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Author Topic: distance learning  (Read 3899 times)

passaroa25

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Re: distance learning
« Reply #10 on: November 28, 2011, 12:31:30 AM »
Why do you think I am wrong?  Have you earned  a JD from an online law school, passed the California bar, published a few articles on various legal issues,  and approached another state about sitting for their bar exam?
Angie

jonlevy

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Re: distance learning
« Reply #11 on: November 28, 2011, 09:27:00 AM »
As a matter of fact I did get a correspondence school JD, have passed two bars including California, am a member of three major bars and dozen minor ones, am a LLD candidate (student), and instruct online.  You say you want to discuss cases but all you offer are unsupported conclusions and opinion. First thing you do with an outliar state court case like Ross is Sheperdize it to see if any other court has cited it for good or bad. Secondly, Ross as a state court case cannot be a binding precedent outside Massachusetts.

fortook

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Re: distance learning
« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2011, 10:26:46 AM »
What other state bar did you pass?  Are you licensed in that state?  Is your LLD program online as well?

Forgive me, but you two look like your are misunderstanding each other.  Neither one comes of as hostile to me and I sense an unnecessary escalation. 

I didn't think anyone has been licensed from an online school outside of Cali, either. I knew it was theoretically possible, but not that it had been done.  Its a huge boot for the legitimacy of online schools, huge.
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Opie58

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Re: distance learning
« Reply #13 on: November 28, 2011, 01:53:25 PM »
Here is another DL law school grad who practices outside California:

James Rice - graduated Taft Law School in Feb 2001, http://www.taftu.edu/tls/honoredgrads.htm -- admitted to the California Bar in June 2001, http://members.calbar.ca.gov/fal/Member/Detail/213670 -- and admitted to the Idaho Bar in April 2002, http://isb.idaho.gov/licensing/attorney_roster_ind.cfm?IDANumber=6511.  Had an email chat with him recently to get is perspective.  Said he petitioned the State for a waiver to take the bar; they granted it without problem.

So yes, people, it can be done.  And I suspect it has been done more often than most of us know.


jonlevy

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Re: distance learning
« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2011, 02:05:32 PM »
What other state bar did you pass?  Are you licensed in that state?  Is your LLD program online as well?

Forgive me, but you two look like your are misunderstanding each other.  Neither one comes of as hostile to me and I sense an unnecessary escalation. 

I didn't think anyone has been licensed from an online school outside of Cali, either. I knew it was theoretically possible, but not that it had been done.  Its a huge boot for the legitimacy of online schools, huge.

Good question:

5 years as a California attorney regardless of law school and you can motion into the DC bar with no problem:

What are the eligibility requirements to apply for admission without examination?
There are two provisions:

a. Having been a member in good standing of a Bar of a court of general jurisdiction in any state or territory of the United States for a period of five years immediately preceding the filing of your application.

or

b. Having been awarded a J.D. or LL.B. degree from a law school which, at the time of the awarding of the degree, was approved by the American Bar Association; having been admitted to the practice of law in any state or territory of the United States upon the successful completion of a written bar examination, with a scaled score of 133 or more on the Multistate Bar Examination (MBE) which the state or territory deems to have been taken as part of such examination, and a 75 scaled score on the Multistate Professional Responsibility Examination (MPRE).


http://www.dcappeals.gov/dccourts/appeals/coa/faq.jsp

The other bar exam is the England & Wales QLTS which requires two years practice experience. The QLTS is still evolving having replaced the QLTT which was a three day open book bar exam! California attorneys however qualify for the QLTS.

I believe California also has reciprocity with the QLTT bar exam for Ireland with 1 years experience:

http://www.lawsociety.ie/Documents/education/qltt/certofeligform.pdf

It also looks like one can motion in Iowa after ten years experience.

LLD is what they call external through UNISA - University of South Africa.

jonlevy

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Re: distance learning
« Reply #15 on: November 28, 2011, 02:07:25 PM »
Here is another DL law school grad who practices outside California:

James Rice - graduated Taft Law School in Feb 2001, http://www.taftu.edu/tls/honoredgrads.htm -- admitted to the California Bar in June 2001, http://members.calbar.ca.gov/fal/Member/Detail/213670 -- and admitted to the Idaho Bar in April 2002, http://isb.idaho.gov/licensing/attorney_roster_ind.cfm?IDANumber=6511.  Had an email chat with him recently to get is perspective.  Said he petitioned the State for a waiver to take the bar; they granted it without problem.

So yes, people, it can be done.  And I suspect it has been done more often than most of us know.

I supported another Taft grad's petition to New Mexico, last I heard it got bogged down but I'll check with him.

jonlevy

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Re: distance learning
« Reply #16 on: November 28, 2011, 02:30:56 PM »
I read this case a little while back.  Ross Mitchell passed the MA bar exam and is working in MA. 

I think that most states will allow someone with an online law school degree to sit for their exam on a case by case basis.  I think that getting published on legal analytical topics is one of the best ways out there that shows them what you can do.  Even ABA law school grads submit a sample of their writing to government agencies and some of the top law firms.  It will not be easy.  But, it is not impossible to get the green light to sit for a bar exam after earning a law degree online.

In theory you are correct, in practice I suspect most petitions falter on the ABA bull:

Mitchell is cited in only one other case by the way:

Nevertheless,  [*13]  the Legislature has conferred upon this Court “exclusive jurisdiction to regulate the admission of persons to the practice of law,” 4 V.I.C. § 32(e), as well as the right to “adopt … the rules for admissions to and governance of the Virgin Islands Bar.” 4 V.I.C. § 32(f)(2). Courts vested with this same power in other jurisdictions have generally held that “the power to waive rules governing admission to the bar can be implied from [the] authority to promulgate such rules… .” Application of Urie, 617 P.2d 505, 510 (Alaska 1980). See also Mitchell v. Board of Bar Exam'rs, 452 Mass. 582, 897 N.E.2d 7, 10 (Mass. 2008) (“This court has the equitable power to waive a particular requirement of a court rule concerning admission to the bar.”) (citing Matter of Tocci, 413 Mass. 542, 600 N.E.2d 577 (Mass. 1992)); Application of Collins-Bazant, 254 Neb. 614, 578 N.W.2d 38, 42 (Neb. 1998) (“This Court has the power to waive the application of its own rules regarding the admission of attorneys to the Nebraska bar.”); Matter of Schmidt, 100 Idaho 729, 604 P.2d 1208, 1209 (Idaho 1980)

http://webservices.lexisnexis.com/lx1/caselaw/freecaselaw?action=OCLGetCaseDetail&format=FULL&sourceID=baicf&searchTerm=eWYh.hGWa.UYGY.UciK&searchFlag=y&l1loc=FCLOW

Opie58

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Re: distance learning
« Reply #17 on: November 28, 2011, 10:08:41 PM »
Here is another DL law school grad who practices outside California:

James Rice - graduated Taft Law School in Feb 2001, http://www.taftu.edu/tls/honoredgrads.htm -- admitted to the California Bar in June 2001, http://members.calbar.ca.gov/fal/Member/Detail/213670 -- and admitted to the Idaho Bar in April 2002, http://isb.idaho.gov/licensing/attorney_roster_ind.cfm?IDANumber=6511.  Had an email chat with him recently to get is perspective.  Said he petitioned the State for a waiver to take the bar; they granted it without problem.

So yes, people, it can be done.  And I suspect it has been done more often than most of us know.

Reading the discussion earlier today, I remembered one important question I failed to ask Mr. Rice - what was the deteremining factor for the Idaho Bar/Court in deciding to grant his waiver.  So, I emailed Mr. Rice and he graciously sent me an answer right away.  He said the determining factor was his taking and passing the California Bar - the accreditation of the school - Taft with DETC - was not a factor.  However, he felt the accreditation would help legitimize the degree if one was looking at using it elsewhere.  Therefore, it helps to think about and envision how you plan to use your degree during your analysis in school and program selection.

jonlevy

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Re: distance learning
« Reply #18 on: November 29, 2011, 01:14:25 PM »
I agree, DETC is of no help with bars but does make a difference iyou want to use the JD for academic purposes.

I checked with the New Mexico peititioner, their app. is still tied up with red tape. They are contemplating going to the NM Supreme Court.

Taft alumni are members of multiple bars, Taft could do better to keep track.

Opie58

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Re: distance learning
« Reply #19 on: November 29, 2011, 01:33:30 PM »