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Author Topic: AA in South Africa.  (Read 2586 times)

Ilovecheese

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Re: AA in South Africa.
« Reply #10 on: March 29, 2006, 11:08:36 PM »
Firing white employees and replacing them with blacks is what South Africans see as fair. And such act is not much different from a URm getting admitted into a school over a higher qualifying white person to fill a quota.

coquita

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Re: AA in South Africa.
« Reply #11 on: March 29, 2006, 11:47:46 PM »
Quotas are no longer allowed under the ruling of Adarand Constructers Inc. v Pena. It was applied to schools in Regents of the University of California v. Bakke

once again know your facts. ;)

Also I thought we were talking about AA in South Africa. But it seems you started the thread to trash AA in  law school admissions... again.

Ilovecheese

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Re: AA in South Africa.
« Reply #12 on: March 30, 2006, 08:07:36 AM »
I know that quotas are not allowed. I also know that they do exist. My relative is a dean of admissions at a top LS and he told me that they use them.

Oh, I'm not trashing AA. I think we need it, but I do not think it should be a more selective process in deciding who deserves it.

mivida2k

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Re: AA in South Africa.
« Reply #13 on: March 30, 2006, 09:57:22 AM »
I know that quotas are not allowed. I also know that they do exist. My relative is a dean of admissions at a top LS and he told me that they use them.

Oh, I'm not trashing AA. I think we need it, but I do not think it should be a more selective process in deciding who deserves it.


I am sure that you are going to report him to the DOJ.   ::)
The president's approval rating has dropped to 33 percent, matching his low in May. His handling of nearly every issue, from the Iraq war to foreign policy, contributed to the president's decline around the nation, even in the Republican-friendly South.

coquita

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Re: AA in South Africa.
« Reply #14 on: March 30, 2006, 12:49:43 PM »
I know that quotas are not allowed. I also know that they do exist. My relative is a dean of admissions at a top LS and he told me that they use them.

Oh, I'm not trashing AA. I think we need it, but I do not think it should be a more selective process in deciding who deserves it.

well then your dean relative is doing something unconstitutional. I doubt they use quotas (accepting a set amount of minorities), they use preference points, which are legal. If you have such a problem with quotas, report that law school to the DOJ instead of bitching about it on LSD.

also you disagreed with AA in another post saying that URMs get alot if not more resources than whites. so are you changing your stance now? look at your quote below

Quote
Also, Coquita, yes whites held blacks in slavery for a long time, but that is not a reason for blacks, not all, but many, being tokes of top univesities. You still do not understand that I'm not trying to argue that blacks or any other URM is inferior in some matter to a white man. What I'm saying is that a person MUST prove his/her worth and being part of a program that undermines intelligence ( that's what AA does in my opinion) of some races is just ridiculous.

how can you agree w/ it if you think it undermines intelligence?

Quote
Lastly, I think that Horsley is right when he says that URM's enjoy as many if  not more benefits of the American society. URM neighbourhoods get so much help, but most of that help is wasted, because many URM's especially blacks think that the world owes them something.


also how can you agree w/ AA when you said blacks get equal if not more benefits in America?

know what you stance is, know your facts, and then you maybe we can hope to have an intelligent dicussion w/ you here.

redemption

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Re: AA in South Africa.
« Reply #15 on: March 30, 2006, 02:42:37 PM »
Ilovecheese: To start a topic on one topic in order to draw people into a discussion about something else entirely is rude and diminishes your credibility as a poster on this board. Don't be tempted to do it.

philibusters

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Re: AA in South Africa.
« Reply #16 on: March 30, 2006, 03:07:28 PM »
No quotas in teh law in this country, but they difinitely exist in reality, I think the whole "critical mass" is quotas in disguise as Rehnquist pointed out in his dissent. However, quotas oerate different in a country where quota for african americans is 8% of total maybe 5% for hispanics, that means 87% can still be white, so quotas only affect the marginally qualfied.  In SA if they used quotas of say 85% (totally made up that number), that would affect all but the most qualfied white job seekers.  That said I exagerated that number horrible to make a pt., quotas work better where you are dealing with a minority, than a majority.

We don't let people get fired to hire people-or do we?  Actually the law is unsettled-the caselaw seems to indicate no, but teacher's union and other unions that use seniority systems present special problems.  If the normal system is based on seniority, then whee there has to be a downsizing, should minorities be exempt from the seniority system?  Wygant for example said no, but O'Conner was the swing vote in a 5-4 decision in that case .  With Roberts and Alito that decision is probably solid, but replacing renhiquist and o'conner with roberts and alito just keeps the vote at 5-4, so the next change in court could upset that.
2008 graduate of William and Mary Law School

Ilovecheese

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Re: AA in South Africa.
« Reply #17 on: March 30, 2006, 09:14:18 PM »
Ilovecheese: To start a topic on one topic in order to draw people into a discussion about something else entirely is rude and diminishes your credibility as a poster on this board. Don't be tempted to do it.

My topic was a discussion of AA in SA. Discussion also means comparisons and that is what I'm doing by talking about AA in America.

Coquitta, I'm not trying to bash AA in this post.
My last comment posed a question of whether it is fair to give seats in LS to lower qualified students based on race when it is clearly unfair to take someone elses job and replace that person with another because of race.