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Author Topic: what race to mark on LS apps?  (Read 9809 times)

pnkldy

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Re: what race to mark on LS apps?
« Reply #70 on: January 30, 2006, 07:52:48 PM »
this post really gets to me.

I too had this dilemma. Like most white people who's families have been in the US since the 17th century, I am part Native American. 1/8-1/4, just like the other students slayed on this post.

Whenever I have been given the opportunity to mark my race, I have chosen Native American, throughout my life, regardless of what benefits/punishments I received. When the census was done 4 years ago, I claimed I was multiracial, because it's finally a choice. Whenever given the opportunity to claim BOTH white and Native American I DO.

When I applied to law school I made it clear I considered myself multiracial. If schools want to "reward" me because of my ancestors struggle, so be it. That's their decision, not mine. I didn't pretend in my essays that my life was full of persecution.

And on another tip... that I am sure is going to piss off a lot of people on this thread... The fact that I am "white" is bitter testimony to my ancesters struggles. My family became white in order to escape persecution. My grandparents picked mates to better blend in to the world they found themselves in. I am not going to abandon their legacy just because someone who has no clue thinks its unethical.

jag227

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Re: what race to mark on LS apps?
« Reply #71 on: January 30, 2006, 08:41:26 PM »
this post really gets to me.

I too had this dilemma. Like most white people who's families have been in the US since the 17th century, I am part Native American. 1/8-1/4, just like the other students slayed on this post.

Whenever I have been given the opportunity to mark my race, I have chosen Native American, throughout my life, regardless of what benefits/punishments I received. When the census was done 4 years ago, I claimed I was multiracial, because it's finally a choice. Whenever given the opportunity to claim BOTH white and Native American I DO.

When I applied to law school I made it clear I considered myself multiracial. If schools want to "reward" me because of my ancestors struggle, so be it. That's their decision, not mine. I didn't pretend in my essays that my life was full of persecution.

And on another tip... that I am sure is going to piss off a lot of people on this thread... The fact that I am "white" is bitter testimony to my ancesters struggles. My family became white in order to escape persecution. My grandparents picked mates to better blend in to the world they found themselves in. I am not going to abandon their legacy just because someone who has no clue thinks its unethical.

My point exactly. I'm glad there is someone in a similar position to me. ;D
Thank you for expressing it in a way I couldn't.

For those of you still complaining about my choice, in my diversity essays I explained my situation, also my religious situation.  My diversity statement however focused on my work with spanish immigrants.

Anyway thanks again

jnc18

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Re: what race to mark on LS apps?
« Reply #72 on: January 31, 2006, 12:28:45 AM »
Like most white people who's families have been in the US since the 17th century, I am part Native American. 1/8-1/4, just like the other students slayed on this post.

Exactly.  Just so we're clear, we've established you're white.  You are a white person

Quote
Whenever I have been given the opportunity to mark my race, I have chosen Native American

Wha-wha-what???  So you are a white person that has chosen to mark Native American?

Most of your ancestor's didn't "struggle", most of them were living off of that struggle.

And jag, the reason you're "fair skinned" isn't because most Chickasaw appear as such.  It's because almost all of your ancestors are white and you are a white person.

So you're telling me you guys get to be white in a white-dominated society and at the same time reap all the benefits reserved for Native Americans?  What a sweet deal!

Having grown up in NC, I know many REAL Native Americans that had to deal with real issues destroying the Native American community, and genetically I'm more Native American than either of you.  So, sorry if I do take offense to your fraudulence.

jag227

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Re: what race to mark on LS apps?
« Reply #73 on: January 31, 2006, 01:02:47 AM »
Jay you don't know your history.  Most of the lineage of chiefs of both the Chickasaw and Cherokee tribes had Scottish immigrants in their lines, the Chickasaw more than the Cherokees. Their children therefore appeared to be european and therefore were easy to marry off during the trail of tears. But they belonged to the chieftan lines therefore making them 100% NA. Because of my direct lines to those individuals both Nations still claim me as a Native American.

SCgrad

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Re: what race to mark on LS apps?
« Reply #74 on: January 31, 2006, 04:26:44 AM »
Does it seem unfair that two people who are not really associated with the Native American culture, with the same amount of NA blood, could be seperated due to one having some document and another not?  I don't think a piece of paper should determine what you are. 

jnc18

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Re: what race to mark on LS apps?
« Reply #75 on: January 31, 2006, 10:26:31 AM »
Jay you don't know your history.  Most of the lineage of chiefs of both the Chickasaw and Cherokee tribes had Scottish immigrants in their lines, the Chickasaw more than the Cherokees. Their children therefore appeared to be european and therefore were easy to marry off during the trail of tears. But they belonged to the chieftan lines therefore making them 100% NA. Because of my direct lines to those individuals both Nations still claim me as a Native American.

It's that I know "my history" so well that makes this so disgusting to me.

Anyway, so you're saying that the "1/6-1/10 pure blood" estimate is not only an oxymoron, it's a falsehood?

I've said my piece and I firmly believe in what I've posted.

cyberrev

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Re: what race to mark on LS apps?
« Reply #76 on: January 31, 2006, 10:42:40 AM »
By the way, 1/8th Native American isn't an URM.  It's your average American.

 :D  :D

Luckily, I have no such dilemmas. My family's names are Chow and Mao, for Christ's sake. I don't know how much more Chinese I could be.

 :D  my eldest son looks like his mom <totally asian> while my youngest son looks like me <totally caucasian, with just a hint of epicanthic folds around his eyes.  he also wears dreads, for god's sake>.

both of them absolutely hate the "mark which one best applies to you" because they dont feel that one aspect of their heritage applies more than another.  it's simply what they are.

redemption

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Re: what race to mark on LS apps?
« Reply #77 on: January 31, 2006, 10:43:13 AM »
this post really gets to me.
I too had this dilemma. Like most white people who's families have been in the US since the 17th century, I am part Native American. 1/8-1/4, just like the other students slayed on this post.

Whenever I have been given the opportunity to mark my race, I have chosen Native American, throughout my life, regardless of what benefits/punishments I received. When the census was done 4 years ago, I claimed I was multiracial, because it's finally a choice. Whenever given the opportunity to claim BOTH white and Native American I DO.

When I applied to law school I made it clear I considered myself multiracial. If schools want to "reward" me because of my ancestors struggle, so be it. That's their decision, not mine. I didn't pretend in my essays that my life was full of persecution.

And on another tip... that I am sure is going to piss off a lot of people on this thread... The fact that I am "white" is bitter testimony to my ancesters struggles. My family became white in order to escape persecution. My grandparents picked mates to better blend in to the world they found themselves in. I am not going to abandon their legacy just because someone who has no clue thinks its unethical.

Which post?

Lilacs04

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Re: what race to mark on LS apps?
« Reply #78 on: January 31, 2006, 10:50:47 AM »
Race is not a matter of what you feel.  It's what's in your blood, for the purposes of these applications. 

This is utter nonsense.


Redemption, I find your argument quite interesting (not being sarcastic). I'm really unsure as to how I feel about this but I have to ask you, what would you think of who is a(n) URM who was adopted and raised by white parents? To take a really famous and extreme example (this has a point, I swear), what about Maddox and Zahara Jolie (or Jolie-Pitt, whatever)? Would it be wrong for them to self-identify as Cambodian and Ethiopian (respectively), as they will have been raised with every luxury and privilege? Do you think it would still be possible for them to bring a uniquely Cambodian or Ethiopian viewpoint to their surroundings? Do people in their circumstances have an ethical obligation to not check the boxes at all? I'm not trying to be confrontational as I have only an objective interest; I really am curious as to what your take on this would be.  :)

cyberrev

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Re: what race to mark on LS apps?
« Reply #79 on: January 31, 2006, 10:51:46 AM »
Ok let's use my case as a case study. I'm thoroughly interested in your opinions. 

I am approximately 1/6-1/10 pure blooded native american. I don't have any tribal card. As I've allready discussed I recently found that I was related to both the chieftans of the Chickasaws and Cherokees.  The majority of my ancestors stayed behind in Alabama during the trail of tears.  Recently I have been able to document 1/12 of my lineage.  The chickasaw tribe used to return to my grandfather's land every year for a tribal meeting. My grandfather practiced the traditions.  My uncles practice the traditions.  My great grandmother was a shaman. Two of my great great great grandfather's were chieftans.  Obviously those before them who are documented were chieftans.  My line is well documented by both tribes. But, I had limited knowledge of this lineage until one year ago. 

Since then I have contacted both the Chickasaw tribe and LSAC.  Both confirmed that I qualify as a native american.  I am eligible for a tribal card with the Chickasaw tribe, but I have not applied. I appear fair skinned as most chickasaw do.  I have marked Native American on my applications.

What do you think about my case?

Do you feel native american? Do you feel that you have suffered disadvantage because of it? Do you feel that you would bring a perspective to your future law school class that is inflected with a "native-american" vantage point. If the answer to all 3 questions is no, then I myself would mark nothing at all on the form. If the answer to any one of these is yes, I would check the "native american" box.



hmmm.  not sure i agree with what i think youre saying.  if the purpose for urm status is to address disadvantage rather than heritage, youre right on.  

however, if it to address heritage, then one could argue, for example, that wealthy african americans, a'la 'fresh prince of bel aire',  having suffered no disadvantage due to their heritage in their lives, should not mark african american?  

i could agree with your premise that the idea of diversity means that people should bring to the table different cultural experiences -- although i doubt that adcomms see the urm issue that way.  i'm not certain, as it applies to urm's, whether disadvantage plays a major role -- if they can get their numbers up.

i may be wrong there, not enough experience to know

just wondering.