Law School Discussion

GULC Law Students are Awesome.

val

GULC Law Students are Awesome.
« on: January 25, 2006, 07:59:22 PM »
I did not see this discussed anywhere on here, but honestly I only did a quick search. If I were one of those law students I would be so proud of myself:  http://insomnia.livejournal.com/652389.html

Mr Shears

Re: GULC Law Students are Awesome.
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2006, 08:02:56 PM »
That's awesome.  That made me want to read Thoreau again.

2Lacoste

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Re: GULC Law Students are Awesome.
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2006, 09:45:16 PM »
That's awesome.  That made me want to read Thoreau again.

That made me glad I didn't get accepted there (yet). 

As Robert Turner of my probable next school (UVa Law) said, "the least they could've done was quote Ben Franklin correctly."  LOL.

kruddler

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Re: GULC Law Students are Awesome.
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2006, 12:38:30 PM »
Because that's what I want at my law school. A group of kids who try to make their point by stifling discourse. They could have just as easily pressed their side of the issue without ruining the experience for those who wanted to hear Alberto Gonzales speak.

Re: GULC Law Students are Awesome.
« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2006, 12:59:21 PM »
Kruddler - you do realize that this was a silent protest and the AG kept speaking, right?  So the people wanting to hear him speak could in fact still hear him speak?  Sure their vision may have been obstructed but the speech went on.


kruddler

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Re: GULC Law Students are Awesome.
« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2006, 01:05:41 PM »
Yes, I was aware it was a silent protest. Even if he was allowed, at least ostensibly, to keep speaking, a cadre of kids marching through with a sizable banner bearing a quote of apocryphal origin is at least a nuisance, akin to any incident wherein a group of people simulatenously move through a crowded arena.

If those in attendance wanted to hear Alberto Gonzales speak without seeing him, I'm sure Georgetown could have arranged some sort of barrier beforehand.

Re: GULC Law Students are Awesome.
« Reply #6 on: January 26, 2006, 01:29:37 PM »
Considering the speech is still on GULC's website as a podcast and will be for some time, it's not like people can't hear what he said.  It was after all a protest, so it was intended to be disruptive.  But not so disruptive as to make it impossible for the event to continue.  Besides what discourse do you really think the AG would have be willing to engage in with these students?  And how are they stifling discourse among those attending if they are protesting silently?  Do you have a problem with protest in general?  Because if so then it may be not that useful to discuss this.

kruddler

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Re: GULC Law Students are Awesome.
« Reply #7 on: January 26, 2006, 02:30:38 PM »
Considering the speech is still on GULC's website as a podcast and will be for some time, it's not like people can't hear what he said.

Brokeback Mountain's going to be on DVD soon, so I can watch it in the privacy of home if I so choose. But if I go see it in the theater and a group marches in carrying a banner bearing some verse from Leviticus, I'm still not going to be very happy.

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It was after all a protest, so it was intended to be disruptive. But not so disruptive as to make it impossible for the event to continue.

I was not aware protest was inherently intended to be disruptive. I'm not familiar with Georgetown's specific rules on protest and speech, but I assume that there are other high-traffic, high-visibility areas where the group could have protested and voiced their views.

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Besides what discourse do you really think the AG would have be willing to engage in with these students?

The AG wasn't at GULC to have a one-on-one discussion with anyone, least of all the students. He was there to state the government's case on wiretapping. It's rare for any high-ranking federal government official to participate in discourse in the sense of one-on-one, face-to-face discussion. However, as a representative of a government that is democratically elected, Gonzales' statements are part of the formal treatment of issues of law by politicians, pundits and the general public. By protesting as they did, the students didn't take the opportunity to hear his arguments on the issue at hand (wiretapping) and refute them.

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And how are they stifling discourse among those attending if they are protesting silently?

The protesters were interfering with the ability of the atendees to hear Alberto Gonzales defend the wiretapping policy. Instead being able to focus on the issue at hand and reach their own conclusions, the atendees were subjected to an activist dog and pony show replete with pillowcase-clad students and sloganeering.

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Do you have a problem with protest in general?  Because if so then it may be not that useful to discuss this.

Well, I believe in the First Amendment and the rights to freedom of the press, freedom of speech and freedom of assembly, if that's what you mean. Presumably, protest is covered by the freedom of speech, and often the freedoms of assembly and the press.

Re: GULC Law Students are Awesome.
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2006, 03:08:47 PM »
I do actually think protest is inherently intended to be disruptive - certainly to varying degrees - but that's part of what makes it a protest rather than another forum for getting across your viewpoint.  There are many other tactics to use in a social movement, but protest is one that is typically (nearly always) intended to be disruptive.

You were the one who stated that they were stiffling discourse; how so?  If the point of the lecture was not discourse with those in attendence (which these students were) then how is disrupting the lecture stiffling discourse?

Most of the time public protest is not intended to be convenient to the people against whom one is protesting.  In fact, that's part of the point.  While I may not be happy with protesters interrupting a lecture that I was interested in hearing, I would be happy to defend their right to do so.  They took advantage of a chance to get their message to people outside of simply the school via the media.  Protesters typically resort to that form because they have no other way of getting their voices heard.  The office of the President never has a problem getting its message heard but everyday citizens do at times - particularly during a time when the Presidency is spending a great deal of time and effort on getting out one particular message.  It would be just as true no matter what President we had that when the administration wants to get a message out, they can do it.  Ordinary citizens don't have that power.

Under what circumstances would you be okay with a protest?  I understand that you know it is protected under the First Amendment, that does not answer the question of whether you have a problem with protest.  I have a problem with plenty of things protected by the Constitution - hate speech being one of those things.

snikrep

Re: GULC Law Students are Awesome.
« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2006, 05:06:39 PM »
*yawn* they should've gone to Berkeley.

Oh yeah, they probably couldn't get accepted there ;).