law student, just got done with 1L, taking questions

[bros]

there is a HUGE f-ing difference between a gunner and a good student. wait until you guys go through your first year. law school is more competitive than you think. if you want to just cruise through LS and bank your future on the fact that someone on LSD says that most really successful lawyers werent at the top of their class, go for it. Enjoy your B minuses. Have fun at OCI.

I'm already done my 1L and I still disagree with what you have to say.

As far as having fun at OCI, I will! Thanks!

  you DO go to penn, so im sure OCI will be pretty fun for you. and what part of what i'm saying do you disagree with?

[Towelie]

there is a HUGE f-ing difference between a gunner and a good student. wait until you guys go through your first year. law school is more competitive than you think. if you want to just cruise through LS and bank your future on the fact that someone on LSD says that most really successful lawyers werent at the top of their class, go for it. Enjoy your B minuses. Have fun at OCI.

I'm already done my 1L and I still disagree with what you have to say.

As far as having fun at OCI, I will! Thanks!

  you DO go to penn, so im sure OCI will be pretty fun for you. and what part of what i'm saying do you disagree with?

Law school was less competitive than I ever would have imagined - so I disagree with that comment for starters.

I just disagree that you need to be out to be number 1. This would be true at plenty of schools but it does extend past over HYS as you have admitted but did say at first.

[thelawfool]

towelie, lets state the obvious.  you go to penn.  thus, there isn't much competition for jobs because likely everyone in the top 75% will have a job when they graduate.  this is the benefit of going to a school like penn.  therefore you didn't have a very competitive experience in law school and you disagree with everyone in the world saying that law school is competitive.  law school is competitive.  end of story.

in the world outside of top 10, knowing more than the next guy is pretty important.  since bros never once said that you had to lie, cheat and steal to know more than the next guy, i would say that bros is giving pretty good advice...

[bros]

there is a HUGE f-ing difference between a gunner and a good student. wait until you guys go through your first year. law school is more competitive than you think. if you want to just cruise through LS and bank your future on the fact that someone on LSD says that most really successful lawyers werent at the top of their class, go for it. Enjoy your B minuses. Have fun at OCI.

I'm already done my 1L and I still disagree with what you have to say.

As far as having fun at OCI, I will! Thanks!

  you DO go to penn, so im sure OCI will be pretty fun for you. and what part of what i'm saying do you disagree with?

Law school was less competitive than I ever would have imagined - so I disagree with that comment for starters.

I just disagree that you need to be out to be number 1. This would be true at plenty of schools but it does extend past over HYS as you have admitted but did say at first.

wouldnt you say there is still a very present competitive element? i only know my own experience, of course, but i assume that at a school like penn, which is made up of a collection of undoubtedly smart, driven, ambitious individuals, competition would be an unavoidable byproduct of that environment.

law school was far more competitive than i thought it would be (perhaps its just my section?), especially since my school was touted as markedly non-competitive when i was applying/visiting.

[bros]

towelie, lets state the obvious.  you go to penn.  thus, there isn't much competition for jobs because likely everyone in the top 75% will have a job when they graduate.  this is the benefit of going to a school like penn.  therefore you didn't have a very competitive experience in law school and you disagree with everyone in the world saying that law school is competitive.  law school is competitive.  end of story.

in the world outside of top 10, knowing more than the next guy is pretty important.  since bros never once said that you had to lie, cheat and steal to know more than the next guy, i would say that bros is giving pretty good advice...

thank you. you get what i am saying. this advice is not aimed at t14 students, it's aimed at everyone else who goes to a school like mine. it's going to be a different story at any school where the name on your diploma alone all but guarantees you at least a decent job.

[Towelie]

towelie, lets state the obvious.  you go to penn.  thus, there isn't much competition for jobs because likely everyone in the top 75% will have a job when they graduate.  this is the benefit of going to a school like penn.  therefore you didn't have a very competitive experience in law school and you disagree with everyone in the world saying that law school is competitive.  law school is competitive.  end of story.

in the world outside of top 10, knowing more than the next guy is pretty important.  since bros never once said that you had to lie, cheat and steal to know more than the next guy, i would say that bros is giving pretty good advice...

That is a valid point, which is why I was disagree with bros in the first place because he said HYS. I know someone at the bottom of the class 1L year who managed a V50 NYC firm offer for his first summer. So, in reality, even outside of HYS, a bottom student at a top school will still get BIGLAW, even in their 1L year possibly. That was a major point I disagreed on.

I don't disagree with everyone in the world that law school is competitive - I know it can be and is and very many institutions. OP just made it out like it was HYS or competition, which is crap.

[flyaway]

bros, a huge number (I would guess well over the majority) of posters here are going or will be going to T14s.  So, that's probably why the generalizations you gave were reacted to strongly.

[Lucero]

The reality is that everyone is going to know the material "well" going into a law school exame relative to your undergrad days since nearly everyone attends a vast majority of classes and keeps up with the reading. What is going to distinguish you from everyone else (and thus getting you a top grade on a forced curve) is knowing all of the subtlties and exceptions which will be found in the typical issue spotter exam and being able to apply them within rigid time constraints. This equation doesn't have to involve your classmates at all since the competition should be internal as you push yourself to learn everything to the greatest extent possible. Yes, there is a lot of pressure and stress to learn a huge amount of material. Yes, you are graded relative to your classmates. Yes, you may see your classmates busting their asses in the library which can motivate you to keep studying longer and harder than you thought you could, but that's the only competition I experienced during 1L. From the perspective of a now 3L, you don't want to be the guy/girl who is defined by their grades. What bros is saying is true to a large extent, but I think the emphasis is a bit skewed. No one is denying grades are hugely important in getting a job, which is obviously the end goal for everyone. Bottom line: This is a competition with yourself - law school is a much more tolerable place when the students aren't concerned with "beating" everyone else.

[bros]

any other ?s   ?

ask anything at all.

[fowles]

any other ?s   ?

ask anything at all.

How'd the summer job search go?  Have much time for this between classes/studying? (apologies if you covered this elsewhere)