US NEWS RANKINGS leak (2011)

[vansondon]

Yea rankings are the most important thing I see that Gonzaga and Maine are no longer in the top 100 and I heard the all the professors immediately turned into flesh eating zombies. Then Everyone that ever graduated from those schools was immediately fired and had their membership to the bar revoked.  That is just how important the rankings are.

I also like how they give 10 schools the same rank. 5 ranked #98, 5 schools ranked #93, 6 schools ranked #86, 6 schools ranked #80, only 2 ranked #78, 6 ranked #72, 5 ranked #67, 3 ranked #68, 4 ranked #60 and the list continues at least the Cooley rankings have the balls to give each school a number even if it is based on how many chairs each school has at least you can measure that.

The sheer ridiculousness of the rankings amazes me it is the most brilliant scheme of all time. U.S. News just came up with a ranking based on a formula which makes absolutely no sense. It is about 80% based on pure subjective feelings of unidentified individuals. If you look at the formula the most importatn consideration that any law school has is the LEAST important in the U.S. news rankings and that is bar passage rate. The bar passage rate makes up %2 of a schools U.S News ranking.  So a school could techncially be number #1 in the U.S. rankings and have a 0% bar passage rate. Since bar passage makes up only %2 of your ranking.  Really take a second to look at how U.S. News comes up with the rankings it is amazing how idiotic the formula is. As a result of it being so stupid every official law school organization. ABA, LSAC, AALS all adamantly refuse to acknowledge the rankings and have given nothing, but their utter disapproval of the rankings and each of their websites has a disclaimer on saying ignore the rankings, because they are irrelevant.

Common sense will tell you Harvard is a better school than Williamette, I hope if you are considering law school you are smart enough to know that. However, distinguishing between Florida International University and California Western really does not matter. Honestly, to anyone considering law school do not take these rankings seriously. Use common sense when choosing your school of course, but do not base your decision on these idiotic rankings.  Especially since they will change dramatically every year you can be a tier 2 one year then a tier 4 the next. USF has made another drastic drop I see although they made a drastic rise last year. To show the complete unpredictability (unreliablity) of the rankings look at USF's rank over the last 4 yeras   years in 2008 They were 72 in 2009 they went to tier 3 which means 100-something in 2010 they went to 78 I think and now they are to 98. That is just one example of how unpredictable and unreliable the rankings are.  I can't imagine what has really changed at USF over those 4 years to warrant that kind of deviation, but I am sure nothing changed at all. U.S. News is just a complete joke and really don't take them seriously. 

The most sensible thing ever said about the rankings!

[TheDudeMan]

While I agree the rankings are generally ridiculous once you get out of the top 25 or so schools, it's always people that don't have good stats and aren't going anywhere worth going that complain about how ridiculous they are.

Your 155 LSAT and half-cocked GPA puts you in the world of average.....  So of course you bash the system.

[bigs5068]

I am not a genius I never claimed to be.  Yes Harvard is a great school and I don't have a problem with them ranking those schools, because the top 25 is somewhat relevant, just like the NCAA ranks the top 25 teams, but outside of the top 25 it doesn't matter. Even then it is just a rank and at the end of day it is up to you to find a job, pass that bar and continually perform as a lawyer.

The only reason I wrote this is to warn the AVERAGE people like me who get 155 LSATS and have to choose between tier 2', tier 3's and tier 4's. We can't all be self-proclaimed geniuses like yourself. So my warning for students like me who are deciding where to go next fall based on these rankings is that I almost went to Michigan State based on there tier 3 ranking and it might even be a tier 2 soon enough, but at the end of the day it is not really any better than GGU. I wanted to live in San Francisco after graduation, because I love this city and the truth is a San Francisco employer is more likely to hire a GGU grad than a MSU grad and I would imagine a Detroit employer is more likely to hire a MSU grad. Also GGU will prepare you more for the California Bar and MSU will prepare you for Michigan's. Obviously, University of Michigan that is a differnt story, but it was the difference between 102 and 132 so it really didn't matter. Bottom line if you are one of the AVERAGE people like me choose your school based on location, or a special program, or a clinic that is of interest to you, or obviously scholarship money. However, DO NOT MAKE YOUR DECISION based on these rankings if you are choosing between tier 2, tier 3, tier 4 it is probably better to take scholarship money and go to a lower ranked school.

I know 3 people who are upset about relying on the rankings. These three people transferred from GGU to USF and Santa Clara and they are upset because they lost out on 80,000 of scholarship money from GGU. So they went from U.S. 132 to U.S. 98 and really is it worth 80,000 probably not and they don't think so one of them has an internship with two people from his 1L section in GGU so he ended up in the same place he would have had he not transferred, but he is just 80,000 more in debt by taking these idiotic rankings seriously. Honestly, common sense would tell you that Santa Clara is not that much better than GGU, certainly not 80,000 worth. neither school is really going to have people drooling over you. Had he transferred to Stanford that is a different story and again common sense would have made you realize Stanford is better than GGU and you probably did not need U.S. News to tell you that. So bottom these rankings are highly dangerous to base your decision and should not be taken seriously. Use common sense when choosing your school.

[TheDudeMan]

When choosing schools outside of those in the rankings loop, you should choose based on where you will be happy living and working for the rest of your life.  Reality is that outside the top 25-30 schools, you aren't getting out of your local city unless you are top of the class, and even then it's a long shot for major markets.

[cooleylawstudent]

who says that you have to live where you graduate? I have Canucks in mine.

When choosing schools outside of those in the rankings loop, you should choose based on where you will be happy living and working for the rest of your life.  Reality is that outside the top 25-30 schools, you aren't getting out of your local city unless you are top of the class, and even then it's a long shot for major markets.

[CJScalia]

who says that you have to live where you graduate? I have Canucks in mine.

When choosing schools outside of those in the rankings loop, you should choose based on where you will be happy living and working for the rest of your life.  Reality is that outside the top 25-30 schools, you aren't getting out of your local city unless you are top of the class, and even then it's a long shot for major markets.

It's extremely difficult to get employed outside the region of your school if your school falls below the T14, and more and more difficult the deeper you fall.

[bigs5068]

Yes completely true and just another reason to not take the rankings seriously at the end of the day location is 100x more important than whatever their idiotic formula says. Common sense tells you that Harvard, Yale, Stanford will open a lot of doors for you. However, GGU has more pull in San Francisco than Gonzaga. Gonzaga has more pull in Seattle and Spokane than Florida State. Just down the line almost every law school except the elite ones are regional and to all future students DO NOT BASS YOUR RANKINGS BASED ON THIS FORMULA USE COMMON SENSE!

[CJScalia]

I'm not quite sure I agree with that, rankings really do matter. It sucks, but it does.

[bigs5068]

Of course they matter somewhat I mean Hastings is definetly better than GGU no question about it, but when I lived in New York nobody even knew about the California schools I had wanted to go to Pepperdine and not one attorney on my team had even heard of  Pepperdine or knew it was. Despite Pepperdine being ranked 50 they had no idea about it, they asked if it was one of the CBA approved schools when I told them and I was like no it is ranked a school and the consensus they had never heard of it. They were all familiar with Touro, Seton Hall, Rutgers and the lower ranked schools that is where people they deal with went and what was around.  Certainly Cardozo or NYU is going to open a lot more doors in New York than Touro or NYLS is, but location really does mean a lot more from my limited experiences.

[CJScalia]

If no attorney at your firm had heard about Pepperdine, you should take aim for the door, pack your *&^%, and run as fast as you can.