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Author Topic: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree  (Read 7597 times)

Opie58

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Re: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree
« Reply #60 on: January 24, 2012, 10:15:43 PM »
Geez, I hope I never have to use you guys as my attorney.  Sure, one state’s ruling is not binding precedence in another state – I get that.  But, you’re telling me using the arguments from one state has NEVER worked in swaying a ruling in another state?  What about “persuasive” precedence?  Sounds like you somehow failed your legal reasoning class, or missed that day … or maybe you’re not real lawyers after all.  Sounds pretty basic to me, something like 1L stuff; maybe all bars should have something like California’s first year law student exam and require ALL law students – ABA and non-ABA – to take and pass before proceeding on to the next years.  And don’t tell that they can rule against you – no kidding – that’s why it’s called persuasive – you have to do your homework, put your arguments together, and do your best to persuade the ruling body the best you can.

LincolnLover

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Re: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree
« Reply #61 on: January 25, 2012, 04:32:32 PM »
Never said never, said might not, learn to read son.


Geez, I hope I never have to use you guys as my attorney.  Sure, one state’s ruling is not binding precedence in another state – I get that.  But, you’re telling me using the arguments from one state has NEVER worked in swaying a ruling in another state?  What about “persuasive” precedence?  Sounds like you somehow failed your legal reasoning class, or missed that day … or maybe you’re not real lawyers after all.  Sounds pretty basic to me, something like 1L stuff; maybe all bars should have something like California’s first year law student exam and require ALL law students – ABA and non-ABA – to take and pass before proceeding on to the next years.  And don’t tell that they can rule against you – no kidding – that’s why it’s called persuasive – you have to do your homework, put your arguments together, and do your best to persuade the ruling body the best you can.

jonlevy

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Re: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree
« Reply #62 on: January 25, 2012, 04:33:31 PM »
Each state has different admission rules so citing a case from one state in another state generally isn't going to be much help. The two cases mentioned so far do not persuade me that DL degree holders would fair very well on petitiuons even with substantial practice experience. If you read enough of these rules, you will see a good number of states go out of their way to ban correspondence degrees from any consideration.  Best chance would be in a state that has non ABA schools.

But on the whole the entire matter is ridiculous, a DL degreeholder can argue a case before the US Supreme Court and US Circuit Courts of Appeal but cannot represent a DUI case in most states. I have nothing but contempt for the entire ABA scam.

LincolnLover

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Re: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree
« Reply #63 on: January 25, 2012, 04:38:02 PM »
People tend to apply to lawschool since they are told they are " good arguers" so they think they can hencluck their way into anything because they will "word it better" and if you call them out on it (but asking a simple "how" and "what about x" they say stupid,cry, and run away because they are "better than you")

Any wonder that the VAST majority don't even make it to finish 2L (in a 4 year plan) ? Dosn't suprise me a damn  bit.
Heck DL admissions and attiritions make 4T's like Cooley and Whittier look like Harvard and Yale.

I respect those who make it all the way to graduate and license since they are winners or one hell of an uphill battle. Easy in, hard out I guess.
I still see why you chose to go to get extra degrees including doctorates and becoming a Prof though. When people see DL they probably think of the ones that make the group look bad, so I can see why adding extra qualifications that even most ABA grads don't have would be a good idea.
If I do go the DL route, I plan to do the same idea Prof.

Each state has different admission rules so citing a case from one state in another state generally isn't going to be much help. The two cases mentioned so far do not persuade me that DL degree holders would fair very well on petitiuons even with substantial practice experience. If you read enough of these rules, you will see a good number of states go out of their way to ban correspondence degrees from any consideration.  Best chance would be in a state that has non ABA schools.

But on the whole the entire matter is ridiculous, a DL degreeholder can argue a case before the US Supreme Court and US Circuit Courts of Appeal but cannot represent a DUI case in most states. I have nothing but contempt for the entire ABA scam.

jonlevy

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Re: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree
« Reply #64 on: January 25, 2012, 06:06:35 PM »
I added the extra credentials because I moved away from California and couldn't get admitted anywhere except DC.  Works for me.  I did the DL route because I tried law school and hated it with a passion.  The lectures caused me mental anguish. Then I saw how lawyers did less work and got paid more, so gave DL a try. My GPA was ridiculously low at Taft but I had no problem with FYBE and Bar.

DL students fail for several reasons:

1.  lack of time commitment
2.  lack of basic reading and writing skills
3.  inability to memorize and retain information
4.  lack of previous exposure to the legal system

Successful DL grads likely would for the most part of have been admitted to a regular law school.

Opie58

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Re: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree
« Reply #65 on: January 25, 2012, 11:09:02 PM »
Well, if my home state won't let me test for the bar, I'll use my CA Bar & practice Federal Law only - more than one way to skin a cat.

LincolnLover

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Re: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree
« Reply #66 on: January 26, 2012, 04:13:55 PM »
what do you consider a low GPA? It couldn't have been too bad if you got into additional grad programs after that.
It is interesting that GPA seems not to have a direct link to bar pass rates. Do you think there is any reason why? Is it different types of testing involved?

I added the extra credentials because I moved away from California and couldn't get admitted anywhere except DC.  Works for me.  I did the DL route because I tried law school and hated it with a passion.  The lectures caused me mental anguish. Then I saw how lawyers did less work and got paid more, so gave DL a try. My GPA was ridiculously low at Taft but I had no problem with FYBE and Bar.

DL students fail for several reasons:

1.  lack of time commitment
2.  lack of basic reading and writing skills
3.  inability to memorize and retain information
4.  lack of previous exposure to the legal system

Successful DL grads likely would for the most part of have been admitted to a regular law school.

LincolnLover

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Re: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree
« Reply #67 on: January 26, 2012, 04:15:47 PM »
Sounds like a good backup plan. Do you plan to actually practice in CA at all, or do you mean that you would just pass the CA bar and make a solo practioner business soley on federal court?

Well, if my home state won't let me test for the bar, I'll use my CA Bar & practice Federal Law only - more than one way to skin a cat.

jonlevy

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Re: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree
« Reply #68 on: January 26, 2012, 08:47:46 PM »
Taft GPA was 2.79 but maybe that was before everyone expected an A or a B by right.  The only testing as I remember it were proctored essay tests.


what do you consider a low GPA? It couldn't have been too bad if you got into additional grad programs after that.
It is interesting that GPA seems not to have a direct link to bar pass rates. Do you think there is any reason why? Is it different types of testing involved?

I added the extra credentials because I moved away from California and couldn't get admitted anywhere except DC.  Works for me.  I did the DL route because I tried law school and hated it with a passion.  The lectures caused me mental anguish. Then I saw how lawyers did less work and got paid more, so gave DL a try. My GPA was ridiculously low at Taft but I had no problem with FYBE and Bar.

DL students fail for several reasons:

1.  lack of time commitment
2.  lack of basic reading and writing skills
3.  inability to memorize and retain information
4.  lack of previous exposure to the legal system

Successful DL grads likely would for the most part of have been admitted to a regular law school.

Opie58

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Re: Where can you get admitted with California DL degree
« Reply #69 on: January 27, 2012, 01:35:07 AM »
Sounds like a good backup plan. Do you plan to actually practice in CA at all, or do you mean that you would just pass the CA bar and make a solo practioner business soley on federal court?

Well, if my home state won't let me test for the bar, I'll use my CA Bar & practice Federal Law only - more than one way to skin a cat.

My vision is to stay in Washington State and do something for Vets – like Veteran & Military Appeals.  Also, Tax Court & Enrolled Agent for low income people has a spark of interest, with a touch in defense at the Fed District Court level, since I’m a 30+ year cop/firefighter/EMT.  Still in the planning/research stages.

I guess the point I attempt to make with people looking at DL schools is that options are available if you look outside the box.  Sure, state legal services are most known, but don’t forget the Federal level; two different sovereigns, two different systems.  You are only limited within your own mind.