US News Rankings Graph 1987-2006

[paran0id]

Its been said here (and elsewhere) that the most important rankings are the 'internal' rankings at firms. Supposedly subtle movement within USNWR ranks (22 to 25 to 21 to 23 etc etc) don't translate into internal rank movement, unless its consistent (ie, from 40 to 25 and stay there for several years). All this said, one obvious question remains: What are the internal ranks? And why do we have our hands on one yet? I find it hard to believe nobody knows a buddy in a law firm that could get his hands on the hiring protocol.

Or maybe internal ranks simply don't exist. It could just be all about the hiring partner's sense of a school (name recognition, alumni he knows from it, faculty he knows teach there, etc). An arbitrary unquantifiable internal-internal ranking system? OMF we're never going to figure this out!!!!

[Fivetides]

Some thoughts

Groupings:
Yale

Harvard
Stanford

Chicago
NYU
Columbia

Cornell
Northwestern
Duke

Michigan
Virginia

Georgetown

Wildcards:
Boalt
Penn (though they have become stable lately)

Upard trend:
Northwestern
Cornell

Downward trend:
Duke


Given that Northwestern seems to be able to consistently raise their ranking, do you think that within about five to ten years we might see another pairing with Chicago and Northwestern like we do with Columbia and NYU, where there is pretty equal competition for students among the two schools?

Also of note, do you think that Boalt's recent upward trend will continue and become consistent (like Penn appears to have done), or do you think that they will continue to be unsteady and with UCLA's slow rise, perhaps ending up very close to normal?  UCLA seems to be establishing themselves as the best school in SoCal, and with the LA market so huge, perhaps they can at some point best Berkely who is the second best school in the smaller SF market.

Thoughts?

If your groupings reflect what current applicants perceive they may well be correct, but I think that law firms would disagree.  The biggest example of this would be NYU, which has just recently been high in the rankings.  From what I have heard, most 50-something hiring partners do not give NYU the same status as lower ranked schools such as Boalt, Michigan, UVA, etc.  If it stays high in the ranking for a long period of time this may change but not in the near future.

[Dunson II]

Bump.

[sara]

Is there any way to find out historical rankings for all schools?

I have data for the top 45 schools (the 45 schools that consistently been in the top 50).   Check out the left side of my LSN profile to see an average of all the rankings: http://www.lawschoolnumbers.com/display.php?user=stuje1

Also, you can find my excely file with all the rankings of the top 45 schools since the rankings began here: http://members.aol.com/stuje1/rankings.xls

XOXO has honorable mention for your chart here http://www.concurringopinions.com/archives/2006/04/us_news_ranking_1.html
(there are additional charts at this site as well)

I have both linked at my blog Stuje1, great work!

[Stuje1]

Hey Thanks Sara.  Yeah, I am actually exclusively a LawschoolDiscussion poster (not on XOXO).  Haven't actually been on here in forever, ever since I started law school (ugh, lots of work).  Anyway, I think I posted a more updated graphs/charts sometime on here (must have got buried).   You can find it here:  http://members.aol.com/stuje1/rank.html
As far as I know, that is more updated then the other linked file.  Glad you enjoy it.

[Bosox]

bump

[Lindbergh]

Some thoughts

Groupings:
Yale

Harvard
Stanford

Chicago
NYU
Columbia

Cornell
Northwestern
Duke

Michigan
Virginia

Georgetown

Wildcards:
Boalt
Penn (though they have become stable lately)

Upard trend:
Northwestern
Cornell

Downward trend:
Duke


Given that Northwestern seems to be able to consistently raise their ranking, do you think that within about five to ten years we might see another pairing with Chicago and Northwestern like we do with Columbia and NYU, where there is pretty equal competition for students among the two schools?

Also of note, do you think that Boalt's recent upward trend will continue and become consistent (like Penn appears to have done), or do you think that they will continue to be unsteady and with UCLA's slow rise, perhaps ending up very close to normal?  UCLA seems to be establishing themselves as the best school in SoCal, and with the LA market so huge, perhaps they can at some point best Berkely who is the second best school in the smaller SF market.

Thoughts?

If your groupings reflect what current applicants perceive they may well be correct, but I think that law firms would disagree.  The biggest example of this would be NYU, which has just recently been high in the rankings.  From what I have heard, most 50-something hiring partners do not give NYU the same status as lower ranked schools such as Boalt, Michigan, UVA, etc.  If it stays high in the ranking for a long period of time this may change but not in the near future.

MV should clearly be grouped right after CCN, and before Cornell/NU/Duke.

[mugatu]

I'm sure retake appreciates your contribution 8 months later.

[Lindbergh]

I'm sure retake appreciates your contribution 8 months later.

I'm assuming other posters besides retake read this thread, which is about historical/ranking reputation generally, and is therefore not particularly time-sensitive.  Is it somehow blocked from all other posters?  If so, let me know.