Law School Discussion

AA: More harm than good?

Matthew

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AA: More harm than good?
« on: August 26, 2007, 10:55:45 PM »
I found this article interesting:

http://opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110010522

I don't know how sound the research is, but I've never thought Berkeley was doing anyone a favor by admitting someone with an 880 SAT.  As flawed as the test may be, it seems to me that an inability to attain an average score would be indicative of an inability to perform in a top school  I think the same of law schools.

Any thoughtful criticism or thoghts on this?

Re: AA: More harm than good?
« Reply #1 on: August 27, 2007, 08:58:21 AM »
Just look at the entire country of South Africa if you want to see how stupidly retarded and outright racist AA is.

PNym

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Re: AA: More harm than good?
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2007, 09:36:06 AM »
I heard that the UC system's rate of Black graduation skyrocketed a few years after it abolished affirmative action. When underqualified Blacks stopped enrolling at Berkeley and UCLA, but began enrolling at lower-tiered schools, they began to be able to keep up with the pace of coursework.

Of course, the qualified Blacks were still able to both enroll and graduate at Berkeley and UCLA.

PNym

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Re: AA: More harm than good?
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2007, 09:58:23 PM »
NOTE: I erred in composing my original post The sentence of error should read "When underqualified Blacks stopped enrolling at Berkeley and UCLA, but began enrolling at lower-tiered schools..."

Fixed.

Re: AA: More harm than good?
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2007, 11:55:58 PM »
The worst part about AA is that as a minority you can NEVER feel that you truly earned your accomplishments.  This application cycle I was constantly thinking about whether or not I truly deserved to get that screening interview, to get invited for a callback, and to receive an offer.  I'm always wondering if the firms gave me all these opportunities to fill a quota or to look PC for their clients. 

Another bad feeling is that others won't ever give you full credit for your accomplishments.  "Ah that f-ing kid got his interview/job because of AA."  That statement might sound ignorant but let's be perfectly honest here, I can't be 100% sure that I got to where i'm at solely because of my talents and hard-work... I think my credentials are quite good but it's annoying that a lot of ppl may look at me and not think about my qualifications but wonder which quota i'll be filling. 

However, before we jump on the "AA is unfair" bandwagon i'm seeing TONS of law students (whites and minorities) getting all kinds of interviews and offers that they don't deserve solely because their mommies and daddies know the right people. 

wow i'm watching american beauty right now and the dude just got shot in the back of the head... whoa this movie is crazy...

Re: AA: More harm than good?
« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2007, 10:41:45 AM »
I just posted about this same article.

http://www.lawschooldiscussion.org/prelaw/index.php/topic,64541.msg2399924.html#msg2399924

A University of Michigan professor found the same sort of statistics at Michigan.

Re: AA: More harm than good?
« Reply #6 on: September 04, 2007, 06:39:57 AM »
That's really sad.  We need more minorities in the law profession.  I could check the URM box myself - I'm half Mexican, but I think I got the LSAT score I deserve, and will attend a school where I can excel.  It's sad that minorities who check that box end up dropping out because they can't keep up.  If the differnce is getting into law school or not, I can see why they do it, but if you get a 165 on your LSAT, HYS are going to chew you up and spit you out. 

UNAS

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Re: AA: More harm than good?
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2007, 08:27:12 AM »
That's really sad.  We need more minorities in the law profession.  I could check the URM box myself - I'm half Mexican, but I think I got the LSAT score I deserve, and will attend a school where I can excel.  It's sad that minorities who check that box end up dropping out because they can't keep up.  If the differnce is getting into law school or not, I can see why they do it, but if you get a 165 on your LSAT, HYS are going to chew you up and spit you out. 

You should revisit this comment. Across the board attrition rates for top schools (i.e. T6-T10)schools are less then 1%. Top school have indicated that most people that drop out almost always do so for non-academic reasons. Just figured I would dispel that myth before it spiraled out of control

Will URMs with a less than median LSATs have to work a lil harder? Maybe/maybe not. But to say they will get chewed up and spit out is a complete and total falsehood. Particularly if you base it on the nations leading law schools' attrition numbers.

Re: AA: More harm than good?
« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2007, 03:59:05 AM »
 ???

No comment on AA but interested in ColdBlue's comment. Why is AA in South Africa retarded and racist? Spent a year studying South Africa at university and very interested in his response...

OperaAttorney

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Re: AA: More harm than good?
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2007, 09:25:43 AM »
The worst part about AA is that as a minority you can NEVER feel that you truly earned your accomplishments.  This application cycle I was constantly thinking about whether or not I truly deserved to get that screening interview, to get invited for a callback, and to receive an offer.  I'm always wondering if the firms gave me all these opportunities to fill a quota or to look PC for their clients.

My experience is quite pleasant. Despite my status as a minority, I NEVER discount the validity of my accomplishments.  Yes, AA exists--thank God!--but I also know I get A's at the end of each academic term due to my God-given intelligence and diligent work ethic, not AA.  When I apply to law school next year, I intend to put my best into each application. The law school admissions process is competitive, and I can't depend on my URM status to get me anywhere. I do know, however, that I can depend on EVERYTHING about me.

Another bad feeling is that others won't ever give you full credit for your accomplishments.  "Ah that f-ing kid got his interview/job because of AA."  That statement might sound ignorant but let's be perfectly honest here, I can't be 100% sure that I got to where i'm at solely because of my talents and hard-work... I think my credentials are quite good but it's annoying that a lot of ppl may look at me and not think about my qualifications but wonder which quota i'll be filling.

First, this ridiculous notion existed in the minds of our nation's majority long before AA even reared its head. Blacks have always struggled to receive proper recognition in this country.  My father, an African immigrant, received "partial" credit for his accomplishments while attending college, medical school, and graduate school in this country. Louis Latimer and Vivien Thomas, two of our nation's greatest black scientists, made innovative discoveries, but failed to receive proper recognition for their efforts due to overt racism, which was prevalent at the time. (And in Latimer's case, I believe his superiors appropriated his ideas without his approval.)

Second, it's all about who you know these days, not what you know. Do you think any one of us could walk into Harpo Studios, submit a résumé, and get a job? Probably not. But I bet the candidate who knows somebody (who knows somebody else) would fare better.

On a side note: why should I care if people who don't know me think I got to where I am because of AA?  I frequently outperform most students (including the white students) in my classes.  In my opinion, we have this problem because people refuse to mind their business.

Here's the bottom line: they're always going to say you're not good enough.  If it's not AA, then they'll use something else.  My advice? Ignore the naysayers and shut them up with your stellar performance.