Law School Discussion

Nine Years of Discussion
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Poll

What are my chances of being admitted to Berkeley or Davis???

Jesus will return before that day. (impossible)
I'll win the lottery/be struck by lighting before that day. (possible, but almost not)
You've got a 5-20% chance here pal.
The perverbial coin toss.
Worried about admittance??? You'll be getting the full ride.

Author Topic: Fourth Year Teacher, 155 LSAT, 3.25 GPA. Advice Please!!!  (Read 2887 times)

kopacabana

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Re: Fourth Year Teacher, 155 LSAT, 3.25 GPA. Advice Please!!!
« Reply #10 on: July 06, 2012, 06:47:15 AM »
I graduated with a 3.3 gpa from a cal state and a 164 lsat and didnt get into either of those schools.  However, they do take age into consideration, and years out in the real world might work in strongly work in your favor.  If I were you, I would apply anyway.  Have you considered retaking the LSATs? 

Also, as someone who did get into a first tier school.  I would strong advise against going to a school that isnt first or second tier.  (Even the second tier bit might be bad advice.)  There are tons of pizza delivery guys with law degrees who cant pay their bills because of massive student loan debt.  These schools inflate their job statistics to an alarming degree. I went to University of Colorado Law and although the statistic was something like "80% had jobs that with a mean salary of 70,000"  It is total bs.  Less than 10% of us had firm or government attorney jobs at graduation. However they count stuff like intermittent contract work as "employment." Contract work is typically an assignment for a month or two where they pay you $20 and hour and treat you like *&^%, then when they are done with you they spit you out.  I on the other hand, got a job in customer service, making $12/hour, that too was counted as "employment" at CU.  Many others I know are making $40,000 - $45,000 per year working in private business as real estate processors and the like.  Some of my classmates have even gone on welfare.  These people have student loan debt ranging from $60,000 -$120,000.  Their monthly income after taxes is around 3,300 and their monthly loan payments are $500 -$1,000 per month.  The best part is that they will be paying this amount for 10+ years.  This is the reality of the law school situation.  Things have changed A LOT in the past three years.  If you want a real perspective, you need to talk to individuals who have graduated during the past three years.  I strongly advise you to talk to one of these individuals and get a good feel for the job market before you risk you life like this.

kopacabana

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Re: Fourth Year Teacher, 155 LSAT, 3.25 GPA. Advice Please!!!
« Reply #11 on: July 06, 2012, 07:02:13 AM »
I am curious Roald.  Have you actually gotten a job offer? 

Teacher guy:  Another piece of advice is to talk to alumni of the school you get accepted to.  Find out more than just their story, ask them what the job reality is for their whole graduating class.  Most law school classes are small and everybody knows everybody.

Maintain FL 350

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Re: Fourth Year Teacher, 155 LSAT, 3.25 GPA. Advice Please!!!
« Reply #12 on: July 06, 2012, 11:20:16 AM »
I am curious Roald.  Have you actually gotten a job offer? 

Teacher guy:  Another piece of advice is to talk to alumni of the school you get accepted to.  Find out more than just their story, ask them what the job reality is for their whole graduating class.  Most law school classes are small and everybody knows everybody.

Yes, I graduated with a good job offer from a mid-sized firm. Not my ideal job, but I'll take what I can get.

My point is not to deny that the job market is terrible, it is. Most people are graduating with no job offer, and are struggling to find work while juggling high student loan payments. My point is this: you need to put yourself in a position to acquire one of the jobs that is available by gaining experience. Law firms and government offices are operating on smaller budgets than previously, and they're not interested in spending a lot of time training a new lawyer. If you can show up with some experience you stand a better chance.

You mentioned that you wouldn't advise going to a school that isn't first or second tier. I think you and I would both agree that going to a prestigious law school is hugely beneficial, no doubt about it. But consider this: only a handful of the schools ranked in T1 are actually the kind of elite institutions that will get you a job based on pedigree alone. Most T1 schools are essentially good local/regional schools, and don't really carry any weight outside of their immediate geographic region.

Let's say you wanted to practice in Los Angeles. Would you be better off accepting a full ride at Southwestern (T3) or going $150,000 in debt to attend the University of Wisconsin (T1)? Although Wisconsin is a very good school, it's not exactly elite. No firm in LA is going to be so blown away by that degree that they'll offer you a job based on pedigree. Plus, having spent the last three years in Madison, you probably won't have made any contacts in the LA market. I'd argue that in such a tight market graduating from a T3-T4 without debt would better than a non-elite T1 degree.

I also agree with you, kopacabana, that law schools manipulate and twist employment statistics. Don't trust the law schools to get you a job, you've got to make your own luck. 

jack24

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Re: Fourth Year Teacher, 155 LSAT, 3.25 GPA. Advice Please!!!
« Reply #13 on: July 06, 2012, 12:52:52 PM »
I graduated from a solid T2 with no job, but I had multiple offers by the time I was licensed.
It took a lot of work though.  Competition for all jobs, even low paying and government jobs, is absolutely nuts.
It's totally doable from a t2 or worse, but you have to earn it.