New York Law School??

[sahrunner86]

i see.. i never heard of the "document checker" way of hiring people in a firm but not really..

what about competition in government or non profit employment? Such as government regulatory agencie or district attornys offices? those are areas you might get more time actually practicing, but with a probably third less salary.. any opinions there?

i still get the point of the matter...nyls definently a last choice for nyc - but still a viable option.

No, you don't get it. It isn't a "viable option" for the goals of most people. It isn't a good school, it is incredibly expensive, and the job prospects are terrible unless you already have connections before you go to school, which helps to skew their job placement ratings to make them appear better then it seems. It is a viable option if your goals are extremely, extremely modest (i.e. insurance defense or document review).

Your GPA is low, but not terrible. Try really hard to get it to a 3.0, and score a high 150s/low 160s on the LSAT. That will open up viable options. University of Miami is a more viable option for New York City firm jobs than NYLS (thanks to the Miami-New York connection), and a 3.0/160 can get you in, possibly with some merit money.

For the love of god, listen to this quoted reply.  NYLS is NOT a viable option...getting a job in NYC period is near impossible from this school.  Even seton hall and Rutgers offers better NYC opportunity overall than NYLS simply because they are superior schools.

Someone here made a perfect hierarchical flow explaining how competitive NYC is how NYLS is at the bottom of the list.

That point has already been established...yet we did forget that even CUNY is below nyls.

[keelee]

i see.. i never heard of the "document checker" way of hiring people in a firm but not really..

what about competition in government or non profit employment? Such as government regulatory agencie or district attornys offices? those are areas you might get more time actually practicing, but with a probably third less salary.. any opinions there?

i still get the point of the matter...nyls definently a last choice for nyc - but still a viable option.

No, you don't get it. It isn't a "viable option" for the goals of most people. It isn't a good school, it is incredibly expensive, and the job prospects are terrible unless you already have connections before you go to school, which helps to skew their job placement ratings to make them appear better then it seems. It is a viable option if your goals are extremely, extremely modest (i.e. insurance defense or document review).

Your GPA is low, but not terrible. Try really hard to get it to a 3.0, and score a high 150s/low 160s on the LSAT. That will open up viable options. University of Miami is a more viable option for New York City firm jobs than NYLS (thanks to the Miami-New York connection), and a 3.0/160 can get you in, possibly with some merit money.

For the love of god, listen to this quoted reply.  NYLS is NOT a viable option...getting a job in NYC period is near impossible from this school.  Even seton hall and Rutgers offers better NYC opportunity overall than NYLS simply because they are superior schools.

Someone here made a perfect hierarchical flow explaining how competitive NYC is how NYLS is at the bottom of the list.

That point has already been established...yet we did forget that even CUNY is below nyls.

Eh...one's T3 the other is T4. The differnces really aren't significant. Besides, I would think someone would think more highly of someone at CUNY...they didn't just blow $120,000 at NYLS.

Given that NYLS is $38k a year and CUNY is $10k (in-state), CUNY is the logical choice.

[sahrunner86]

im not even looking at cuny.

[cheeseman]

Which is a better school (in terms of jobs after graduation and campus life)... Brooklyn Law School or NYLS?

Oh my goodness: this question is like asking, "Who is richer you think?  Bill Gates or the guy who works at the Burger King by us?"
If you are this clueless about law school admissions, schools, I think you should start reading more and perhaps, forget about law school all together.
This isn't even a comparison.

i see.. i never heard of the "document checker" way of hiring people in a firm but not really..
what about competition in government or non profit employment? Such as government regulatory agencie or district attornys offices? those are areas you might get more time actually practicing, but with a probably third less salary.. any opinions there?
i still get the point of the matter...nyls definently a last choice for nyc - but still a viable option.

No, you don't get it. It isn't a "viable option" for the goals of most people. It isn't a good school, it is incredibly expensive, and the job prospects are terrible unless you already have connections before you go to school, which helps to skew their job placement ratings to make them appear better then it seems. It is a viable option if your goals are extremely, extremely modest (i.e. insurance defense or document review).
Your GPA is low, but not terrible. Try really hard to get it to a 3.0, and score a high 150s/low 160s on the LSAT. That will open up viable options. University of Miami is a more viable option for New York City firm jobs than NYLS (thanks to the Miami-New York connection), and a 3.0/160 can get you in, possibly with some merit money.

For the love of god, listen to this quoted reply.  NYLS is NOT a viable option...getting a job in NYC period is near impossible from this school.  Even seton hall and Rutgers offers better NYC opportunity overall than NYLS simply because they are superior schools.
Someone here made a perfect hierarchical flow explaining how competitive NYC is how NYLS is at the bottom of the list.

Hey Iceslip... I am just curious what you base your comments on.  Most people already know that NYLS is behind the other schools in NYC, and sure finding a job isn't easy, but to say that getting a job in NYC is near impossible from this school is a rather bold statement.  Do you actually know people who go there or have graduated from there?  Have you spoken with actual lawyers about the school?  Are you drawing your own conclusions based on USNews rankings?  Or do you just believe everything you read on this or any other message board?

I am only asking this b/c I know of a few people (at least one im sure did not finish in top 10%) who went there and seem to be doing fine (not doc review or ID).
I agree with you that there are better options out there than NYLS, but do you honestly believe that it is not a viable option, especially if for some people its their only option?     

[stateofbeasley]

Do you actually know people who go there or have graduated from there?  Have you spoken with actual lawyers about the school?  Are you drawing your own conclusions based on USNews rankings?  Or do you just believe everything you read on this or any other message board?

I am only asking this b/c I know of a few people (at least one im sure did not finish in top 10%) who went there and seem to be doing fine (not doc review or ID).
I agree with you that there are better options out there than NYLS, but do you honestly believe that it is not a viable option, especially if for some people its their only option?

Those few people you know may not be typical of the average graduate of NYLS.  You may think "yeah, I'll be successful like them," but that's not very reassuring when measured against the risk of not finding high paying employment, combined with the 180k+ debt.

It comes down to whether you are willing to risk nearly two hundred grand on this school.  Is the small chance of getting a high paying job worth the substantial risk that you won't be in the top x%, and be stuck working for much lower wages while trying to pay off a massive debt?

For me personally, the risk is unacceptably high.  As always, my rule of thumb is "go prestigious, go public, or don't go at all".

[cheeseman]

Do you actually know people who go there or have graduated from there?  Have you spoken with actual lawyers about the school?  Are you drawing your own conclusions based on USNews rankings?  Or do you just believe everything you read on this or any other message board?

I am only asking this b/c I know of a few people (at least one im sure did not finish in top 10%) who went there and seem to be doing fine (not doc review or ID).
I agree with you that there are better options out there than NYLS, but do you honestly believe that it is not a viable option, especially if for some people its their only option?

Those few people you know may not be typical of the average graduate of NYLS.  You may think "yeah, I'll be successful like them," but that's not very reassuring when measured against the risk of not finding high paying employment, combined with the 180k+ debt.

It comes down to whether you are willing to risk nearly two hundred grand on this school.  Is the small chance of getting a high paying job worth the substantial risk that you won't be in the top x%, and be stuck working for much lower wages while trying to pay off a massive debt?
For me personally, the risk is unacceptably high.  As always, my rule of thumb is "go prestigious, go public, or don't go at all".

Fair enough.  But just so you know I am well aware that those few people are not typical for NYLS grads.  Perhaps what I said was not clear... I was merely trying to make the point that although the job search will be difficult, it doesn't necessarily make it impossible (as it was written in previous posts).

Its also important to note that there are more than a few people here who tend to make comments based on bogus info, believe everything they read on message boards, and basically make up things without ever actually knowing what is really going on (aka talking out of their ass).  This is why I questioned that person's comments in a previous post.   

[Journeyman]

If you have ANY better options, (T2 or cheaper) do NOT go to NYLS, period.


If you're down to T4 or NYLS,  only go to NYLS if you absolutely desire to start in NYC...and plan to be in the top 10% and law review

[joewillie]

to shift the conversation slightly...

chances at pt programs at Cardozo & Fordham:

Fordham- pt program lsat range: 160 - 163 , its the regular 4 year pt program.

Cardozo- pt lsat: 156 - 160. 3 year program; you start in the summer and do pt for the first year and finish the last 2 years in the normal schedule.

my info: gpa around the 3.0 area give or take 0.1, lsat i havent taken the real one yet but estimate to be in the high 150s or low 160s ...probably 158 - 162

If you break 160 it will open a few more doors and give you options beyond NYLS.  I got a 159/161, 3.3 gpa from a CUNY school, and was admitted to BLS, Seton Hall ($$$), R-N and Dozo (early start, FT).  I've been out of school for a bit so had some good soft factors, but you get the picture.  Especially if you do well, both R-N and Seton Hall would be better choices than NYLS IMO.

[sahrunner86]

yes, I'm planning on applying to fordham pt, cardozo (early entry/pt), brooklyn pt, seton hall pt, and nyls ft for schools in nyc area. I would like to live somewhere in the southern part of mahattan regardless of what school, but i will also look in the boroughs nearby as well. Not going to law school isnt really an option Im going to consider, I want to go and I want to practice law. If I cant get a firm job immediately afterward I believe there are other options and just because the firm job doesnt immediately become a possibility doesnt mean that i couldnt get one after a few years of legal experience say in the government sector or clerkships.

[nycesq2005]

I'm a practicing attorney in NYC and a Bklyn Law Alum. The guy who posted NYLS is the bottom of the barrel is right on target. The NYC market is just too competitive, and the majority of NYLS grads who work in NYC (which undoubtedly, they do because of proximity) usually work in quasi-legal or non legal jobs, and the ones who do find something in the private sector, its usually a low paying PI/ID firm paying $35-45K/year (see http://nycdefensefirms.googlepages.com). If you are putting down 120K in loans for a NYLS degree for a job paying that much, you would be foolish. Its a stupid investment.

You dont even know your LSAT score yet, so I would sit tight and wait for that official 160+ score. Take a year off. Work as a paralegal. Think long and hard about this decision. Read this board, JDUnderground and the other message boards. Talk to students.Talk to professors. But for the love of God, don't just go to NYLS because its the best school you get into. If you can eek out a few more points on the LSAT, your career options can improve considerably and you might not in the same shoes as the depressed, whiny lawyers from TTT schools over at JDUnderground.com (formerly JdJive).

Good luck.