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Author Topic: t3/t4 chances  (Read 957 times)

younghova

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t3/t4 chances
« on: November 06, 2006, 03:58:28 PM »
I know there was a t3/t4 thread, but i can't find it.  anybody that has experience with t3's or 4's please assess my chances.  or anyone else. 

anyways, scored a 153 on the sept lsat.  going to retake in feb. or June.  confident I'll be able to get at least a 155.

my gpa is a 3.64 (history).

my soft factors are unspectacular.

carious what my chances are at these schools: Albany, Drake, Baltimore, Dayton, Creighton, duquesne, detroit mercy, valpo, ave maria?  is that a good list for my stats?

pinkytrc

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Re: t3/t4 chances
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2006, 10:33:40 PM »
I'm not sure of the rest, but I'd say detroit-mercy is almost a hole in one, Dayton a really good shot too.  Your score is respectable for a t3 t4 definitely.  I just talked to an admissions counselor a couple weeks ago for Cleveland Marshall (t3) and she said with my gpa (3.71- so nearly identical) that I would only need like a 151, 152 to get in.  So your chances are looking great.  Just apply as early as you can to give yourself that extra boost.
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pinkytrc

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Re: t3/t4 chances
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2006, 10:36:27 PM »
Ooops just saw that your reptaking in Feb. or June you say?  I would say take Feb!  In June they start that new RC for the first time, not sure if it will be easier or harder, but anything new on a test like this would weird me out.  So just keep that in mind!  And then apply as close to Sept. as you can!  Good Luck!
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keepitsimple

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Re: t3/t4 chances
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2006, 01:17:23 AM »
You have better scores than me so I hope your chances are good or else I am screwed!

younghova

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Re: t3/t4 chances
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2006, 01:26:05 PM »
cleveland marshall.  havn't thought about that one.  its in the midwest and is a t3, so i'll add it to my list.

thanks for the replies.

WhiteyEMSR

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Re: t3/t4 chances
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2006, 08:17:54 PM »
Thought I'd repost this as I saw Detroit Mercy mentioned.

I attended the University of Detroit Mercy for my first year of law school. I transferred for my second year, and I'm very happy I did. Working hard and getting good grades is definitely important, but it is MUCH more important if you are planning on attending a tier 4 school.

First of all, not nearly as many firms interview at tier 4 schools as they do at higher tier schools. Look up Detroit Mercy on nalpdirectory.com and then look up any tier 1 or tier 2 school. UDM brings in around 20 firms I think. The firm I accepted an offer with only has two attorneys from UDM (out of 2200 lawyers), and these two are partners that are long standing at the firm.

Secondly, you must be at the top of your class to even be considered by law firms. I don't care if they have 20 lawyers or 2200 lawyers. Grades are an objective was of showing qualification. By top of the class I mean TOP to even get interviews. Many firms limit the people they will even consider for initial interviews to top 10-20%. I have many friends still at UDM that can't get jobs that did very well their first year, some on law reveiw, some on moot court and some on both.

Thirdly, keep in mind that the easiest and most efficient way of getting firm jobs (I understand not everyone wants to do the law firm thing, but with 100,000 in debr many of us don't have the option) is through the OCI (on campus interview process) your 2L year. Talk to the CSO at the schools you are considering, see what firms interveiw there, who they hire, how many they hire, etc. Talk with students that go to these schools! When you are visiting stop them in the hallways. Ask questions, preferablt not only from administration as they will try to deceive you. Nalpdirectory.com is helpful.

Law school is a huge investment. Many students do not get jobs. People on this board say "Work hard, pass the bar, and you'r sure to get a job. It doesn't matter what school you go to." I disagree with these statements. It makes all the difference in the world. Protect yourselves by asking questions of everyone you can. What I say is especially true with regard to firm jobs. 

I'm sorry to be harsh, but I see many of my friends, very smart people, very frustrated about their job situations. The OCI season is over, and the vast majority of them have no jobs lined up for the summer. I used to speak very highly of UDM, but with hindsight I see that many things that the administration told me were not true. Keep in mind what I am saying is only from what I have heard regarding UDM and other schools that students transferred from to my current school. Also, I was only concerned with law firms, not govt, public interest, etc. But, if you want to do these things, check on your schools' loan forgiveness programs, scholarships, etc.

Good Luck. PM me with any questions. EMSR

younghova

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Re: t3/t4 chances
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2006, 09:03:29 PM »
yeah, i honestly wouldn't be that excited about UDM or ave maria.  I'm hoping to get my score up to a 156 or 157, which would give me a better shot at the t3s on the list and maybe a t2. 

if UDM was the only school I get accepted in, I would be on the fence on if I should accept.  probably leaning towards not.  need to get the lsat score up.

WhiteyEMSR

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Re: t3/t4 chances
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2006, 11:48:29 PM »
You should keep in mind that transferring is a viable option. Many people on this board say you need to be in top 10% or so to transfer up. I'm not sure this is the case across the board. I transferred from UDM to Notre Dame. There are other transfers here from tier 4 schools (one from Michigan State) that have around 3.1-3.4 GPAs. This seems relatively low considering ND is a top 25 school.

I think if you got the 1st year out of the way at a tier 3 school, ended up in around the top 25%, maybe even lower, you could at least transfer up to a tier 3 school, if that is your goal now. I'm not sure the differences in job opportunities btwn a tier 3 school and a tier 4 school, but if this is what you want, I think you would have a good chance after completing your 1st year. UDM had students, some outside of the top 20% definitely, transfer to Michigan, Notre Dame, Loyola Chicago, Syracuse, Depaul, hmmm, semms like there are more, but I can't think of them.

Anyway, taking a year off and hoping to get a better lsat score might not be as productive as getting the 1st year of hell out of the way and then transferring up. Of course you always run the risk of doing bad in your first year. As far as lsat predicting success, it didn't for me. I scored a 147 on the lsat and finished 2nd in my class.

Good luck.

EMSR

PS- Ave Maia LS is moving to Florida (probably). Tom Monoghan is convinced it is a good idea. Not too sure that it is. I think it runs the risk of losing accreditation if a lot of the professors/students don't decide to go along. Anyway, just a thought.

younghova

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Re: t3/t4 chances
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2006, 12:08:19 PM »
Yeah, there's a lot of wierd things about ave maria. 

I have assumed that it would be much easier to score a few points higher on the lsat and get into a better school than to transfer (and i really think I havn't scored my potential and could very reasonably get into the upper 150's range).

but your story certainly contradicts that assumption.

hmmm, your case can't be too typical.  I mean a jump from t4 to t1. 

it would be nice to not waste a year.

anyways, thank for your reply.  gives me some more to think about. 

keepitsimple

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Re: t3/t4 chances
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2006, 12:53:55 PM »
Thats nice news to hear about transfering. I might just think about doing that if I don't get into a tier 3 school in ohio