Law School Discussion

Nine Years of Discussion
;

Author Topic: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS  (Read 29703 times)

the white rabbit

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 362
    • View Profile
Re: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS
« Reply #40 on: May 16, 2010, 04:44:40 PM »
mabey dumb people piss him off.  :P

So then is he being militant or does it just seem that way?  Make up your mind!
Mood: Tired but cheerful.  :)

cooleylawstudent

  • Guest
Re: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS
« Reply #41 on: May 16, 2010, 04:46:16 PM »
just because you are too simple to understand the world dosn't make the world imaginary.

the white rabbit

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 362
    • View Profile
Re: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS
« Reply #42 on: May 16, 2010, 04:49:00 PM »
just because you are too simple to understand the world dosn't make the world imaginary.

Don't blame your indecisiveness on my simplicity.
Mood: Tired but cheerful.  :)

cooleylawstudent

  • Guest
Re: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS
« Reply #43 on: May 16, 2010, 04:53:35 PM »
if you dont like the answer, change the question..... ::)

the white rabbit

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 362
    • View Profile
Re: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS
« Reply #44 on: May 16, 2010, 04:56:52 PM »
if you dont like the answer, change the question..... ::)

I like it when you give out tips on the art of evasion.  It's quite useful you know.
Mood: Tired but cheerful.  :)

bigs5068

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 1474
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS
« Reply #45 on: May 20, 2010, 02:43:16 AM »
The one poster talking about side hustles etc.  made some good points like I said I didn't understand all the details of financing  in whatever health field he is going into. If it takes a month to get that CN certificate and it only costs a few hundred bucks it sounds like a great plan. He is 100% right it is always good to have a side hustle without question. If you have a J.D. with some other tangible skill whether it be language or computer science I think it makes you a lot more marketable.

He is absolutely right 30,000 is an outrageous amount of money to pay for law school, but that is the way it is and I don't think it has ever been cheap. However, there are the CBA schools which offer a ridiculously cheap option or FIU, South Dakota, or North Dakota, CUNY, and maybe a few others that are nowhere near 30,000 between 6,000-12,000 a year which is a lot more reasonable. Had S.F. had an ABA school that offered the cheap tuition I would have gone there.  I know JFK is here, but I want an ABA approved school, because I may at some point want to leave California. However, in regards to your complaints about costs there are CBA schools and those 4 state schools which are a lot more reasonably priced if you really want to be a lawyer.

I never try to be militant maybe I came across that way and it seems you have thought outside the legal bubble but even nursing school is quite expensive or so I thought and I don't believe it is that much safer of a profession than the legal field. I imagine there are a lot of employed nurses and I imagine there are nurses looking for work just like any other profession.  People get the ax in healthcare industries etc I imagine, but again I have no idea about how hospitals run etc. 

All I was saying if you want to be a lawyer then you should go to law school, but if money is your main concern a J.D. is not the best bet and it sounds like you are more concerned with money than the profession you enter into which is completely fine.  In my opinion I would rather do something I like and struggle financially than do something I dislike or am indifferent about and have money, but that is just me and money is certainly is nice to have.  Your job is going to last a lifetime and nursing, J.D., M.B.A, whatever you choose to do you will be working in that field for a LONG time your entire working life which will probably be 30 to 40 years so I personally think it is best to choose a path you will enjoy the most.  Law school is ridiculously expensive and it really shouldn't charge as much as they do, but I want to be a lawyer so I have to deal with the outrageous price tag.   


legalized

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 136
    • View Profile
Re: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS
« Reply #46 on: May 21, 2010, 08:29:06 PM »
The one poster talking about side hustles etc.  made some good points like I said I didn't understand all the details of financing  in whatever health field he is going into. If it takes a month to get that CN certificate and it only costs a few hundred bucks it sounds like a great plan. He is 100% right it is always good to have a side hustle without question. If you have a J.D. with some other tangible skill whether it be language or computer science I think it makes you a lot more marketable.

He is absolutely right 30,000 is an outrageous amount of money to pay for law school, but that is the way it is and I don't think it has ever been cheap. However, there are the CBA schools which offer a ridiculously cheap option or FIU, South Dakota, or North Dakota, CUNY, and maybe a few others that are nowhere near 30,000 between 6,000-12,000 a year which is a lot more reasonable. Had S.F. had an ABA school that offered the cheap tuition I would have gone there.  I know JFK is here, but I want an ABA approved school, because I may at some point want to leave California. However, in regards to your complaints about costs there are CBA schools and those 4 state schools which are a lot more reasonably priced if you really want to be a lawyer.

I never try to be militant maybe I came across that way and it seems you have thought outside the legal bubble but even nursing school is quite expensive or so I thought and I don't believe it is that much safer of a profession than the legal field. I imagine there are a lot of employed nurses and I imagine there are nurses looking for work just like any other profession.  People get the ax in healthcare industries etc I imagine, but again I have no idea about how hospitals run etc. 

All I was saying if you want to be a lawyer then you should go to law school, but if money is your main concern a J.D. is not the best bet and it sounds like you are more concerned with money than the profession you enter into which is completely fine.  In my opinion I would rather do something I like and struggle financially than do something I dislike or am indifferent about and have money, but that is just me and money is certainly is nice to have.  Your job is going to last a lifetime and nursing, J.D., M.B.A, whatever you choose to do you will be working in that field for a LONG time your entire working life which will probably be 30 to 40 years so I personally think it is best to choose a path you will enjoy the most.  Law school is ridiculously expensive and it really shouldn't charge as much as they do, but I want to be a lawyer so I have to deal with the outrageous price tag.

I understand your points.

Some cosmetic adjustments:

"He" is a "she"...lol I'll forgive you this time.

I'm sorry it sounds like I am in for the money.  Money is, however, a legitimate concern for anyone who has ever experienced truly not having ANY, like I have.  My reasons for doing law have zero to do with money, cause I actually decided to go for it BECAUSE of the state of things: If times are so hard across the board, I might as well be having a hard time doing what I REALLY want to do with my life, and not having any regrets about it!

That said, I am not dumb enough to chase my dream in an impossible way.  I research a lot, as you can tell, and while I recognize the pros of each field, I recognize the cons.  But it's not shallow for someone to say if they can't afford to attend law school in the areas in which they are willing to live and work, they won't go.  People who don't have money HAVE to be concerned about money, it's disingenuous (and downright dumb of them) to pretend otherwise.

You are right though that should not be the ONLY reason someone considers a field.  They also need to consider what the downsides are to any field with a ashortage (the word shortage should be a big hint, but it seems to make people think more that it's automatically easier)...and whether they actually have the innate talents required.

Those last two people don't even bother thinking of after they have established the pay and the availability of jobs.  Just because people CAN get a loan and go study something doesn't mean they SHOULD.

People would be surprised to see the schools I find when I search the ABA guides that have an attrition rate less than 5% and a bar passage rate 90% or better.  Some of them are schools that get laughed at.

Which reinforces what you say about people not thinking T14 = God incarnate and what I say that people need to stop being sheep-like and put their research and analytical skills to use from now.  Maybe we should consider that the folks with 170s who got in somewhere and got duped due to lack of research are not quite so bright as the LSATs led them to believe. lol

bigs5068

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 1474
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS
« Reply #47 on: May 22, 2010, 12:20:30 PM »
I never said it was shallow to chase money. I don't have any myself and the debt I have accumulated even with a scholarship is scary.  I think law school is a massive risk and there are about 327 better ways to make money.  I just really enjoy the law and want to be lawyer and worked some crapp** jobs after college, but then I started working in law firms and I liked it a lot, more than any other job I have ever had and I have probably had 8 or 9 jobs in different fields in undergrad and for a year or so after college, but working in law firms I really liked so that is why I am in law school.
 
I really think if you go to law school, because you don't know what else to do or are simply going, because you like Law & Order you are probably not going to be happy.  I really think anybody considering law school should work as a paralegal for a year or two and if possible get a cheap paralegal certificate. This way you will know if it is something you even want to do and having some legal experience before going to law school is huge in my opinion, because in each interview I have gotten they were impressed that I had experience doing actual legal work. This is only based on my limited experience, but I have not gotten a job I interviewed for the summer and I think it has a lot to do with having legal experience.  You never know why someone chooses to hire you over somebody else, but that is what I think the reason is.

legalized

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 136
    • View Profile
Re: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS
« Reply #48 on: May 22, 2010, 01:48:59 PM »
I never said it was shallow to chase money. I don't have any myself and the debt I have accumulated even with a scholarship is scary.  I think law school is a massive risk and there are about 327 better ways to make money.  I just really enjoy the law and want to be lawyer and worked some crapp** jobs after college, but then I started working in law firms and I liked it a lot, more than any other job I have ever had and I have probably had 8 or 9 jobs in different fields in undergrad and for a year or so after college, but working in law firms I really liked so that is why I am in law school.
 
I really think if you go to law school, because you don't know what else to do or are simply going, because you like Law & Order you are probably not going to be happy.  I really think anybody considering law school should work as a paralegal for a year or two and if possible get a cheap paralegal certificate. This way you will know if it is something you even want to do and having some legal experience before going to law school is huge in my opinion, because in each interview I have gotten they were impressed that I had experience doing actual legal work. This is only based on my limited experience, but I have not gotten a job I interviewed for the summer and I think it has a lot to do with having legal experience.  You never know why someone chooses to hire you over somebody else, but that is what I think the reason is.

If you can think of 327, or even 27, better uses of your time and money than law school, you maybe should be doing one of those than this. lol

I have read law schools do NOT like people with "pre-law" majors or other legal education prior to the JD.

People can just volunteer to shadow someone in a field of law they are interested in for a week or a month to see if they like it. No need to waste years of one's life playing house.  People only have one life to live, they have to take a little less time than that to be decisive and mature about what they are doing with it.  Two years are not promised to anyone.   Researching the pros and cons of whatever you are interested in on the net and from the people in the trenches now cuts all that time wasting by 2/3.

IMO of course.

bigs5068

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 1474
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: 1L Attrition Rates : Beg the ABA to do away with ALL these CESSPOOLS
« Reply #49 on: May 22, 2010, 03:54:06 PM »
I simply said money, I really enjoy law school a lot if I won the lottery I would probably still be doing it.  You don't have to wait two years etc, I don't think schools really care much what you did before law school. All they care about his UGPA and LSAT and maybe personal statement etc makes up no more than 5% of your admissions decision. 

I think it is good to work in a law firm and just know what you are getting into, my first year of law school would not expose to anything about lawyers do on a day to day basis and I think you should work in it for a year to see if you would enjoy it. If you are going to commit 100k and 3 years of your life, it might be worth spending a year of time working in the environment. Obviously, you don't have to and plenty of people don't I just think it helps and a lot of people complain when they actually go into their 1L or 2L job and realize law school is not very similar to go to law school. Again that is just my opinion, maybe some people think law school is complete preparation and I am only a 1L so I imagine there is a lot more to learn.