Law School Discussion

Holy Sh*t

L1

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Re: Holy Sh*t
« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2004, 01:11:42 PM »
Don't forget also, that many individuals avoid income tax when it comes to small things. For instance, each time you sell a book on half.com or here, you're supposed to count that as your income. Most ppl don't, however.

There is a huge issue being made out of whether or not ebay is considered an employer and should w/hold taxes, provide benefits, etc. They claim that sellers are independent contractors. However, others claim that they use ebay as their primary source of income and that ebay receives profits from their sales.

Re: Holy Sh*t
« Reply #21 on: August 02, 2004, 01:39:58 PM »
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jrhc1210

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Re: Holy Sh*t
« Reply #22 on: August 02, 2004, 01:43:28 PM »


Likewise, Democrats interested in seeing equality would like this.  If everyone is taxed 8%, for instance, 8% of $3,000,000 is going to bring in a lot more money than 8% of $20,000, and it wouldn't be an unbearable burden for either person in this scenario.  I think that Democrats sick of tax cuts for the wealthy and favorable tax rates for corporate America could get behind this, if they could get over their pride that this idea's coming from the right.

But look at the current Dem leadership. You have a billionaire candidate for pres, a tort lawyer for vp, and Ben Afflect as their sidekick (how'd THAT happen btw?) To the dismay of a good number of liberal columnists/pundits, the democratic party has moved away from its everyman base and become as much of a pary of elites as the Republicans.

Ginatio

Re: Holy Sh*t
« Reply #23 on: August 02, 2004, 01:47:12 PM »
won't a flat tax take some of the sovereignty out of the hands of the states? for example, delaware has no sales tax as a boon to residential and commercial investment in the state. i doubt the states would go for such a federally mandated arrangement (sorry if this has already been addressed, I didn't bother reading all the other posts  ;D)...

jrhc1210

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Re: Holy Sh*t
« Reply #24 on: August 02, 2004, 01:49:00 PM »
won't a flat tax take some of the sovereignty out of the hands of the states? for example, delaware has no sales tax as a boon to residential and commercial investment in the state. i doubt the states would go for such a federally mandated arrangement (sorry if this has already been addressed, I didn't bother reading all the other posts  ;D)...

State sovereignty? Is that still a part of the American federal system?   :P

Ginatio

Re: Holy Sh*t
« Reply #25 on: August 02, 2004, 01:51:26 PM »
come now... you know what i'm getting at  ;D

won't a flat tax take some of the sovereignty out of the hands of the states? for example, delaware has no sales tax as a boon to residential and commercial investment in the state. i doubt the states would go for such a federally mandated arrangement (sorry if this has already been addressed, I didn't bother reading all the other posts  ;D)...

State sovereignty? Is that still a part of the American federal system?   :P

Re: Holy Sh*t
« Reply #26 on: August 02, 2004, 01:53:36 PM »
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jrhc1210

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Re: Holy Sh*t
« Reply #27 on: August 02, 2004, 01:55:22 PM »
come now... you know what i'm getting at  ;D

won't a flat tax take some of the sovereignty out of the hands of the states? for example, delaware has no sales tax as a boon to residential and commercial investment in the state. i doubt the states would go for such a federally mandated arrangement (sorry if this has already been addressed, I didn't bother reading all the other posts  ;D)...

State sovereignty? Is that still a part of the American federal system?   :P

I do, I was just being a jerk :P Honestly, it's a good point. However, since a VAT would be the same for every state, Deleware would still have an advantage over other states. For instance, MA has a state income tax and state sales tax. Given the switch to a VAT, MA would probably keep the sales tax and maintain the income tax--or raise it for that matter. Relative to massachusetts, deleware would still be a tax haven. Or is my logic flawed here?

buster

Re: Holy Sh*t
« Reply #28 on: August 02, 2004, 01:57:19 PM »
Neither a flat tax nor a national sales tax favors the "working class." Although each has an aesthetic "fairness" appeal, both are quite regressive when compared to our current system.

And another thing: assuming we're going to have taxation of some sort, who is going to collect the money if we do away with the IRS?




Likewise, Democrats interested in seeing equality would like this.  If everyone is taxed 8%, for instance, 8% of $3,000,000 is going to bring in a lot more money than 8% of $20,000, and it wouldn't be an unbearable burden for either person in this scenario.  I think that Democrats sick of tax cuts for the wealthy and favorable tax rates for corporate America could get behind this, if they could get over their pride that this idea's coming from the right.

But look at the current Dem leadership. You have a billionaire candidate for pres, a tort lawyer for vp, and Ben Afflect as their sidekick (how'd THAT happen btw?) To the dismay of a good number of liberal columnists/pundits, the democratic party has moved away from its everyman base and become as much of a pary of elites as the Republicans.

You're absolutely right about that.  But the core of the Democratic constituency is a group of disgruntled working-class types who don't trust government overall but trust Republicans less than Democrats.  The Democratic elites would never get behind this... but I think that a lot of rank-and-file Dems. would definitely jump the fence and support a Republican agenda that reflects their economic values more actively than the current Democratic party.  What we have seen over the past few decades is the Republican party converting more and more conservative former-Democrats based on "values issues".  If the Republican party combined this message with a tax system favoring the working-class, you'd see a huge swelling of the Republican ranks and a further defection of working-class Democrat types to the Republicans.  The Democrat elites have everything to lose in this scenario, because they can't both grandstand as the servants of the workingman AND refuse to support a tax system based on more socially-just principles.

ZAP

jrhc1210

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Re: Holy Sh*t
« Reply #29 on: August 02, 2004, 02:01:47 PM »
Neither a flat tax nor a national sales tax favors the "working class." Although each has an aesthetic "fairness" appeal, both are quite regressive when compared to our current system.


I see what you're saying on the flat tax. But the sales tax? Basic necessities of living would be exempt. Likewise, you could probably make educational expenses exempt. I would think this system would be fairer because it rewards "good" behavior--ie the middle class family that saves for future educational exspenses, stays in the smaller house, buys the smaller but more environmentally friendly car, would be taxed less than the middle class family that spends every cent on vacations, bigger houses, etc. It might even discourage heavy credit purchases (as more purchases mean more taxes), which would be another benefit.