Law School Discussion

South Carolina ASD....

Re: South Carolina ASD....
« Reply #80 on: April 11, 2007, 01:26:50 PM »
That the confederate flag stands for racism is your interpretation.  Period.  My interpretation differs from yours.  The only way we can even have this discussion in absolutes would be to throw out personal prejudices and ask why it was made in the first place -- and the answer is states' rights.


WRONG!  Did you even read my last post on the subject to you ???  "even you admitted that your Southern pride in your heritage is selective--choosing to conveniently ignore the racist aspect of it that still permeates throughout SC today." Southern states rights consisted of (among other things) slavery and white supremacy.  Quite frankly if after all I have posted on the matter...the only thing you can tell me "throw out personal prejudices."   Then you are SELECTIVELY interpreting my posts.  Just like you are SELECTIVELY choosing the parts of Southern Heritage that appeal to you.  Personal prejudice my ass.   

On top of that, you just upright ignore my question about  resolving this SC racial issue!


Why the hostility?  I'm just talking on a message board, I didn't know I would offend anyone by not addressing every single point.

I don't IGNORE racism or its history -- if I did that I wouldn't be responding in this thread.  I have said several times that I think it's completely deplorable.  What I don't do is take pride in it.  I told you the reasons that I take pride in being southern, and I think they're pretty good reasons if those are the sorts of things that interest you.  Through all of this, it's almost like you're ignoring the fact that slavery existed north of the Mason-Dixon Line too.  And even after that, you're sorely mistaken if you believe that racism stopped after abolition (and if you believe it doesn't exist there today).  You hate SC, I get it.  You don't like the south, I get that too.  But those are personal prejudices.

No, obviously I didn't know that your grandmother is white.  I also don't think that's relevant.  My father is filipino, and he went to The Citadel.

How did he feel about racial attitudes there?

barenakedtjm

Re: South Carolina ASD....
« Reply #81 on: April 11, 2007, 02:44:37 PM »
That the confederate flag stands for racism is your interpretation.  Period.  My interpretation differs from yours.  The only way we can even have this discussion in absolutes would be to throw out personal prejudices and ask why it was made in the first place -- and the answer is states' rights.


WRONG!  Did you even read my last post on the subject to you ???  "even you admitted that your Southern pride in your heritage is selective--choosing to conveniently ignore the racist aspect of it that still permeates throughout SC today." Southern states rights consisted of (among other things) slavery and white supremacy.  Quite frankly if after all I have posted on the matter...the only thing you can tell me "throw out personal prejudices."   Then you are SELECTIVELY interpreting my posts.  Just like you are SELECTIVELY choosing the parts of Southern Heritage that appeal to you.  Personal prejudice my ass.   

On top of that, you just upright ignore my question about  resolving this SC racial issue!


Why the hostility?  I'm just talking on a message board, I didn't know I would offend anyone by not addressing every single point.

I don't IGNORE racism or its history -- if I did that I wouldn't be responding in this thread.  I have said several times that I think it's completely deplorable.  What I don't do is take pride in it.  I told you the reasons that I take pride in being southern, and I think they're pretty good reasons if those are the sorts of things that interest you.  Through all of this, it's almost like you're ignoring the fact that slavery existed north of the Mason-Dixon Line too.  And even after that, you're sorely mistaken if you believe that racism stopped after abolition (and if you believe it doesn't exist there today).  You hate SC, I get it.  You don't like the south, I get that too.  But those are personal prejudices.

No, obviously I didn't know that your grandmother is white.  I also don't think that's relevant.  My father is filipino, and he went to The Citadel.

How did he feel about racial attitudes there?

He and I have never talked about that before, but he still wears his class ring if that tells you anything.

I sense a little more hostility in your responses than I did before, and I don't want to be a part of this escalation.  Thanks for discussing it to this point, but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

Re: South Carolina ASD....
« Reply #82 on: April 11, 2007, 03:15:54 PM »
Oh there's lots of hostility here.  "Progressives" love being opened minded until it doesn't suit their politics. Similar to the Edwards family. They're all for the other America until someone in that other America pulls out a gun and waves it around (this probably only applies to white gun owners; minority gun owners can live in their America because they're the victims of other America, and aren't really responsible for the consequences of their victimization).  I haven't figured out if religion or beer is allowed in Edwards's America.  Though, makeup, hair care products, and big homes definitely are. Remember we're all supposed to get along until someone proposes a way to get along that we don't like.  When that happens, start making broad generalizations and attacking large groups of people.  It's very helpful and provides an interesting diversion from reading. 

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Re: South Carolina ASD....
« Reply #83 on: April 11, 2007, 03:25:15 PM »
Can't answer the question...That’s what I thought.

I'll present the question again and answer it for you:

"And, if intelligent progressive thinking white people (with similar non racist views as yourself) idly stand by and do or say nothing to the powers that be to improve matters, What hope does SC have against it's more radical racist elements?  

White people clearly have the power in SC.  They are really the ones that can change or not change the status quo.  So where does this leave us?"


<<barenakedtjm's answer (if s/he had enough courage): Whites don't want to change the status quo in SC, and are accomplices (directly and indirectly) to the good ol' boy network in SC.  To be honest, I (also) am not as progressive as I pretended to be earlier in this thread.>>

My response: Thanks for your honesty.

THE END ;)

barenakedtjm

Re: South Carolina ASD....
« Reply #84 on: April 11, 2007, 03:46:14 PM »
I never claimed to be progressive beyond my stance on racism--I would consider myself a non-religious conservative if I had to describe my own views.  I can't believe that you would resort to a personal attack!  Very mature of you, sir.  Are YOU a racist?  I have made it pretty clear that I am not, so I can't really see what your problem is with me other than the fact that I don't want to sling mud along with you.

Re: South Carolina ASD....
« Reply #85 on: April 11, 2007, 04:13:55 PM »
His problem with you is that you're different than him, and that makes you wrong/bad/ignorant/silly. 

Re: South Carolina ASD....
« Reply #86 on: April 11, 2007, 07:10:19 PM »
Jesus Christ, South Carolina is the Devil!

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Re: South Carolina ASD....
« Reply #87 on: April 11, 2007, 07:32:32 PM »
That the confederate flag stands for racism is your interpretation.  Period.  My interpretation differs from yours.  The only way we can even have this discussion in absolutes would be to throw out personal prejudices and ask why it was made in the first place -- and the answer is states' rights.

Paper:  You're just being a male private part now.  If you want to see racism as the only element of southern heritage worth talking about, go ahead -- I have nothing further to discuss with you if that's your mentality.  However, if narrow-mindedness is your problem with southern culture in general, I suggest you look in the mirror.  The fact that you take the culture of an enormous sect of people and choose a single aspect while ignoring some things that just might not be all that bad is the very definition of narrow-mindedness.

Clemson sucks!


haha, j/k man. I'm a gamecock fan :)

barenakedtjm

Re: South Carolina ASD....
« Reply #88 on: April 11, 2007, 09:09:17 PM »
That the confederate flag stands for racism is your interpretation.  Period.  My interpretation differs from yours.  The only way we can even have this discussion in absolutes would be to throw out personal prejudices and ask why it was made in the first place -- and the answer is states' rights.

Paper:  You're just being a male private part now.  If you want to see racism as the only element of southern heritage worth talking about, go ahead -- I have nothing further to discuss with you if that's your mentality.  However, if narrow-mindedness is your problem with southern culture in general, I suggest you look in the mirror.  The fact that you take the culture of an enormous sect of people and choose a single aspect while ignoring some things that just might not be all that bad is the very definition of narrow-mindedness.

Clemson sucks!


haha, j/k man. I'm a gamecock fan :)

Damn, I'm really sorry to hear that!

Re: South Carolina ASD....
« Reply #89 on: April 11, 2007, 10:25:52 PM »
That the confederate flag stands for racism is your interpretation.  Period.  My interpretation differs from yours.  The only way we can even have this discussion in absolutes would be to throw out personal prejudices and ask why it was made in the first place -- and the answer is states' rights.

Paper:  You're just being a male private part now.  If you want to see racism as the only element of southern heritage worth talking about, go ahead -- I have nothing further to discuss with you if that's your mentality.  However, if narrow-mindedness is your problem with southern culture in general, I suggest you look in the mirror.  The fact that you take the culture of an enormous sect of people and choose a single aspect while ignoring some things that just might not be all that bad is the very definition of narrow-mindedness.

Clemson sucks!


haha, j/k man. I'm a gamecock fan :)

Damn, I'm really sorry to hear that!

Me too.  There's a special kind of hell out there, and it's called "Columbia". 

Also, I'd like to stand up and say that I'm a white guy in South Carolina, from a long history of white guys in South Carolina that have tried to buck the status quo when it comes to racism or other civil rights issues.  We're not as rare as it seems.  Being someone from this state that has tried to make a difference (from our supposed white male position of ultimate power, I guess), I really resent people who don't make an effort or don't live here currently trying to tell people in this state just how bad things are here.  Last time I checked South Carolina was still part of the union and not a state all by itself, so I really don't see the point in singling South Carolina out as somehow separate from the rest of the country.  South Carolina's problems are the problems of everyone in the US.  If you think there's a problem here, great, put your money where your mouth is.   

Also, I'm not sure what various symbols like the Stars and Bars represent to people today because I can't see inside their heads, but I'm absolutely certain that the states of the Confederacy seceeded because of the perceived threat to slavery posed by the election of Abraham Lincoln.  If you want, you can read various copies of their respective Secession Ordinances on the internet, along with the official explanations that accompained them. 

I'll quote here from Mississippi's "Declaration of the Immediate Causes which Induce and Justify the Secession of the State of Mississippi from the Federal Union",

"Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery-- the greatest material interest of the world. Its labor supplies the product which constitutes by far the largest and most important portions of commerce of the earth. These products are peculiar to the climate verging on the tropical regions, and by an imperious law of nature, none but the black race can bear exposure to the tropical sun. These products have become necessities of the world, and a blow at slavery is a blow at commerce and civilization. That blow has been long aimed at the institution, and was at the point of reaching its consummation. There was no choice left us but submission to the mandates of abolition, or a dissolution of the Union, whose principles had been subverted to work out our ruin."

It goes on to eneumerate the various threats posed against slavery by the government.  You can read it all here,

http://people.clemson.edu/~pcander/secession.html

I mean, it's there in the text.  The Civil War was about slavery.  There's just no need to dress it up with some neo-Confederate musings about States' Rights.