Alternative to University of London - Northumbria University

[cusc2011]

The point I just want to make  to folks interested in the foreign distance learning route is you can take the California Bar with LLB plus LLM.  My advise is to contact the Bar Examiners in each state that that is of interest.  Don't take my word or anybody on this site.  A lot of comments on here are mostly anti distance learning especially foreign distance learning  and they hate the fact that there are other alternatives to gain admission.  I  got my answers I needed from the California Bar Examiners.   There are LLM programs that specifically  gear their program for people who want to take the California Bar.  I can agree this site makes you think but at the end of  the day, get the information from the California Bar Examiners..  Regardless of what the haters say, you can take the California Bar exam and have a few other options as well.

[jonlevy]

I wrote to Northumbria with that very same question, this is what they wrote back which said nothing about California or anywhere else except New York:

You would be best advised to contact a University in the State in which you wish to practise in the US.  You can work in New York with a UK Law degree but you have to do their Bar exams first.  That doesn’t require a practising certificate for you to do them.  A search on the internet should give you the answer.

Kind regards

[name redacted]
Assistant Administrator

School of Law

 

[jonlevy]

My point is not to discourage anyone, I am attempting to state that one should get written confirmation that the contemplated course of study will actually work before investing the time and money. Phone conversations are not evidence of anything while a written ruling by the bar would be binding. especially when a procedure already exists for getting that approval.

[cusc2011]

I did my research on California and I was referring to California bar exam only, but I do plan to contact the NY bar examiners. Again, my point is that a person can take the California bar going the foreign distance learning route. However,  I  have spoken to a  couple 2011/2012 graduates from a US LLM program on ground that have LLB degrees from all over the world not just the UK but in  countries that civil law is their law.  Most of these folks were not lawyers in their country.    The students I spoke with are taking the NY bar, however their ABA LLM is a program that is taken on ground only.  Also, I dont know how they obtained their LLB.  I don't plan to take the NY Bar, but I will plan to do my own research as I did with the  California Bar exam egibility.  However, they are several schools that gear their LLM program to NY bar exam but those program have to be taken on ground but there is still that option for someone to go that route.

[cusc2011]

Bottom Line you can take the California Bar and their are a couple LLM programs and some that are online that gear you to take the California bar.

[Maintain FL 350]

Bottom Line you can take the California Bar and their are a couple LLM programs and some that are online that gear you to take the California bar.

Yes, that seems clear now. You can take the CA bar exam and seek admission to the bar. However, as I asked previously, has anyone actually accomplished this? Has any foreign DL LL.B/DL LL.M holder managed to pass the CA bar exam?

The bar exam is basically your first year of law courses plus the California Professional Responsibility course.  The LLM in American Legal Sudies  or US Legal Studies all have the first year courses that are tested on the bar exam.

The CA bar exam covers much more than first year courses. It also covers Evidence (FRE/CEC), Wills & Trusts, Community Property, Criminal Procedure (separate from Crim Law), California Civil Procedure (in addition to the first year Federal Civ Pro course), and both ABA and CA professional responsibility. It would be very, very difficult to learn these fields of law plus Torts, Property, Con Law, etc, in a one year LL.M course.

I'm sure that it can be done, and some people will pass. But you should be fully informed as to the level of difficulty of the CA bar exam before assuming that a one year LL.M course is sufficient preparation. I don't think anyone here is anti-DL per se, but there are people on this board (myself included) who have actually taken the CA bar and are familiar with it's difficulty. In order to pass you must demonstrate a high degree of competency in many fields of law. Does the LL.M in American Law actually cover all CA bar-tested topics? If not, you'll have to learn them on your own or from BARBRI.

[cusc2011]

If I recall from your previous posts you have a distance learning  law degree from the US.  Why are you so concerned about the foreign route and if someone would be able to pass the bar.  Just curious, you spend a lot of energy debating and countering the topic.  I would expect this from an ABA traditional law graduate but from a person who got a distance learning legal education it is really humorous to have this thing for online foreign legal education,  I have 1 semester at a ABA law school that I attended a long time ago and withdrew in good standings due to personal reasons.  So I am familiar with brick and mortar and distance learning process.

You really expose yourself to being a hater. Are you that upset that the online LLB with ABA LLM may have a few more benefits than a distance learning US degree.  Based on your comments there is something bothering you with the foreign option and if so that is fine just say so, that would be more respectable than just trying to slam it for someone that is interested because it can be done.

As far as knowing someone, yes I've spoken to them but most people who got a degree from XXY school overseas dont go around and saying I got it online or external.  They just say they went  XYZ school. 

I will wait for your negative comment LMAO!

[financialandtaxguy]

Hi Everybody,

Time for me to step back into the conversation.  A little bit of an update, Northumbria now only starts their online LLB program in September of every year.  Some thing else that has changed in the LLB programs in England is that most of the UK Law Schools now have increased their willingness to take students with Bachelors degrees into a "Senior Status" or "Graduate Entry" status LLB program.  This means the required number of years to complete the LLB is shorter.

If you want to see how California treats Foreign LLB's or other Foreign Law Degrees, go to this link on the California Bar website http://admissions.calbar.ca.gov/Education/LegalEducation/ForeignEducation.aspx

All the Best,

Ron

[jonlevy]

It is still questionnable if the the California Bar will accept the online LLB plus online US LLM without first qualifying in England.  The original poster was basing their theory on a phone conversation and not a filing for a ruling by Bar Examiners on the adequacy of the plan under  Rule 4.33. 

[cusc2011]

@ Financialtaxguy -  California Bar Examiners makes no distinction between an online LLB or ground LLB.  I spoke to the Bar Examiners, spoke to the actual person who wrote the rules to the link you provided and I got the 411 from the persons mouth.  I asked all the tough questions that I recieved from this board, the examiner laughed how folks try to interpret the rules and tell them what it suppose to be.  The examiner who wrote the rules was very helpful and broke the rules down for me and even walked me through the process online. 

Also, I personally know someone that graduated from Florida Coastal online LLM in October 2012, they are taking the California Bar in February 2013, their law degree is in civil law.    Also, their are a couple online LLM Programs in American Legal Studies online that gear their curriculum to meet the California Bar Requirements.  Some of the schools are FCSL, Regent, Washington University at St. Louis, and John F. Kennedy.   I have written communication and verbal communication on the first 3 law schools, you dont have to be a lawyer to be accepted in their program, a qualifying LLB will be just fine.