Law School Discussion

Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions

dubsy

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Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions
« on: November 27, 2007, 12:42:41 PM »
How do you approach these? I find them just as, if not more, time consuming than parallel method questions, especially if there are a ton of conditionals to keep track of. Do you evaluate one by one, answer choices A through E by comparing them to the structure in the stimulus?  Do you write out what you know and then skim the answer choices seeing if any of them match?  Any recommendations on how to efficiently tackle these?  Below are two examples below that I got right on the Dec '06, but wish I knew how I could have spent less time on them so that I could have more time checking over other answers. If you are particularly efficient/good at these, please try one or both of these out and tell me what your thought process is as you read the stimulus and what you do to go about finding the correct AC.

Dec '06, Section 1, 21

Designer: Any garden and adjoining living room that are separated from one another by sliding glass doors can visually merge into a single space. If the sliding doors are open, as may happen in summer, this effect will be created if it does not already exist and intensified if it does.  The effect remains quite strong during colder months if the garden is well coordinated with teh room and contributes strong visual interest of its own.

The designer's statements, if true, most strongly support which one of the following?
(A) a garden separated from an adjoining living room by closed sliding glass doors cannot be well coordinated with the room unless the garden contributes strong visual interest
(B) In cold weather, a garden and an adjoining living room separated from one another by sliding glass doors will not visually merge into a single space unless the garden is well coordinated with the room
(C) A garden and an adjoining living room separated by sliding glass doors cannot visually merge in summer unless the doors are open
(D) A garden can visually merge with an adjoining living room into a single space even if the garden does not contribute strong visual interest of its own
(E) Except in summer, opening the sliding glass doors that separate a garden from an adjoining living room does not intensify the effect of the garden and room visually merging into a single space


December 2006, Section 3, 21
Most opera singers who add demanding roles to their repertoires at a young age lose their vocies early. It has been said that this is because their voices have not yet matured and hence lack the power for such roles. But young singers with great vocal powere are the most likely to ruin their voices. The real problem is that most young singers lack the technical training necessary to avoid straining their vocal cords - especially when using their full vocal strength. Such misuse of the cords inevitably leads to a truncated singing career.

Which one of the following does the information above most strongly support?
(A) Young opera singers without great vocal power are unlikely to ruin their voices by singing demanding roles
(B) Some young opera singers ruin their voices while singing demanding roles because their vocal cords have not yet matured
(C) Only opera singers with many years of technical training should try to sing demanding roles
(D) Only mature opera singers can sing demanding roles without undue strain on their vocal cords
(E) Most young opera singers who sing demanding roles strain their vocal cors

WHEW, my fingers are officially cramped. Anyway, if you can help me out on tackling these in any way, that'd be awesome, thanks!

Marko

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Re: Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions
« Reply #1 on: November 27, 2007, 12:51:37 PM »
what i do is draw a line around or through the stimulus wherever a separate statement is made. this helps me divide up the question so that when i go back i know around where to look. then i try to see if there is something that can be connected. then i move on. i will usually konw it's a must be true question ebcause it's a statement of facts with a lot of formal logic language. i also ignore statements that say things like "many of these are that" or any other wishy washy statements like that that seem to have been put there to distract

dubsy

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Re: Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions
« Reply #2 on: November 27, 2007, 01:56:01 PM »
good idea marko, i'm going to have to try that out. i think i do this really inefficiently - i find myself re-writing the stimulus out in symbols...is that a complete waste of time?

dubsy

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Re: Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions
« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2007, 05:43:11 PM »
no one wants to take a plunge into conditionals tonight?...

luke

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Re: Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2007, 05:59:05 PM »
Dec '06, Section 1, 21

(D) A garden can visually merge with an adjoining living room into a single space even if the garden does not contribute strong visual interest of its own

because 1st sentence = "Any garden and adjoining living room that are separated from one another by sliding glass doors can visually merge into a single space."


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3, 21

(E) "Most young opera singers who sing demanding roles strain their vocal chords"

what do we know?

1. most
2. young
3. demanding/full vocal strength roles
4. strain chords

we don't know why -- whether it's due to physical immaturity or lack ot technique.

but 1-4 are enough to give us E

dubsy

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Re: Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions
« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2007, 07:04:55 PM »
Hey, thanks for responding Luke. I'm fine with why the right answer choices are right, but it just takes me a lot longer on these to figure them out.  How did you go about doing this?  You seem to be a pro at these so you probably simply read the stimulus and already know what to look for... but do you have any suggestions for how to anticipate the right answer in these lengthy, conditional-based must be true stimuli? Are there certain ACs to avoid? Certain types of ACs to look for?  I tend to get lost while reading the ACs and forget what I am looking for so I waste a lot of time looking back and forth between the ACs and the stimulus... your thoughts?

lisak

Re: Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions
« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2007, 08:23:02 PM »
I tend to use process of elimination to pair it down to *hopefully* a couple of choices.  Then, I look back at the answer choice and compare it against the passage to see which seems more right.  If that still does not work, then I do the symbolic / formal logic approach.

I used to do the symbolic logic approach to these formal logic questions ad nauseum, but I saw that it was eating up too much time and not necessarily always getting me the right answer so I have more recently been looking at the passages and comparing them against the answer choices to see if the answer choices have to be right.  In these must be true questions, if there is one part that does not have to be true, then the whole answer does not have to be true (and that means it is the wrong answer).

For example, in the first question (Dec 06, Sec 1, 21), this is how I approach it:

A - can be eliminated because the passage says "if the garden is well coordinated with the room and contributes strong visual interest of its own." whereas the answer choice confuses the concepts and says "cannot be well coordinated with the room unless the garden contributes strong visual interest"
B - can be eliminated because it says that in winter "will not visually merge into a single space unless the garden is well coordinated with the room" but this is more because the door would be closed than the season...also, it does not mention the "strong visual interest" which is a requirement along with coordination with the room for the closed-door winter scenario
C - can be eliminated for similar reasons as B...it is not the season (summer in this case) but rather that the doors are open...so I don't think there is any reason that what would typically happen in winter could not happen in summer...that is if the garden is well coordinated with the room and creates a strong visual interest then it should be a single space
D - The correct answer for the reason Luke mentioned
E - can be eliminated because it tries to say that only in summer can opening the sliding glass doors that separate a garden from an adjoining living room not intensify the effect of the garden and room visually merging into a single space...the stimulus says "this effect will be created if it does not already exist and intensified if it does"...again, it confuses the intensification element

For the second question (Dec 06, 3, 21), my process is similar:
A - can be eliminated because it says that, "Young opera singers without great vocal power are unlikely to ruin their voices by singing demanding roles"...unlikely is an overstatement...it is just that those with vocal power are most likely too...that is different
B - can be eliminated because this is basically what the author is saying does not necessarily occur...this is what "it has been said" occurs that the author is countering
C - can be eliminated because while the answer choice says many years of technical training, the stimulus does not specify a time frame (only that they should have technical training to make sure they do not overstrain their vocal chords)
D - can be eliminated because there is no mention that only mature singers can sing without straining...rather, it goes back to proper training
E - The correct answer for the reason Luke stated (also, it is pretty much the author's conclusion (unstated but strongly pointing to) too).

Anyway, I hope this helps.  This is the approach that I have started to use.  For the most part, it has helped a decent amount...it has brought my time down (though this first question was a bit tricky and took me about 4 minutes to figure out...of course, I was also looking at the computer rather than hardcopy for it, which might have slowed me down a bit, and the second question only took me about 1 minute).  This approach has also increased my accuracy (I miss about 1-4 per LR section now whereas before I used to miss a lot more).

Good luck to everyone on the Saturday LSAT!  I will be there taking it along with you all!

 :D

luke

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Re: Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions
« Reply #7 on: November 28, 2007, 06:54:01 AM »
How did you go about doing this? 

well, i read the first of these as a little logic game -- a number of rules that will then lead to a what can be true or what can't be true stem.  in these, as in every wordy question, organization is important, so, as i was reading, i was classifying the 'rules" into 3 categories: "always", "summer", & "winter".  from there, i'd have looked at the answer choices by each category in turn.  as it happens, the "always" category corresponded to E, so i stopped there.

---

as for the second Q, i saw two theories as to why a thing happens to the same group of people doing the same thing, so i was expecting a 'point of disagreement' stem. (in my mind, i had been classifying things on which they agree and things about which they disagree -- into two columns, if you will).   but it turned out to be the inverse of that -- a points of agreement stem, instead -- and since i'd already done the sorting, it was pretty straightforward to find the right answer from there.

my approach works for me because i'm bone lazy.  i don't like to read more than i have to so i approach LR in such a way as to (1) not have to read the stim more than once, and (2) enable me to immediately reach for the correct answer.

dubsy

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Re: Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions
« Reply #8 on: November 28, 2007, 06:58:22 AM »
well, i read the first of these as a little logic game

Great approach, this looks so much simpler to me now that I see it in terms of little categories.  Luke, can I be you for a day? Preferably this Saturday?

luke

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Re: Extremely wordy, conditionalicious Must be True questions
« Reply #9 on: November 28, 2007, 07:12:01 AM »
i have a feeling you'll do very well as hdubs  ;)

just remember to be confident, to break the stimulus down into its component parts, and it'll all seem pretty straightforward to you.  :)