hey warmongers, here what REAL patriotism look like

[Julie Fern]

and hey--anybody want to buy "conservative" record deficit?  yee-ha!

[Julie Fern]

julie all set.  she has several frozen vials of sperm of rove, rummie, and condi.

[bennybm]

Donnie - it wasn't necessarily directed at you, so only be offended if you find yourself in the group that needs to heed that advice.

[Julie Fern]

he say, from his job manning fries at hardees.

[redemption]

I'm beginning to like you, Donnie Jeffcoat; you've got style.

[bennybm]

I'm beginning to like you too Donnie, but I fully believe name calling is beneath you.

I do believe liberal views are fueled by either

1) lack of worldly experience (idealism)
2) enough money to feel bad for your success and the need to buy redemption.

I don't care which one you are, but I think you probably fall into one of these categories, and you have every right to have these views, its the only thing that keeps either side in check. 

It is amazing to me that some people can sit around and bash others for the way they think, but immediately become offended when their way of thinking is challenged.

Resume the name calling, I suppose.

[dividebyzero]

small moves my friend...don't get overwhelmed.

there was a time when you only got gas on a tuesday when you had an odd number on your license plate.

That's funny, I don't remember talking about Carter at all...Odd.
This is one of those nifty little irrelevant points that are analogous to "But *Clinton got a blowjob!"

"spreading freedom" "democracy in the mideast" "female presidents in africa" "kurds empowered."

which of these are progress and which are hype?

Oh, I get to do these one by one.

"Spreading freedom" - really, where? Iraq? Fat lot of good "freedom" does them when all they're really "free" to do is to get slaughtered en masse.

"democracy in the mideast" - Like the Hamas victory in Palestine? ROFLMAO!

"female presidents in africa" - how, exactly, does America get credit for this one? Is it because after the Liberians *asked*, no, *BEGGED* us to go and help restore order, we sent a whopping 200 Marines to do little more than defend the Embassy as Monrovia burned yet again?

Or maybe it has to do with your petty article in the other thread that has the new president of Liberia thanking "U.S. Aid" for helping restore democracy...that "gratitude" must've been spontaneous, of course, and had nothing at all to do with the fact that she was trying to get money.

BTW, it's female president...singular.

"Kurds empowered" -sure, as long as they don't do anything "crazy" and "democratic", like, declaring the independence they so desperately want but the U.S. won't let them because we already know as soon as that happens, the Turkish Army will come rolling in on brand-new AH-1 Cobra Gunships courtesy of guess "who"?

You're seriously going to have to pick better examples than these. I'll even hand you two: the Kyrgyz Revolution and the extensive liberal reforms in Georgia, although you can hardly give Bush alone credit for them, we just happened to be one of the first supporters of the new governments.

So, it's not as if Bush has been all evil, the administration has done a LOT for Georgia and Yemen as well and they can be proud of their accomplishments there. But don't go and insult sub-Saharan Africa and those who happen to have a good idea of just how HORRIBLE things are there by saying that Bush and Co. have done anything*, let alone "spread democracy" there.

[bennybm]

Where would Scandinavia fall in your list?

My (admittedly not all inclusive, but proves my point) list is relevant only when discussing liberals in the US - as relative liberalism is different in each country.  I think Scandinavia has a mindset that we don't fully understand and isn't really anything with which we can compare ourselves, unless we embrace the entire social system, which I am hoping you aren't suggesting.

[Julie Fern]

Resume the name calling, I suppose.

yes. you putz.

[dividebyzero]

Sweden's great, model to the world, and all...but
The fact that there are some (albeit few, but still) people who still 'celebrate' Kristalnacht, is more than a little frightening to me.