 45% at Tulane.  (PM if you want firm names and attend Tulane).  I have friends that were top 15% and could not get BIGLAW (and whine about it constantly) - and other friends who got BIGLAW with minimal effort at 35%.

The NOLA market is screwy, but as a quick anecdotal note - there is one 3L here in bottom third who got NOLA with no connections to the city other than attending school.  She busted her ass to get the job.

botbot

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Re: ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools
« Reply #13 on: December 23, 2007, 10:14:38 PM »
How did she bust it?  That sounds rather difficult.

From what I understand (which is honestly second hand) she hit up all the firms, attended any function that would get her some facetime, used alumni connections at each firm (which are obviously pretty substantial), eventually got an interview, and nailed the interview. 

(I won't comment on her attractiveness other than to say - it likely did not help her find the job)

(the real wallace stevens would know about busting ass)

Re: ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools
« Reply #14 on: December 23, 2007, 10:15:10 PM »
Haha sometimes you wonder exactly what people do with their asses to get jobs.

I'm not at Tulane but I'll consider it if they give me money.  I'm just trying to construct a list of schools to target and Tulane is among them.  And plus, like I said, a buddy of mine went there.

My trouble with Tulane or any other southern school is I'm a midwesterner.  I have no ties to anywhere in the south really.  And southern markets, especially Texas, seem to be the most provincial.

Re: ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools
« Reply #15 on: December 23, 2007, 10:32:50 PM »
What about Cooley?

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Re: ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools
« Reply #16 on: December 28, 2007, 11:21:57 AM »
As suggested, I will attempt to help give some rough estimates on %s...

Just remember, none of this is set in stone or 100% accurate.  Self selection, personal connections, and a myriad of other factors make these numbers nothing more than an educated guess based primarily on CDO surveys.  So here goes.

The following numbers are the required class rank to have ~75% chance at BIGLAW.  BIGLAW is defined loosely as firms that pay $110k+.  (I am aware that this will include smaller firms that pay market, and if you care about prestige within BIGLAW - please refer to V100/Ciolli.)

15 University of California–Los Angeles - 51%
                                                       
16 University of Southern California (Gould) - 52% (maybe 55% now)
                                                       
16 Vanderbilt University (TN) - 48%
                                                       
18 University of Texas–Austin - 49%
                                                       
19 Washington University in St. Louis - 39%
                                                       
20 Boston University - 39%
                                                       
20 University of Minnesota–Twin Cities - 31% (data is one year behind other data)
                                                       
22 Emory University (GA) - 33%
                                                       
22 George Washington University (DC) - 38%
                                                       
24 University of Iowa - 27%
                                                       
25 Fordham University (NY) - 34%
                                                       
25 University of Illinois–Urbana-Champaign - 26%
                                                       
25 Washington and Lee University (VA) - 24%
                                                       
28 Boston College - 36%
                                                       
28 University of Notre Dame (IN) - 35%
                                                       
28 University of Washington - 24%
                                                       
31 College of William and Mary (Marshall-Wythe) (VA) - 31%
                                                       
31 Ohio State University (Moritz) - 22%
                                                       
31 University of Wisconsin–Madison - 23%
                                                       
34 George Mason University (VA) - 29%
                                                       
34 University of California–Davis - 32%
                                                       
36 Indiana University–Bloomington - 26%
                                                       
36 University of Alabama - 19%
                                                       
36 University of California (Hastings) - 31%
                                                       
36 University of Colorado–Boulder - 21%
                                                       
36 University of Georgia - 24%
                                                       
36 University of Maryland - 20%
                                                       
36 University of North Carolina–Chapel Hill - 24%
                                                       
36 Wake Forest University (NC) - 22%
                                                       
44 Brigham Young University (Clark) (UT) - 22%
                                                       
44 University of Arizona (Rogers) - 20%
                                                       
46 Southern Methodist University (TX) - 34%
                                                       
47 American University (Washington) (DC) - 18%
                                                       
47 Tulane University (LA) - 30%
                                                       
47 University of Connecticut - 22%
                                                       
47 University of Florida (Levin) - 21%

This is compiled using data from CDO sheets.  Unless noted it is the most recent they had available.  I copy/pasted from my Excel sheet, if something is way off - its probably just a transfer issue.  I will not give the formula, specific data, or much more than what is above.  (the reasons were discussed in the law school slacker thread)

The percentages are rounded to the nearest whole percent, so some may be slightly worse or better than they appear.

                                                       

Re: ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools
« Reply #17 on: December 28, 2007, 01:38:15 PM »
BotBot, do you have numbers for the T14 following the same formula? I can see, in my case, having to decide between Cornell and Vandy/USC/etc...and I'm risk adverse.

HippieLawChick

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Re: ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools
« Reply #18 on: December 28, 2007, 01:45:11 PM »
yawn....biglaw, biglaw, biglaw. 

Hilarious that so much time is spent discussing something that only a small portion of all lawyers ever do and an even smaller portion stay in. 

Once you all are out there for real, you will see that most people who take these "biglaw" jobs don't GET to stay in them for long (if you aren't partner track after 5 years you are fired) or don't WANT to stay in them (you are treated like a law student/kid for the first 7 years and work like a dog for low quality of life). 

Why not discuss medium sized firms, or small ones, or any of the millions of career options that this degree with get you?  The profession is so much more than this, and it pains me to see you kids making all these assumptions and conjecture about something you will probably never experience.

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Re: ITT you discuss biglaw cutoffs at some mid-T1 schools
« Reply #19 on: December 28, 2007, 01:51:29 PM »
Umm... I am one of the biggest opponents of BIGLAW work