What Did Everyone Do Before USN&WR??

[Pop Up Video]

USNWR is a joke.  People salivate over arbitrary rankings.  The most foolish part is that it is an established consensus among EVERYONE that rankings are overrated and arbitrarily contrived but we still remain obsequious to them.

Note: Out of the reputation calculation which combined accounts for 40% of the ranking is made up of surveys sent in by LESS THAN 10% of those surveyed.  Now lets go adjust our lives for the outcome. 

The ABA should publicly denounce the USNWR ranking and let firms and attorneys make up their own conceptions of schools and their alumni.

I somehow doubt firms pay that much attention to USNWR 

They pay attention to everything believe me, including the LSAT scores required to get into schools.  I saw a legal recruiters book once, and it included a list of schools and their median LSAT scores.  This is what she looked at to give me advice, so yeah, they are paying attention.

I'm saying recruitment at a school like Chicago has probably not been negatively impacted by Chicago being ranked 7th instead of 6th. And I doubt recruiters care if Mich is 8 one year and 10 the next.

[greenie]

USNWR is a joke.  People salivate over arbitrary rankings.  The most foolish part is that it is an established consensus among EVERYONE that rankings are overrated and arbitrarily contrived but we still remain obsequious to them.

Note: Out of the reputation calculation which combined accounts for 40% of the ranking is made up of surveys sent in by LESS THAN 10% of those surveyed.  Now lets go adjust our lives for the outcome. 

The ABA should publicly denounce the USNWR ranking and let firms and attorneys make up their own conceptions of schools and their alumni.

I somehow doubt firms pay that much attention to USNWR 

They pay attention to everything believe me, including the LSAT scores required to get into schools.  I saw a legal recruiters book once, and it included a list of schools and their median LSAT scores.  This is what she looked at to give me advice, so yeah, they are paying attention.

I'm saying recruitment at a school like Chicago has probably not been negatively impacted by Chicago being ranked 7th instead of 6th. And I doubt recruiters care if Mich is 8 one year and 10 the next.

Hi who said I was talking about the T14?!  The OP was mainly talking about non-T14 schools.

[RockinJay]

It is true, I work for a Big Law firm here in DC and they even told me that if I can get into a top 25, or maybe even a top 50, I would be guaranteed a job here (since the partner here loves me from working for her for over 5 years).  These people, even the partner whom I've worked for at this firm and another Big Law firm, realize that I know everything the attorneys I work for know.  They realize that I can pretty much run these transactional deals on my known if I could.  And yet, if I can't get into a Top 25 school, I can't get a job here.  How's that for USN&WR influence?  I am not so sure that would have been the case 20-25 years ago.

[greenie]

It is true, I work for a Big Law firm here in DC and they even told me that if I can get into a top 25, or maybe even a top 50, I would be guaranteed a job here (since the partner here loves me from working for her for over 5 years).  These people, even the partner whom I've worked for at this firm and another Big Law firm, realize that I know everything the attorneys I work for know.  They realize that I can pretty much run these transactional deals on my known if I could.  And yet, if I can't get into a Top 25 school, I can't get a job here.  How's that for USN&WR influence?  I am not so sure that would have been the case 20-25 years ago.

Exactly.  Firms are paying attention and they know the reputation of schools.  People don't care if Michigan switches a spot one year or whatever - USN&WR measures reputation in the long term.  USN&WR has slowly but surely had an influence and will continue to have an influence on things.  That being said I think T14 schools are largely the same ('cept H/Y), and schools T30-T15 are largely comparative.

[Pop Up Video]

USNWR is a joke.  People salivate over arbitrary rankings.  The most foolish part is that it is an established consensus among EVERYONE that rankings are overrated and arbitrarily contrived but we still remain obsequious to them.

Note: Out of the reputation calculation which combined accounts for 40% of the ranking is made up of surveys sent in by LESS THAN 10% of those surveyed.  Now lets go adjust our lives for the outcome. 

The ABA should publicly denounce the USNWR ranking and let firms and attorneys make up their own conceptions of schools and their alumni.

I somehow doubt firms pay that much attention to USNWR 

They pay attention to everything believe me, including the LSAT scores required to get into schools.  I saw a legal recruiters book once, and it included a list of schools and their median LSAT scores.  This is what she looked at to give me advice, so yeah, they are paying attention.

I'm saying recruitment at a school like Chicago has probably not been negatively impacted by Chicago being ranked 7th instead of 6th. And I doubt recruiters care if Mich is 8 one year and 10 the next.

Hi who said I was talking about the T14?!  The OP was mainly talking about non-T14 schools.

I was talking about the "T14," sorry. I was talking about biglaw.

[greenie]

USNWR is a joke.  People salivate over arbitrary rankings.  The most foolish part is that it is an established consensus among EVERYONE that rankings are overrated and arbitrarily contrived but we still remain obsequious to them.

Note: Out of the reputation calculation which combined accounts for 40% of the ranking is made up of surveys sent in by LESS THAN 10% of those surveyed.  Now lets go adjust our lives for the outcome. 

The ABA should publicly denounce the USNWR ranking and let firms and attorneys make up their own conceptions of schools and their alumni.

I somehow doubt firms pay that much attention to USNWR 

They pay attention to everything believe me, including the LSAT scores required to get into schools.  I saw a legal recruiters book once, and it included a list of schools and their median LSAT scores.  This is what she looked at to give me advice, so yeah, they are paying attention.

I'm saying recruitment at a school like Chicago has probably not been negatively impacted by Chicago being ranked 7th instead of 6th. And I doubt recruiters care if Mich is 8 one year and 10 the next.

Hi who said I was talking about the T14?!  The OP was mainly talking about non-T14 schools.

I was talking about the "T14," sorry. I was talking about biglaw.

I don't think legal recruiters are focusing on small detailed differences between the T14 schools.

[RockinJay]

I am truly fed up with this message board.  Are all of you so deeply obsessed with T14 schools that you cannot even fathom that 180+ other schools exist?  Since I am the OP, re-read my second post:

"I think it's a given that the top 14 schools have ALWAYS been the top 14.  I should clarify my question and ask what about the rest of the 180+ schools (granted, some of them are fairly new)?  How were they "classified" by the legal community without the USN&WR?

For hypothetical purposes, lets say there were only 100 law schools 25 years ago (I have no idea, just shooting off the top of my head) and lets NOT TALK ABOUT THE T14 SCHOOLS FOR ONE MOMENT ON THIS MESSAGE BOARD (sheesh!), how did firms match up a Wisconsin versus an Illinois, or a Washington-St.Louis versus University of Texas?"

Most law students do not go to T14 schools and that was exactly my point in posting my questions.  And yet, all of you just can't help but revert back to T14 talk.  This website should be called "Top 14 Law Schools Discussion," or better yet, "95% of All Other Law Schools Suck Discussion."

[Pop Up Video]

I am truly fed up with this message board.  Are all of you so deeply obsessed with T14 schools that you cannot even fathom that 180+ other schools exist?  Since I am the OP, re-read my second post:

"I think it's a given that the top 14 schools have ALWAYS been the top 14.  I should clarify my question and ask what about the rest of the 180+ schools (granted, some of them are fairly new)?  How were they "classified" by the legal community without the USN&WR?

For hypothetical purposes, lets say there were only 100 law schools 25 years ago (I have no idea, just shooting off the top of my head) and lets NOT TALK ABOUT THE T14 SCHOOLS FOR ONE MOMENT ON THIS MESSAGE BOARD (sheesh!), how did firms match up a Wisconsin versus an Illinois, or a Washington-St.Louis versus University of Texas?"

Most law students do not go to T14 schools and that was exactly my point in posting my questions.  And yet, all of you just can't help but revert back to T14 talk.  This website should be called "Top 14 Law Schools Discussion," or better yet, "95% of All Other Law Schools Suck Discussion."

LOL.

"T14" aside, I don't know that hiring partners care that much if Notre Dame is #22 or #28. They probably have a set idea of the school. And they probably don't care if Fordham is #25 or #27 for the same reason.

 

[cs_rudy]

Why are we talking about Notre Dame? It isn't in the top 14. Ha.

[nealric]

For hypothetical purposes, lets say there were only 100 law schools 25 years ago (I have no idea, just shooting off the top of my head) and lets NOT TALK ABOUT THE T14 SCHOOLS FOR ONE MOMENT ON THIS MESSAGE BOARD (sheesh!), how did firms match up a Wisconsin versus an Illinois, or a Washington-St.Louis versus University of Texas?"

I think it was fairly rare for a Wisconsin grad to directly compete with a Texas grad for the same job at the same office (I posit that it still is). Just like to day, some schools were nationally known as the "good schools". Other schools mostly fed into their local markets. I'm guessing it was probably a little tougher 25 years ago to leave the market of your school since it was not as easy for firms to research schools.