Univ San Francisco versus Hastings

[arcady]

I started at USF yesterday, with orientation classes, but I got up this morning to a phone call from UC Hastings asking me to come in, I'm off the waiting list and they want me to start classes -tomorrow-.

Hastings ranks in the top 100, and USF is somewhere in the 150...

That might make it easy, save that Hastings is doing cosntruction for the next few years and may or may not even have a law library right now. I've also heard rumors that students there are very hostile to each other - even going as far as shredding each other's siezed notebooks. USF by contrast has facilities built in the last five years with a law library large enough to fit twice the entire student body, a lot of progressive social activism (and I am left leaning), very active and helpful alumni as well as student groups, and is generally, a 'friendly' campus.

One of these turns out 'scrappy' lawyers that are good in a 'pit fight' and the other 'mediators' that are good at solving problems.

I know Hasting's ranking at 22 or 23 in the nation or thereabouts, but not exactly for USF - I do know USF has one of the few 'maritime law' specialities on the west coast if not the nation, and is very well set in the fields of IP and International law.

My interests are in criminal law, international law, or civil rights law...



I've got to make a choice fast, and I doubt anyone will even read this before I'm already done with this, but I had to vent and I've just finished with the list of relatives. Maybe one of you -will- see this before I make my choice and have an opinion with some facts beyond just the 'rumors' I've heard of each...

[dbgirl]

Arcady --
Hastings is a better school.

I admit, I'm a little surprised by some of your comments.
One school turns out "scrappy" lawyers - the other "good mediators?"

Anyway, I suggest you take the opportunity given to you and come to Hastings. The rumors about mean students are largely exaggerated.

[HighlanderDP95]

If you care about your future, go to Hastings.  You are already in SF, so do it.

[SkullTatt]

Hastings, duh. USF is lower-ranked and perpetually fog-bound. (BUT, it does have a really awesome pool.)

So, what did you decide?

[lincolnsgrandson]

congratulations.  Pretty much every student at USF wishes there were at Hastings.  And pretty much every student at Hastings wishes they were at Boalt. 
You'd be nuts to stay at USF.

[bruin]

Hastings. You don't even have to move to attend.

The school does have a (well-deserved?) reputation for having a competitive, if not cutthroat student body, but not to the degree as you describe. Hastings has a very solid reputation in SF and the west coast generally, far beyond anything USF can hope for.

[jkang2]

Honestly, people on LSD tend have bias for USNWR.  They tend to say that higher ranking school (USNWR rank) should be picked in vast majority of situations.  If I were to ask like "Duke" vs. "GULC" then I get a pretty intelligent answers.  But if I were to ask "Harvard" vs. "Duke" people would call me a moron for asking such a question.  I myself is in this group too.  But lately gave more thought to it.

I heard complaints from law school students on this site.  The complaints are sometimes stupid because some people straight up say something like southwestern is yale and that law school doesn't matter.  This sounds as stupid as someone saying that law school is her life and she will die if she doesn't get into HYS.  The complaints are that 0L  students really don't have a clue as to what really goes on in lawschool. They don't know how hard it is and they have tendency to think that if they get into Harvard they will not get expelled for academic reasons.  I fall in this category too.  Vast majority of pre-laws really don't think that there is a GOOD chance that someone with a 170 LSAT and 3.8 GPA (a mediocre guy) can get into Harvard, study hard, then fail.  Or graduate bottom of his/her class..and...I guess practice law?  Fail the bar?   

Your LSAT and GPA are the best indicators of your success in lawschool.  Not a perfect indicator but best (relative).  Although people say this all the time, when they get accepted from a good school, they tend to make an exception for themselves. "I am different..I am special..I am gonna get As and go well." 

If you goto USF you might do well and be able to transfer to Boalt or Stanford (and then fail?).  From UC Hastings I am not really sure if you can do this.  You got off from the waitlist right?  So I am assuming that you are not top 25% of your class.   There are many people with 165 LSAT who didn't get into USC for some stupid reason and headed to Hastings.  You think you can handle it? 

[Melinda]

I am one of the high LSAT ppl WL from USC for some unknown reason despite scores above the USC median, but that is a whole different topic..

Anyway I would say the obvious choice is Hastings, but like DbGirl I take issue with the whole "scrappy lawyer" comment.  You may want to have a change of attitude before showing up at a school you have made such a generalized criticism of.  I have met many prestigious Hastings alummni, and by no means consider them "scrappy"

[jkang2]

I am one of the high LSAT ppl WL from USC for some unknown reason despite scores above the USC median, but that is a whole different topic..

Anyway I would say the obvious choice is Hastings, but like DbGirl I take issue with the whole "scrappy lawyer" comment.  You may want to have a change of attitude before showing up at a school you have made such a generalized criticism of.  I have met many prestigious Hastings alummni, and by no means consider them "scrappy"

What was your LSAT/GPA?  Can I ask??

[viceproductions]

Go visit the school, talk to the students/staff there, and then decide for yourself.