Law School Discussion

Nine Years of Discussion
;

Author Topic: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money  (Read 3788 times)

legalese_retard

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 39
    • View Profile
Re: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2008, 02:00:28 PM »
Vandy and other lower ranked schools are great

Yeah, the fact the Vandy is only the 15th ranked school in the country is very alarming.

I appreciate your response because I really think you tried to give me a well-thought out opinion.  However, the point of my original post is that each person should do what is best for them.  For me, considering that I am from the South and moving to Nashville in a week, my wife has an internship with a hospital in the area beginning in January, and I love Nashville and have no desire to ever live in the North/ Midwest, Vandy is a very good match for me.  I don't consider Vandy a Timex... maybe a Citizen (and I like Citizens...).

A Timex will keep better time than a Rolex

I doubt this statement, but I'm going to take your word for it.

Sorry, my post was not meant to put down Vandy (I was waitlisted at Vandy and I would have gone in a heartbeat if I was admitted), but was trying to use it as an example. The OP was actually asking about a tier 1 vs. a tier 3, which has greater implications. Since you know for a fact that the South will be your future (especially since your spouse is in Nashville), then Vandy is a no-brainer. I should have used a Rolex vs. Tag Heuer watch example but I have too many friends that would debate on which watch is superior to the other so that is why I tried using Timex. The Timex/Rolex example is more relevant to the OPs question regarding tier 1/tier 3.

Top Cat

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 425
  • Ky. born, Ky. bred... when I die, I'll be Ky. dead
    • View Profile
    • LSN Profile
    • Email
Re: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2008, 03:16:44 PM »
No problem, and I understand your perspective.  You make a good point... just remember that there are multiple views to the same circumstances.
University of Kentucky 1L

LSN

IUB09

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 17
    • View Profile
Re: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2008, 10:08:55 AM »
Go to the t7-14 that gives you the most money. Vandy would be fine if you are top 1/2 at least. It is not worth the risk if you have t14 options. unless you want to stay in KY dont go to UK.

studymaster

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 390
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2008, 07:22:51 PM »
Vandy and other lower ranked schools are great

Yeah, the fact the Vandy is only the 15th ranked school in the country is very alarming.

I appreciate your response because I really think you tried to give me a well-thought out opinion.  However, the point of my original post is that each person should do what is best for them.  For me, considering that I am from the South and moving to Nashville in a week, my wife has an internship with a hospital in the area beginning in January, and I love Nashville and have no desire to ever live in the North/ Midwest, Vandy is a very good match for me.  I don't consider Vandy a Timex... maybe a Citizen (and I like Citizens...).
When would this advice not work? it's almost (but not quite) tautological...
It is whispered that soon, if we all heed the call, the piper will lead us to reason.

K?

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 510
  • Do You Believe Her
    • View Profile
Re: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money
« Reply #14 on: December 14, 2008, 01:32:11 AM »

If you are talking about vanilla T1, then no.  Maybe some people around median at top 25 or so schools.  Median at Iowa is not closer to biglaw than median at generic T3.

Median at Iowa's not going to give you much shot at BigLaw in Chicago, but then again neither is median at Illinois, Wisconsin, Minnesota or even ND or Wash U. If I was looking for BigLaw, I'd still much rather take my chances at one of those than at a T3.  If you're getting into Iowa or the like, you're likely going to get some money from a lower T1 anyway.
B < PL

upgrade

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 858
    • View Profile
Re: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2008, 01:44:39 AM »
If you are already in at Iowa, you may have a good shot at attending a school like Illinois with some money and much better options.

Regarding Vandy, JNS posted a spreadsheet over the summer detailing where a large portion of the graduates went to work and how much they made.  Market salaries were reported by 80%+ of the class, if memory serves me correctly.

vap

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 1310
  • Attorney
    • View Profile
Re: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money
« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2008, 09:31:55 AM »
Median at Iowa's not going to give you much shot at BigLaw in Chicago, but then again neither is median at Illinois, Wisconsin, Minnesota or even ND or Wash U.

Very true.

If I was looking for BigLaw, I'd still much rather take my chances at one of those than at a T3.

I'm the other way.  I say that, unless someone has experience with biglaw and absolutely knows it's for them, a prospective student should choose a school that allows them the most possible career options.  Both lower debt and higher school reputation will affect career options. 

If you're getting into Iowa or the like, you're likely going to get some money from a lower T1 anyway.

Probably, but not much.  If you don't get a scholarship from Iowa, then you mostly likely have to go to the low T2 to get a full ride.  Iowa gives out a lot of money.

wkjr

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 84
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money
« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2008, 10:23:36 AM »
If you are already in at Iowa, you may have a good shot at attending a school like Illinois with some money and much better options.

Regarding Vandy, JNS posted a spreadsheet over the summer detailing where a large portion of the graduates went to work and how much they made.  Market salaries were reported by 80%+ of the class, if memory serves me correctly.

yeah but this kind of placement had its genesis in hiring practices that are already probably outdated - this, to me, is where the economy arguments actually do make sense - the question no one seems to be asking is whether or not the economy is going to sustain the kind of bloated hiring that large firms had been doing for the last several years - it doesn't look like it will, long term - now, of course, the other question is whether, in light of scaled-back hiring, schools like vandy and ucla will do better than schools like cornell or duke (in light of the fact that vandy and ucla's numbers look like they're going in one direction and cornell and duke's look like they're going in the other direction) - whether or not they do, i don't see vandy outperforming michigan in the placement department any time soon

upgrade

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 858
    • View Profile
Re: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money
« Reply #18 on: December 15, 2008, 09:41:31 AM »
Probably, but not much.  If you don't get a scholarship from Iowa, then you mostly likely have to go to the low T2 to get a full ride.  Iowa gives out a lot of money.

Iowa gives out a lot of money?  From my own experience and last year's LSN figures, Iowa seemed like the stingiest school.  Illinois, Tulane, Indiana, and Arizona all gave out decent scholarships, with similar employment prospects upon graduation, while Iowa offered nothing to me and other similarly situated applicants. 

The Vanderbilt discussion revolved around whether the school should be lumped in with the other T1 schools outside the T14 or whether job oppotrunities were more similar to schools in the T14.  My point was that the school has given significantly better job options than schools 20-50 in the past and will probably continue to do in the future.  The economy will likely affect most school's hiring figures, but a school like Vanderbilt will probably continue to offer significantly better options than the bottom half of T1 schools, even at median or below.

vap

  • Sr. Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 1310
  • Attorney
    • View Profile
Re: Tier 3 with full ride or Tier 1 with no money
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2008, 10:50:34 AM »
Probably, but not much.  If you don't get a scholarship from Iowa, then you mostly likely have to go to the low T2 to get a full ride.  Iowa gives out a lot of money.

Iowa gives out a lot of money?  From my own experience and last year's LSN figures, Iowa seemed like the stingiest school.  Illinois, Tulane, Indiana, and Arizona all gave out decent scholarships, with similar employment prospects upon graduation, while Iowa offered nothing to me and other similarly situated applicants.

I was talking about full rides rather than partial scholarships - unlikely to get a full ride from Illinoi, Tulane, Indiana, or Arizona if not getting a full ride from Iowa.

I was also basing my assertion that Iowa is relatively "generous" with scholarship money because they give out full rides to more than 20% of their student body (http://officialguide.lsac.org/SearchResults/SchoolPage_PDFs/ABA_LawSchoolData/ABA6681.pdf). 

Iowa is among the top in the country giving out full rides: (filter search for more than 20% full tuition scholarships)

The University of Akron School of Law   29.4%
Ave Maria School of Law   21.6%
Baylor University School of Law     20.4%
The University of Iowa College of Law   20.1%
Liberty University School of Law   58.1%
University of North Dakota School of Law   20.3%
Northern Kentucky University—Salmon P. Chase College of Law   22%
University of St. Thomas School of Law—Minneapolis  21.9%
The University of Toledo College of Law   40.7%