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Author Topic: Too Many Lawyers  (Read 3283 times)

sonofapickle

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Too Many Lawyers
« on: May 21, 2010, 12:41:06 AM »
Do you believe there are just way too many lawyers in the U.S. currently? Many people go into law due to prospective income that they may obtain by being a lawyer.

I believe there are way too many unqualified people becoming lawyers. When I took the series 7 either you obtained a 73 percent or you failed the test. The LSAT, you can score 43 of the questions right out of 5 sections and get into a law school. The LSAT needs to be pass or fail, not score as many questions correct and get into a law school. All you need to score is 10 questions correct in 5 sections out of 23-27/section questions. That is just total b.s. in my opinion. In conclusion, I believe the door to law school which is the LSAT needs to be changed in order to decrease the amount of people trying to become lawyers and to open jobs for people who are lawyers.

What are your views?

Haynes7

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Re: Too Many Lawyers
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2010, 12:50:54 AM »
That's right!  Law school needs to go back to being the elite institution of yesteryear.  A really easy way to limit the number of lawyers is to close law schools.  Also we might consider making it illegal for women and racial minorities to study law (women make terrible lawyers, heck we'd be doing them a favor!).  While were at it why not raise tuition prices that ought to have an impact on the number of people making such an investment (then again maybe not).  Anymore creative ideas for limiting the number of lawyers in this country?  Gotta dream the dream.  Other people's loss is my gain!   

cooleylawstudent

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Re: Too Many Lawyers
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2010, 12:59:28 AM »
Your ideas contradict themselves, if the LSAT was pass or fail only then how would you seperate the higher passers from the minimum standard ones? You'd end up with MORE lower standard lawyers not less. Think man think.

Do you believe there are just way too many lawyers in the U.S. currently? Many people go into law due to prospective income that they may obtain by being a lawyer.

I believe there are way too many unqualified people becoming lawyers. When I took the series 7 either you obtained a 73 percent or you failed the test. The LSAT, you can score 43 of the questions right out of 5 sections and get into a law school. The LSAT needs to be pass or fail, not score as many questions correct and get into a law school. All you need to score is 10 questions correct in 5 sections out of 23-27/section questions. That is just total b.s. in my opinion. In conclusion, I believe the door to law school which is the LSAT needs to be changed in order to decrease the amount of people trying to become lawyers and to open jobs for people who are lawyers.

What are your views?

sonofapickle

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Re: Too Many Lawyers
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2010, 01:05:18 AM »
Less acceptance rates will decrease the amount of people attempting to go into law. I hate lots of people going into the same profession I am going into. As stated before, when I do pass the bar I will live with my parents for at least two years and do volunteer work for different courts helping those who can't afford lawyers. Not because I am trying to build a resume but rather because I love the law and would like some experience (for myself) before trying to find a job. I will still be very young anyway, so I don't see the harm in doing 2 straight years of community service. Even if law does not work out, I have all the prereqs. filled for med-school, so I could just put law aside for a few years, live with the folks, and go to med school for 7 years.

@obstuse: The LSAT being pass or fail would limit the sub-standard lawyers from going to law school. Right now a 143 is a decent score. Passing the LSAT should be around 73 percent of the questions correct, or 70 out of 100 questions answered correctly. That will limit the sub-standard which would limit a lot of people in the field of law. You think.

cooleylawstudent

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Re: Too Many Lawyers
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2010, 01:08:45 AM »
First, planning to live with parents that long says a lot about you as a person.

Second, you dont seem to get it. If its pass of fail only then the LOW scores get viewed the same as the HIGH scores. It would make a 143 and a 180 IDENTICAL. It would reward the low scores and punish the high scores. Its not that hard to understand.

Less acceptance rates will decrease the amount of people attempting to go into law. I hate lots of people going into the same profession I am going into. As stated before, when I do pass the bar I will live with my parents for at least two years and do volunteer work for different courts helping those who can't afford lawyers. Not because I am trying to build a resume but rather because I love the law and would like some experience (for myself) before trying to find a job. I will still be very young anyway, so I don't see the harm in doing 2 straight years of community service. Even if law does not work out, I have all the prereqs. filled for med-school, so I could just put law aside for a few years, live with the folks, and go to med school for 7 years.

@obstuse: The LSAT being pass or fail would limit the sub-standard lawyers from going to law school. Right now a 143 is a decent score. Passing the LSAT should be around 73 percent of the questions correct, or 70 out of 100 questions answered correctly. That will limit the sub-standard which would limit a lot of people in the field of law. You think.

sonofapickle

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Re: Too Many Lawyers
« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2010, 01:14:05 AM »
Pass or fail would limit the amount of lawyers. I couldn't care less about the low scoring (people who got 70/100) people being viewed as high scoring people. At the end of the day, those who pass will be a fraction of the law students in law school today. Look at financial advisers/broker-dealers, are they in influx? No, the reason being is that the series 7 is one tough ass test and either you pass or fail. 

cooleylawstudent

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Re: Too Many Lawyers
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2010, 01:22:57 AM »
How do you think making a D- and an A+ equal will "weed people out"?

Pass or fail would limit the amount of lawyers. I couldn't care less about the low scoring (people who got 70/100) people being viewed as high scoring people. At the end of the day, those who pass will be a fraction of the law students in law school today. Look at financial advisers/broker-dealers, are they in influx? No, the reason being is that the series 7 is one tough ass test and either you pass or fail.

sonofapickle

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Re: Too Many Lawyers
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2010, 01:29:40 AM »
73 percent is a C- not a D-. Let me break it down for you so you will understand as you are having a hard time... People who score 68-69 questions correctly out of 100/103 score is 159/180. A person who scored 158-9 is above 79 percent of the people taking the test. Now, make the same test and have a pass or fail score of 70 answered correct or more and you fail a lot of students. The average person going to law school will be in that 20 percent body that scores above 159, as you will need a 160-62 or more to pass the actual LSAT. That means your raw score must be 70 questions correct.

cooleylawstudent

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Re: Too Many Lawyers
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2010, 01:36:39 AM »
How little you know. 73% is D in a lot of undergrad programs and an A in lawschool.

That being said REGARDLESS of what you decide the minimal passing score is(the equivelent of a D) making it the same as the top(the equivelent of an A) is just punishing those who do well. It's like communism, why try to do so better if you don't get rewarded for it?

73 percent is a C- not a D-. Let me break it down for you so you will understand as you are having a hard time... People who score 68-69 questions correctly out of 100/103 score is 159/180. A person who scored 158-9 is above 79 percent of the people taking the test. Now, make the same test and have a pass or fail score of 70 answered correct or more and you fail a lot of students. The average person going to law school will be in that 20 percent body that scores above 159, as you will need a 160-62 or more to pass the actual LSAT. That means your raw score must be 70 questions correct.

sonofapickle

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Re: Too Many Lawyers
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2010, 01:42:27 AM »
First, get it out of your head of a 73% being a D. It is only a D on a 5 GPA scale, not a 4,0 GAP scale. To fix it for you so you will understand better, 73% (on 4.0 scale), 83% (on a 5.0 scale). I am using my own scale of grading, not your grade scale. But, to make it even more easier, all people taking an LSAT need to get a 160 or better to be admitted into law school. You got a 159? Failed.