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Author Topic: prosecute torturers!  (Read 8941 times)

Julie Fern

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Re: prosecute torturers!
« Reply #140 on: April 23, 2009, 03:58:22 PM »
It doesn't make us foolish to expect us to try to avoid torture. Its foolish if we believe it will actually work.

On a side note, I am vehemently against torture of people who are innocent of crimes, or people who fight against us legally under the rules of war, but for people who are terrorists and are illegally fighting us i could care less what happens to them.

Somehow, I don't think we wait until there's been a jury trial and the person is found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt before we start to torture.

Then there's that whole pesky "found guilty now, but was really innocent" thing...

So I guess my (rather long-winded) point is that it's pretty difficult to guarantee that the person is 100%, beyond a shadow of a doubt guilty. And even if the person was guilty, this goes back to HB's earlier point about torture being an ineffective method for obtaining information. So if it's not for informational purposes, exactly what is the point of the torture? Just for shits and giggles? Retribution? Either reason isn't acceptable, IMO.

The quote you bolded didn't really pertain to terrorism in general. I should have explained it better. I meant that more of a Spanish Inquisition type torture where they just go around and do it for the hell of it.

As for torture in general, I don't believe its the best way to get information, and is for the most part ineffective. However if it works 1 time in 1000, on someone who the evidence points to them most likely being a terrorist, then its worth it. My whole point wasn't really for or against terrorism per se, I just wanted to state my opinion that I could care less what happens to a partisan guerilla, which is what terrorists are.


Now its Lindy Nap time

how supposed tell one time from other 999?

this tortured logic indeed.  julie glad grown-ups now in charge.

sheltron5000

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Re: prosecute torturers!
« Reply #141 on: April 23, 2009, 04:04:59 PM »
It doesn't make us foolish to expect us to try to avoid torture. Its foolish if we believe it will actually work.

On a side note, I am vehemently against torture of people who are innocent of crimes, or people who fight against us legally under the rules of war, but for people who are terrorists and are illegally fighting us i could care less what happens to them.

Somehow, I don't think we wait until there's been a jury trial and the person is found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt before we start to torture.

Then there's that whole pesky "found guilty now, but was really innocent" thing...

So I guess my (rather long-winded) point is that it's pretty difficult to guarantee that the person is 100%, beyond a shadow of a doubt guilty. And even if the person was guilty, this goes back to HB's earlier point about torture being an ineffective method for obtaining information. So if it's not for informational purposes, exactly what is the point of the torture? Just for shits and giggles? Retribution? Either reason isn't acceptable, IMO.

The quote you bolded didn't really pertain to terrorism in general. I should have explained it better. I meant that more of a Spanish Inquisition type torture where they just go around and do it for the hell of it.

As for torture in general, I don't believe its the best way to get information, and is for the most part ineffective. However if it works 1 time in 1000, on someone who the evidence points to them most likely being a terrorist, then its worth it. My whole point wasn't really for or against terrorism per se, I just wanted to state my opinion that I could care less what happens to a partisan guerilla, which is what terrorists are.


Now its Lindy Nap time

how supposed tell one time from other 999?

this tortured logic indeed.  julie glad grown-ups now in charge.

me too!
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dashrashi

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Re: prosecute torturers!
« Reply #142 on: April 23, 2009, 06:33:53 PM »
Every time I look at this thread title I see "Torture Prosecutors!" 

I guess that's just me seeing what I want to see.
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Julie Fern

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Re: prosecute torturers!
« Reply #144 on: April 23, 2009, 06:59:50 PM »
hah!

Julie Fern

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Re: prosecute torturers!
« Reply #145 on: April 24, 2009, 09:49:41 AM »

Julie Fern

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Re: prosecute torturers!
« Reply #146 on: April 24, 2009, 10:30:27 AM »
clearly you understand little about politics.

Julie Fern

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Re: prosecute torturers!
« Reply #147 on: April 30, 2009, 02:45:17 PM »

! B L U E WAR R I O R..!

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Re: prosecute torturers!
« Reply #148 on: May 01, 2009, 12:59:42 AM »
...oh? do people believe that the us military/cia tortured khalid sheikh mohammed?

woops...

and if you think that "waterboarding" was the worst he experienced to offer up information...k.s.m. was captured in pakistan in march 2003 and finally was brought to cuba in september 2003...so? all you newbies should let your imaginations out for a walk...

then perhaps you should look up the definition of naive.

aye'm going with bam' on this one...

recognize...and move on...


like some other questionable things our nation has done...like dropping atomic bombs on japan.


the example of k.s.m. as a "victim" of torture was no accident...if he is the posterboy...then "waterboarding" is going to be one big "woops"...face reality, folks...

there are some great methods to garner information from subjects that use psychological techniques which are far more effective and craftier than bodily harm...


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Julie Fern

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Re: prosecute torturers!
« Reply #149 on: May 01, 2009, 08:42:56 AM »
julie sure you have tried all torture techniques on your pets.