The Sopranos

[Pardon Johnny Cash.]

The only thing that bothered me with the show is that it's a left wing dream.  The right wing always comes off as of moderate intelligence and conniving.  It's like the good guys defeat the evil conservatives all the time.  I'm a conservative democrat and feel that many of the very legitimate conservative positions are marginalized.

Right, but I don't think Vinick fit into that mold.  He always seemed smarter than Santos.

We can resume this conversation after you've watched season 7.  I don't want to reveal anything.

[Private David Lewis]

Oh, I've seen season 7.  I think it was someone else who hasn't. 

[Pardon Johnny Cash.]

Oh, I've seen season 7.  I think it was someone else who hasn't. 

Ohhh.... I felt Vinnick was never supposed to win.  I thought it was obvious from the beginning that Santos was going to win.  It was still the liberal day dream with the ultra liberal beating the centric liberal.  Although I am a democrat, I just hate how the intelligent, sensical, and able conservatives seem to be largely absent from the show.  It's a story largely told from the very liberal perspective. 

The only deviation from this was the discussion about school vouchers.  I thought this was a real bright spot.

[Private David Lewis]

Oh, well I heard the opposite.  I heard Vinick was originally supposed to win, and they actually intended on continuing the show with him as president, but then the network canceled the show, and they decided it would be more conclusive if Santos won.  And I never thought of Vinick as a centrist at all.  If anything he seemed very libertarian, which I would consider more right-leaning than someone like McCain.  For liberals though McCain and Vinick are both "centrists."   

I forget what vouchers convo you're talking about.  I remember there was a vouchers conversation in the first or second season between Sam and Leo's daughter where Sam rambled on about the virtues of the public school system. 

[Pardon Johnny Cash.]

I remember that convo as well and thought the idea of "our schools should be like cathedrals" as pretty silly.  The concept that we can make our public school systems uniformly adequate is ridiculous.  There was an episode where Bartlett really thought about school systems and asked Charlie what he thought about vouchers.  Charlie mentioned that he wished they had them when he was at school and he could have attended somewhere much better.  It was one of the few times that the show presented the wisdom of a traditionally republican idea.  I think vouchers make a lot of sense from a liberal standpoint, however, with the stance of teachers unions and religious institutions - it's flip flopped.  I think the West Wing has also discussed some of the silliness of gun control legislations. 

[Private David Lewis]

Right, so I don't think it is totally biased against Republican ideas.  The "public schools should be like cathedrals" stuff is really just liberal idealism -- it is good rhetoric and can't be taken too seriously. 

I remember WW generally being against teachers' unions, too.  Like Santos only got the nomination after Bartlett strong-armed the teachers' union thug. 

[Miss P]

Finn, in case you forgot, I do read this thread. 

[Private David Lewis]

Just making sure you were still paying attention!

[goaliechica]

Right, so I don't think it is totally biased against Republican ideas.  The "public schools should be like cathedrals" stuff is really just liberal idealism -- it is good rhetoric and can't be taken too seriously. 

I remember WW generally being against teachers' unions, too.  Like Santos only got the nomination after Bartlett strong-armed the teachers' union thug. 

And what about Ainsley Hayes? She got in some good licks and kicked Sam's butt repeatedly.

[Private David Lewis]

Right!  But then she kind of faded away.  That was a big problem with Sorkin -- that he was writing so much he couldn't keep track of all the characters who were sifting in and out (unlike the Wire, although the Wire had several writers working in a more deliberate way).