Law School Discussion

REV. M.L. KING.....recognize!

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Re: REV. M.L. KING.....recognize!
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2006, 03:05:26 PM »
dr. king was a man ahead of our era...we are slowly crawling...he walked upright with eyes straight ahead...

we should follow what his dream was and is...we are humans and although some of us seek perfection...we are not perfect.

the world is not flat...the earth is not the center of the universe...these are "cognitive delusions of an era".

we can travel down the road which most do not...but along the way because we are humans we will slip and fall...dr. king would ask that we rise up and continue...and we should...not everyone does.

the human condition has struggle built into it...again...we are not perfect.

we can strive...today we are surviving...

personally aye get angry when people get caught up in semantics and spelling and righteousness and selfishness...aye will struggle back...it boils my blood...but aye know that coming back to my home base works...

dr. king was drawn to the life of another man:

he entered the temple area and drove out all those engaged in selling and buying there...he overturned the tables of the money changers and the seats of those who were selling doves...and he said to them..."It is written: 'My house shall be a house of prayer,'  but you are making it a den of thieves.

aye stand with the kurds.
 

Re: REV. M.L. KING.....recognize!
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2006, 03:19:13 PM »
dr. king was a man ahead of our era...we are slowly crawling...he walked upright with eyes straight ahead...

Lets walk upright like Dr. King; let's stop being the agressors.  "This is the calling of the sons of God and our brother's wait eagerly for our response."

we should follow what his dream was and is...we are humans and although some of us seek perfection...we are not perfect.

We are not perfect, neither was Dr. King; let's try to be more perfect, as he did; let's stop attacking.

we can travel down the road which most do not...but along the way because we are humans we will slip and fall...dr. king would ask that we rise up and continue...and we should...not everyone does.

Let's rise up and continue; Let's stop killing the poor people of the earth.

the human condition has struggle built into it...again...we are not perfect.

Let's try to be more perfect.  Let's get out of Iraq.

dr. king was drawn to the life of another man:

he entered the temple area and drove out all those engaged in selling and buying there...he overturned the tables of the money changers and the seats of those who were selling doves...and he said to them..."It is written: 'My house shall be a house of prayer,'  but you are making it a den of thieves.


Christ never attacked anyone.  He never killed anyone.  When he overturned tables and drove the moneychangers from the temple he, like Dr. King, was fighting against a system, not against people.  Christ was the greatest advocate for love and forgiveness that this world has ever known.  Dr. King was perhaps the greatest advocate for love and forgiveness that America has ever known.  It is a blatant distortion to pretend as if Christ and Dr. King both advocated violence because of the account of Christ in the temple.

aye stand with the kurds.

I stand with humanity.  I stand with Dr. King.

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Re: REV. M.L. KING.....recognize!
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2006, 08:06:50 PM »
dr. king was a man ahead of our era...we are slowly crawling...he walked upright with eyes straight ahead...

Lets walk upright like Dr. King; let's stop being the agressors.  "This is the calling of the sons of God and our brother's wait eagerly for our response."

we should follow what his dream was and is...we are humans and although some of us seek perfection...we are not perfect.

We are not perfect, neither was Dr. King; let's try to be more perfect, as he did; let's stop attacking.

we can travel down the road which most do not...but along the way because we are humans we will slip and fall...dr. king would ask that we rise up and continue...and we should...not everyone does.

Let's rise up and continue; Let's stop killing the poor people of the earth.

the human condition has struggle built into it...again...we are not perfect.

Let's try to be more perfect.  Let's get out of Iraq.

dr. king was drawn to the life of another man:

he entered the temple area and drove out all those engaged in selling and buying there...he overturned the tables of the money changers and the seats of those who were selling doves...and he said to them..."It is written: 'My house shall be a house of prayer,'  but you are making it a den of thieves.


Christ never attacked anyone.  He never killed anyone.  When he overturned tables and drove the moneychangers from the temple he, like Dr. King, was fighting against a system, not against people.  Christ was the greatest advocate for love and forgiveness that this world has ever known.  Dr. King was perhaps the greatest advocate for love and forgiveness that America has ever known.  It is a blatant distortion to pretend as if Christ and Dr. King both advocated violence because of the account of Christ in the temple.

aye stand with the kurds.

I stand with humanity.  I stand with Dr. King.

the kurds are part of humanity and hussein and sons were the tyrannous system in their home.

Re: REV. M.L. KING.....recognize!
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2006, 02:08:48 PM »
If this is really why you support the war then aren't you a little more than upset that we have no intention of creating a Kurdistan?

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Re: REV. M.L. KING.....recognize!
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2006, 11:34:57 PM »
If this is really why you support the war then aren't you a little more than upset that we have no intention of creating a Kurdistan?

to kurdish tribes...it is already kurdistan...just no dictator...no sons (future dictators) of a dictator...and no ba'ath party murdering their people anymore.

Re: REV. M.L. KING.....recognize!
« Reply #15 on: February 08, 2006, 09:33:18 AM »
to kurdish tribes...it is already kurdistan...

You haven't the slightest clue about that.  Stop being an apologist and start thinking for yourself.  The Kurds want autonomy, but the US won't let them have it because Turkey is holding onto a huge section of Kurds who might break away if they had a Kurdistan to join.  This is just like the breakup of the Ottoman empire where the white, western powers decided where to draw the political boundaries.  Dr. King would clearly and unquestionably be opposed to how the US is treating the Kurds.  The Kurds will never have democratic self-government as long as they are forced to be a part of a government they do not want to be associated with.

I think it is great that the Husseins are gone, but that does not justify this war.  It wasn't the purpose of the war at the outset, and this administration cannot retroactively tell the American people that it is sufficient reason for their support of this war.  Hussein is a murderer, but 'perhaps only his sense of irony can save him when he hears the richest and most powerful nation on earth speak of agression as it fights a war thousands of miles from its shores.'

Get back to Dr. King.  I have heard all the arguments for and against before.  I want to hear you analyze what you think Dr. King would think of this war.  Then I'll leave this alone.

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Re: REV. M.L. KING.....recognize!
« Reply #16 on: February 08, 2006, 11:59:46 PM »
to kurdish tribes...it is already kurdistan...

You haven't the slightest clue about that.  Stop being an apologist and start thinking for yourself.  The Kurds want autonomy, but the US won't let them have it because Turkey is holding onto a huge section of Kurds who might break away if they had a Kurdistan to join.  This is just like the breakup of the Ottoman empire where the white, western powers decided where to draw the political boundaries.  Dr. King would clearly and unquestionably be opposed to how the US is treating the Kurds.  The Kurds will never have democratic self-government as long as they are forced to be a part of a government they do not want to be associated with.
I think it is great that the Husseins are gone, but that does not justify this war.  It wasn't the purpose of the war at the outset, and this administration cannot retroactively tell the American people that it is sufficient reason for their support of this war.  Hussein is a murderer, but 'perhaps only his sense of irony can save him when he hears the richest and most powerful nation on earth speak of agression as it fights a war thousands of miles from its shores.'

Get back to Dr. King.  I have heard all the arguments for and against before.  I want to hear you analyze what you think Dr. King would think of this war.  Then I'll leave this alone.

you are thinking of the kurds in western terms...think of them as individual tribes with a commonality...KURDISTAN has existed since the kurds were in the zagros highlands...about 5200 yrs. ago...longer than most carved out nations today...

think about that, my friend.

you are placing perimeters and not thinking viscerally.

getting rid of hussein and sons was a big step to bringing the kurds a say in their land, economy and future.

i.d.: Kirkuk, Sulaimaniyah, Arbil (Hawler), Duhok, Sinjar, Halabja, Khanaqin and Mandali

aye think rev. king would approve. :)

but as far as any aggressive military action from the usa upon iraq aye believe king would be against.  he would disapprove of both tactics of clinton and bush jr. as presidents in regard to their roles in aggressive military actions.

and as far as any aggressive military action from iraq upon quwait under the hussein regime dr.king would also not condone.

p.s.you haven't the slightest inkling on that.

Re: REV. M.L. KING.....recognize!
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2006, 09:16:34 AM »
but as far as any aggressive military action from the usa upon iraq aye believe king would be against.  he would disapprove of both tactics of clinton and bush jr. as presidents in regard to their roles in aggressive military actions.


That's all I wanted to know.  Thanks.  Even a partisan apologist must admit that Dr. King would disapprove or what we have done in Iraq.

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Re: REV. M.L. KING.....recognize!
« Reply #18 on: February 12, 2006, 10:53:27 AM »
but as far as any aggressive military action from the usa upon iraq aye believe king would be against.  he would disapprove of both tactics of clinton and bush jr. as presidents in regard to their roles in aggressive military actions.


That's all I wanted to know.  Thanks.  Even a partisan apologist must admit that Dr. King would disapprove or what we have done in Iraq.

would rev. king approve?



Talabani: Autonomy for Turkmens in Kurdistan 
 
1/30/2006
The New Anatolian
 
President Jalal Talabani
Ilnur Cevik - The New Anatolian / Baghdad/Erbil

'Kurds working on plan to give Turkmens autonomy in areas they're a majority in new constitution they're drafting for Kurdistan Region of Iraq'

Talabani: Terrorism, Shiite and Arab nationalist extremism are threats. Without US, civil war between Shiite Arabs and Sunnis could be real possibility
Talabani repeats: Arab Shiites have Iran, Arab Sunnis have Arab states and especially Saudi Arabia. We only have Turkey

President Jalal Talabani of Iraq says the Kurds are considering the possibility of giving the Turkmens autonomy in regions where they're a majority in the new constitution that is being drafted for the Kurdistan Region of Iraq. Kurdish leaders are discussing the possibility of granting Turkmens autonomy in the northern regions where they're a majority, the Iraqi president said.

In an exclusive interview in his Baghdad presidential residence, the president, who is also a prominent Kurdish leader, said the new constitution for the Kurdistan Region of Iraq is being drafted in the regional Parliament but did not elaborate when asked how the Kurds would determine where the Turkmens are in a majority.

Talabani repeated that there could be no Kurdish independence, especially without the blessing of Turkey. The Arab Shiites have Iran, the Arab Sunnis have the Arab states and especially Saudi Arabia. We only have Turkey.

The Iraqi president said terrorism and extremism remain serious threats for Iraq, On the one hand you have terrorism while on the other you have Shiite extremism and Sunni Arab nationalist extremism."

He said the worst are the terrorists that belong to the Zarqawi group and al-Qaeda. They regard ordinary Muslims as their enemies if they are not fundamentalists like themselves. They do not regard the Shiites as real Muslims. For them most people who say they are Muslims have actually given up the real practices of Islam and thus they are rejectionists who should be killed. They regard Sunni people who are not fundamentalists like themselves as people who have given up the Islamic faith which they say is the greatest sin. So they kill Muslims irrespective of their faith.

Talabani reported that the Zarqawi people killed some prominent Sunnis recently and that has triggered anger among Sunnis who have demanded arms from the government to fight back.

The Iraqi president said besides terrorists there are also the extremist Sunni Arabs who have been driven to violence because they were angered by U.S. troops, the Shiite Arabs, the Kurds or even by the government. The national unity government can solve this problem. The more Sunni Arabs are involved in the political process and receive benefits the more Sunni extremism will die down.

On a separate occasion when this reporter asked President Talabani when he felt Sunni insurgency would end, he said, In about six months.

He said the Americans are talking to the Sunni Arabs to bring them back into the political process, and said, I must give guarantees to them to get them back.

However Talabani explained that the dialogue between the U.S. and the Sunnis has created concerns among the Shiite Arabs that Washington will help the Sunnis. Shiites Arabs are scared that the Sunni Arabs will make a comeback.

Talabani said this is impossible and that the Shiite majority will continue to play a major role in Iraq.

Asked about Sunni insistence that the Constitution be changed and that the Shiite be denied the right to form a federal entity, Talabani said, That is impossible. No one will accept an alteration of the federal status of Iraq. However we will move to ensure that Iraq is run by a joint leadership of Shiite and Sunni Arabs as well as Kurds. We will also set up a powerful and authoritative National Security Council where all sides will have an equal say. The Sunnis will see that Shiites won't dominate the management of Iraq.

Meanwhile Iraqi intelligence sources in Baghdad told The New Anatolian that some Sunni extremists are being encouraged by covert Iranian groups to carry on violence. They feel that by doing this the Shiite can continue portraying the Sunnis as problem makers and also sever their dialogue with the Americans.

Talabani sees a broad-based government being formed in Baghdad that includes the Shiite alliance, the Sunni Tavafik group, the Kurdish alliance as well as the Iyad Allawi group. But Talabani said he would not rule out the participation of former Baathists led by Salih Mutlak who have eleven seats in Parliament.

Talabani said the former Baathists who have entered Parliament are reducing their opposition to the Constitution. They support federation for Kurdistan and do not even object to Kurdish autonomy provided Kirkuk is not in Kurdistan's borders.

Talabani said the Kurds have become the mediators in Baghdad. The Kurds have emerged as a part of the solution in Iraq and not as the problem. We have become the uniting factor, he stressed.

Asked if the Shiite were really controlled by Iran he replied this is not the case. He said the Shiite Arabs need Iran today because they are not satisfied that the U.S. will help them to guarantee playing a major role in Iraq but that, in the long run, this will not be the case because there are strong fundamental ideological differences in the way the Iranian religious leaders and Arab religious heads interpret Shiite beliefs. The Arab Shiite say Nejef is the Vatican of the Shiite world while the Iranians are trying to promote Qum as the Vatican. Iraqi Arabs do not recognize the religious superiority of the grand ayatollah in Iran, Talabani explained. He pointed out that, according to Shiite beliefs, the leader of the sect has to be a person from the family of the Prophet and thus has to be an Arab.

Asked about demands for the withdrawal of the Americans in Iraq Talabani said no one, including radical Shiite leader Moqtada al-Sadr, wants the Americans to go. Even he says the Americans should present a timetable for their withdrawal.

The Iraqi president said the withdrawal of the Americans would only create a civil war between the Sunnis and the Shiite.