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Author Topic: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN  (Read 8375 times)

nosnud

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Re: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2006, 11:04:53 AM »
I didn't twist anything. I quoted him and gave my initial reaction.

And considering there is such a strong Muslim presence in the UK, I think the onus is on the prime minsiter to watch what he says and be aware of how statements can be construed, rightly or wrongly, as insensitive to the religious beliefs of the women that wear veils.

And I'm not commenting about teh situation in America, chewy06. However, when I was younger and attended a Catholic school, a Muslim girl was also there, and wore her veil. There was nothing said to her, and in fact, it allowed her to share what was unique about her and her  family's personal beliefs.

I simply think Blair's comments sound judgemental and ignorant of all the aspects of wearing a veil. Many Muslim women I know wear one because they want to, not because they are forced, and they do it in reverence to their religious beliefs. Yes, their religious beliefs separate them from the majority in the UK, but those differences should be recognized, not demonized.

Furthermore, Blair speaks as though he's got honest "evidence" that assimilation bodes well for minority groups. Where and when?

You're taking a very progressive, non-offensive statement about how the balance should be right, and saying some ridiculous crap implying that what he said was racist and ignorant.  That's misconstruing his words, twisting them in your little head to make a stink. 

Regardless of whether they want to wear a veil, Blair is merely saying that assimilation is important, and that's the best way to prevent extremism from spreading to disenfranchised young Muslim men that are easily convince to blow themselves up for the sake of another misconstrued statement from the Quran.  See, twisting words is dangerous.

redemption

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Re: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2006, 11:09:45 AM »
Eh, y'all are close to making me enter this thread for real.

hopes-n-dreams -- you're right about everything you've said so far. This sort of topic just attracts the C-Span call-in types, that's all.

nosnud

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Re: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2006, 11:14:12 AM »
Eh, y'all are close to making me enter this thread for real.

hopes-n-dreams -- you're right about everything you've said so far. This sort of topic just attracts the C-Span call-in types, that's all.

Hello, friend!

Please don't pwn me.  I don't have any stake or real position in the argument, but I wish people assimilated and got along better, that's all.  I'm all about the love.  Pass the dutchie to the left hand side.  When in Rome.  You know. Stuff like that. 

parsley

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Re: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2006, 11:24:43 AM »
Quote
Blair should be mindful of how his words can be construed, just as all people should, when addressing as sensitive an issue as religious expression.

No, appealing to the lowest common denominator is what we do here in the US.  No need for other world leaders to have to talk like their audience is a room full of third graders.

I've never called into a C-Span show (I always catch those suckers pre-recorded!) but if it means that we do a lot of nerdy, complicated things like read a lot of books with a lot of words and facts in them and articles and other thinking stuff before commenting... well, maybe. 

redemption

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Re: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN
« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2006, 11:32:01 AM »
Hypo --

If you or your sister were to decide to move to, say, Eritrea, should you or she have to undergo a cliterodectomy?

Or, if you or she were to move to Saudi Arabia, should you or she be made to wear a burqa?

parsley

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Re: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN
« Reply #15 on: October 18, 2006, 11:38:16 AM »
We're talking about the quote, though.  Not his opinion on head scarves.

nosnud

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Re: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN
« Reply #16 on: October 18, 2006, 11:39:22 AM »
We're talking about the quote, though.  Not his opinion on head scarves.

Yeah that's basically my point. 

redemption

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Re: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN
« Reply #17 on: October 18, 2006, 11:39:36 AM »
We're talking about the quote, though.  Not his opinion on head scarves.

And the difference is?

President_Baccaga

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Re: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN
« Reply #18 on: October 18, 2006, 11:41:56 AM »
Hypo --

If you or your sister were to decide to move to, say, Eritrea, should you or she have to undergo a cliterodectomy?

Or, if you or she were to move to Saudi Arabia, should you or she be made to wear a burqa?

Immigrants who decide to move to a foreign country should understand that it is not the country that has the responsibility to alter itself for those who want to come, but rather the immigrants should be accepting of that country's laws and traditions.  I did not live in Italy and expect that Italy start to celebrate the Fourth of July and Thanksgiving.  If I moved to a country in the Middle East, it would be my responsibility to accept its culture; not obligatory for that country to alter itself to support my way of life.

Your first example is exceedingly extreme, but yes... if a woman wanted to move to Saudi Arabia, she should understand that it is expected of her to wear a burqa.  If a potential immigrant doesn't like the way of life of a particular country, no one is forcing he/she to go there.

parsley

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Re: Tony Blair's Comment - CNN
« Reply #19 on: October 18, 2006, 11:48:07 AM »
There's a pretty big difference between a policy and a general call for balance between integration and what are becoming nearly autonomous communities within a country.  Integration doesn't have to necessarily be conforming, but could be accomplished with dialogue, compromise and education.

The OP took offense to the general call for balance between integration and multiculturalism, and said nothing in the original post about head scarves.

(To Blair, the head scarf is symbolic of all the wider problems I talked about earlier. His comments actually made no reference to the case of the teacher in the news.  And it's an entirely different debate on the particulars of balancing religious freedom and somebody's ability to accomplish their job.)