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Author Topic: US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?  (Read 1295 times)

Commie Panda

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US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?
« on: April 06, 2006, 11:46:05 PM »
Sound off... Two of the most prominent academics in the field of international relations (Mearsheimer and Walt) recently published an article  (no American media outlet allowed them to publish their article...talk about freedom of speech) outlining what they believe to be the Israeli lobby's sway over American foreign policy decision-making. Not surprisingly, the reaction hasn't gotten much coverage in America but there has been vigorous scholarly debate about whether the article is "anti-Semitic" or not.

In any case, here's a good recap of the article and the reaction it has elicited.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0406/dailyUpdate.html

Whaddaya all think--true or not true? Totally anti-semitic or not at all?

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Re: US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2006, 12:02:37 AM »
nah...our u.s.a. think-tanks drive policy...

they hire "indigos" these days.

people like george soros wish they had a hand in it...they try...they do try...

some people think it is the illuminati...or the trilateral commission...like the BluePatriots

aye think some great-grandchildren of alexander hamilton still have a hand in pushing policy...but that is difficult to prove.



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nesnut

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Re: US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?
« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2006, 01:33:42 AM »
(i've got to stop posting in the news thread- nobody reads it, and someone always ends up posting news stuff here anyway)

it isn't anti-semitic.  If I were to criticize Mexico for being a piss poor government, or criticize Sudan for being a disgrace to human rights, nobody would say I hate Mexicans or black people.  Nor would anybody say I hate Arabs for pointing out the oil lobby's power (mainly because it's headed by white dudes from Texas- but you get the point).  No state gets to hide behind charges of racism to avoid being criticized- especially one purporting to be a democracy.   

I read the entire thing, both the version on the London Book Journal site and the link they have to the unedited version, and I assure you, they break no new ground.  AIPAC is the second largest lobby group in the united states, and it's no small secret that many people- jewish and otherwise- who are ardent zionists hold positions of importance in think tanks and policy centers. Lobby groups use money to influence people- AIPAC, Abramhoff, AARP, unions- they all do the same thing. This also isn't groundbreaking.  Pointing out that the US is completely and unabashedly in support of Israel no matter what it does is not groundbreaking.  Mearsheimer and Walt give passing references to Palestinian suffering, and mention their rights to the land a few times here and there- avoiding historical issues with regards to the Palestinian/Israeli conflict is also not groundbreaking.  The entire paper is written from a realist perspective that argues that we are loosing sight of what's important in international struggles- this also isn't groundbreaking. The only thing that is groundbreaking is that they are two of the biggest heavyweights in international relations who are openly saying what Chomsky, Said, Khalidi, Findley and a whole host of policy wonks have been saying for years.
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Re: US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2006, 02:36:41 AM »
aye agree...the think tanks are the steering force...

and the term "anti-semetic" is misunderstood...today it should mean "anti-arab" as well...people lose track of what words mean.

when aye hear it aye purposefully ask my collegues..."are you referring to arabs?"...and they look at me bewildered...then they concede.
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nesnut

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Re: US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2006, 11:57:19 AM »
aye agree...the think tanks are the steering force...

and the term "anti-semetic" is misunderstood...today it should mean "anti-arab" as well...people lose track of what words mean.

when aye hear it aye purposefully ask my collegues..."are you referring to arabs?"...and they look at me bewildered...then they concede.

point well made, blue- arabs and jews are historical cousins- both are semitic peoples. 
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Re: US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2006, 12:05:24 PM »
It is blindingly obvious that the pro-israel lobby controls much of US foreign policy. This is largely because they are the only ones who play the game well. African Americans could be important in their advocacy for Africa, for example, but they don't care as much, they're not as organized, as well able to mobilize funding etc. It is not the Israel lobby's fault that this is the case, but the fault of everyone else for failing to organize a countervailing lobby.


nesnut

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Re: US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2006, 12:22:36 PM »
i hate lobbies- nothing says "your vote is worthless- Democracy is for sale" like lobbies
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LitDoc

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Re: US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2006, 12:37:38 PM »
Not anti-Semitic.

And while "Semitic" does etymologically refer to descendants of Shem (thus encompassing even more than the Jews and the Arabs, who are both descendants of Abraham, who was a descendant of Shem), historically the term "anti-Semitic" has meant predominantly anti-Jewish. There is no large or significant historical use of the term in reference to anti-Arab sentiments, particularly in recent history. Indeed, most of the Arab nations are called, frequently, "anti-Semitic" -- but of course they are unabashedly pro-Arab.
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Re: US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2006, 11:51:40 PM »
Not anti-Semitic.

And while "Semitic" does etymologically refer to descendants of Shem (thus encompassing even more than the Jews and the Arabs, who are both descendants of Abraham, who was a descendant of Shem), historically the term "anti-Semitic" has meant predominantly anti-Jewish. There is no large or significant historical use of the term in reference to anti-Arab sentiments, particularly in recent history. Indeed, most of the Arab nations are called, frequently, "anti-Semitic" -- but of course they are unabashedly pro-Arab.

anti-arab is anti-semitic...historically as well. you proved it.
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  us, do we not die? and if you wrong us, shall we not  
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Fidelio

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Re: US Foreign Policy driven by Israeli Lobby?
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2006, 05:45:44 PM »
A recent article in a anti-war website discusses how Colin Powell disagrees with critics who claim that there is no Israel lobby.

http://www.dissidentvoice.org/Apr06/Glunts10.htm