2.9 GPA-Looking to get into ASU Law or USD

[ConnorBringas]

Anyone?

[livinglegend]

There are plenty of successful lawyers from all schools and plenty of unsuccessful ones as well. However, if your solely looking to make more money then don't go to law school. Go to law school if you want to be a lawyer and for no other reason. It is a 100,000+ investment and it is accuruin interest as you mentioned. Furthermore, it takes several years after graduating and passing the bar to get any real experience and you have to pay your dues. Most lawyers who graduate pass the bar and can handle it for 3 or 4 years do just fine. However, the 3-4 years right out of law school are tough assuming your lucky enough to pass the bar the first time.

I know hundreds of successful lawyers from every level of school. Many love their jobs and being a lawyer, but there are plenty that regret law school it is a highly personal choice, but being a lawyer is nothing like T.V. portrays it to be and you don't get a J.D. and have people knocking down your door. However, the legal market goes up and down so perhaps when you graduate that is how it will be.

Here is the list of SuperLawyers from every ABA school and there are hundreds from each school. The reality is whether you make it as a lawyer is entirely up to you any ABA school gets you a ticket to the bar exam it is up to you to pass and up to you to make a name for yourself as a lawyer. A few elite schools i.e. Harvard, Yale, Stanford might open doors, but I have seen grads from those schools do unpaid internships right out of school to get experience.

[ConnorBringas]

That is a good point, its tough for me to figure out, "What I want to do." Especially without thinking about the income factor. The loans just scare me to say the least. I was trying to figure out if joining as an officer in the military would help me pay for law school. Im still unsure whether the GI Bill officers receive can be applied to law school after getting out of the navy. Does anyone have an answer to this?

[livinglegend]

Questions like that are better served from the direct source. Call a military recruiter and they will be happy to tell you about all programs they offer. If the military is an option you can also start a career as a JAG lawyer fairly easily after law school. They would likely be able to discuss that with you as well.

An anonymous internet poster will only give you wrong or incomplete information regarding a specific question like that so go to the source. Good luck

[ConnorBringas]

That is true, appreciate your time. On a side note, what is your take on either of these schools?

[livinglegend]

I have been to University of San Diego several times and find it to be a beautiful campus. I also really like San Diego, but I know nothing about the law school itself. I have never set foot in Arizona or gone to Arizona State.

It looks like ASU offers in-state tuition and it is only 21k per year and living expenses are ony 20k per year. So 41k a year for the J.D. 123,000 total

USD is 41k per year and also 21k per year for living expenses, but that will euqal out to 186,000 for the JD.

As I said before the education is basically the same at every ABA school so I won't claim one is any better than the other, but one is definetly cheaper. However, if you want to live in San Diego go to law school in San Diego. If you want to live in Arizona go to Arizona State.

I remember when I was a 0L thinking with enough research I could find the "perfect school" the one that would guarantee everything would work out, but I can tell you that doesn't exist. Just use your common sense and gut. There is no right answer any ABA school will get you a ticket to a bar exam what you do from there is up to you.

[Maintain FL 350]

I've been to both campuses, and have spent a decent amount of time in each city. SD is beautiful, on the beach, and has great weather. Tempe is a cool college town, but the weather is ungodly hot for a good portion of the year. I mean, like 115 degrees during the summer. I think you mentioned that you're from CA, so you'd presumably be paying out of state tuition as well.

USD's campus is nice. Spanish style architecture, palm trees. ASU is much, much bigger and more modern (lots of 1960s architecture). Have you thought about any other CA schools (if that's where you want to live)? Santa Clara, Loyola, Pepperdine, USF, etc are all options.

If you're concerned about debt, consider shooting for substantial scholarships at lower ranked schools, too. I opted for a 75% scholarship at a local school instead of sticker price at a higher ranked school. It was the right decision for me, and worked out just fine. It may or may not be the right decision for you (depending on your goals).

[Maintain FL 350]

Are there any success stories in this forum of people who have completed law school and are earning a decent living? I would be interested in hearing from them, and where they attended school, etc.

This is a huge issue and involves so many different factors that it's hard to distill it down to a succint answer.
 
Here's what I can tell you: as cliche as it might sound, I've known people who graduated from T4s and got great jobs immediately following graduation, and I've known people who graduated from T1s and had to pound the pavement for months and months. Everyone's story is going to be a little different, but there are broad general rules that apply to most people.

Experience

Unless you graduate from an elite school experience and connections will matter more than rankings. In my experience, law students get caught up in rankings more than most lawyers do. It is imperitive that you gain as much meaningful experience as possible during law school. Do internships, work part time at a firm, volunteer at the DA or public defender, anything. I interned for a great, very busy office. They had me writing motions, interrogatories, observing negotiations, even making appearances. I went back to that internship twice and gained tons of experience. The attorneys there all helped me out after graduation with finding a job, wrote letters of recommendation, made introductions, etc. I was told that if a job opened at that office, I'd be first in line. That kind of stuff is worth it's weight in gold, and you'll be amazed at how many of your classmates don't take advantage of such opportunities.

(BTW, I went to a local non-elite law school. Some of the other interns were from big name national schools. Most of us reapplied for a second year of internship at that office, and I was the only one was asked back. I'm not saying that to inflate my ego, I'm just pointing out that once they got to know me it didn't matter where I went to school.)

Expectations

It's important to have realistic, acheivable goals. If you begin law school expecting to be editor of the law review, landing a job a prestigious firm, and making a starting salary of $160,000, you'll likely be disappointed. The people I knew in law school who focused all their energy on obtaining those types of positions were usually frustrated and depressed.

OTOH, the people I knew who focused on gaining good experience, acted with maturity and professionalism, and were good at marketing themselves all seem to have landed jobs. They may not be making great money right now, but eventually they will. If you can accept an initial salary of $45-65,000, you're probably being realistic. You may also have to be willing to move, at least initially. Cities like LA, SF, and SD are more impacted than outlying areas. I also know a few people, even from my non-elite school, who did in fact land high paying big firm jobs. It does still happen. (This is where a scholarship can come in handy, too. Imagine how much easier it is to take a lower paying job when you don't have those huge payments? Lack of debt allows for great flexibility, a huge advantage.)

I don't know how much you make in IT, but there is a good chance you'll make less as a new law grad. However, in a few years you'll be doing better, and long term you can do very well. I met a guy recently who's been practicing for about twenty years. He started a small family law/divorce firm that now brings in a million dollars a year. Not bad, but he probably struggled right after law school.

My point is that if you go into law school with your eyes wide open and with a finger on the pulse of the market, you won't be taken by surprise. In this market you've got to be adaptable and willing to go where the work is. Maybe your dream is to be a prosecutor, for example. Well, if the prosecutor's office isn't hiring, but family law firms are, then you better start learning community property.

Hope that helped!

[ConnorBringas]

Thank you I appreciate both of your replies greatly. It is a tough choice that I am contemplating and it helps to get some insight.

I will take both of your comments into consideration when making a decision.

All the best,

Connor Bringas