Law School Discussion

JUST GOT INTO BROOKLYN - NEED ADVICE

Re: JUST GOT INTO BROOKLYN - NEED ADVICE
« Reply #10 on: August 17, 2005, 11:22:23 PM »
RU- Newark has an excellent rep as well.

I don't know where the poster was coming from saying none of the NJ schools are good.  They certainly aren't in the best of locations but I would say they are all very  solid regional schools.

None of the 3 NJ schools are "bad," but I'm just saying that for a state with the most lawyers per capita, we should be able to get at least ONE school in the top 50... much of the 3 NJ schools' rankings in the upper to mid 2nd tier is because there just simply aren't any alternatives. Don't misinterpret me or think that I'm calling them garbage. I'm not campaigning to demote any of those schools to the 3rd tier. I'm simply stating my opinion to the OP. I think Brooklyn is a better school in a better environment. I know I have a bias in pushing for Brooklyn, but it's my honest opinion. Take it for what it's worth.

Well I am going to Seton Hall so of course I am biased as well, but historically RU-Newark was a top 40 school.  They have fallen recently because of a change in US News criteria, but they still have a very good rep.

And honestly, once you get into the 2nd Tier aren't we talking miniscule differences anyways? You may be right about Brooklyn- I was accepted there as well and its a good school, but IMO I don't think you can say there is some clear significant difference between Brooklyn and the 3 NJ schools. I think you might be putting a bit too much emphasis on the U.S News rankings.

But to each their own I suppose.

You're putting words into my mouth again by calling it a "clear significant difference" & chalking it up to rankings. Like I said before, most of the reasons why I prefer Brooklyn are the intangibles.. Not the US News rankings. I just reference them in regards to their rankings because thats the one simple commonality that we can all agree upon when discussing law schools. I'm not saying they are badly ranked. In fact my point is quite different. I'm saying that I think that their semi-prominent rankings are not purely merit based. I prefer Brooklyn because of its gorgeous facilities, friendly neighborhood/ location in the top market in the US, proximity & internship opportunities afforded by the location of the NY Supreme Court across the street, my understanding of its reputation from lawyers I've encountered, etc. I think RU/SHU are overrated b/c of the lack of competition in NJ & b/c they are located in nasty cities. It's a preference.

Also, I think that RU-Newark is one of the best examples of a hegemon in decline. They were once the best law school in NJ, but they are grossly mismanaged. I don't care to reference each & every reason why on this board, but I went to RU- New Brunswick as an undergrad. One of my professors there also teaches law at RU Newark. He's a top member of their faculty & has been with the school for many years. He speaks openly about their mismanagement, disorganization, and poor choices. In fact, he's leaving this year. He loves the school & the students there, but can't help but proclaim his dissatisfaction with how the school is run. So, I don't exactly buy your argument that their decline in rankings is b/c of the change in US News criteria.

1) You  stated Brooklyn was a "better school".  In my mind that equals a clear difference.

2) You say rankings are not important and yet your main basis for calling the 3 NJ schools overrated is because they aren't top 50, correct?  Additonally, in your initial post you mention one reason to choose Brooklyn is because "we're ranked higher".  You then express the wish that more qualified applicants choose Brooklyn in order to boost their rank.  It certainly appears to me that you place a very high emphasis on the U.S News rankings.  Not trying to be an ass, just saying that from this thread the impression I got was that rankings are important.

3)You reasons for preferring Brooklyn are very valid and it certainly is an excellent school.

4) Interesting theory you have on the NJ schools being overrated because of the lack of competition?  I honestly do not understand your logic here, especially since NJ judges are not allowed to participate in the U.S News reputation survey, so it's not like they get a bump from that. I would be interested in hearing your theory (seriously)



5) You also say the NJ schools are overrated because of their locations, and quite frankly that makes no sense at all to me if by over/under rated you mean the quality of the school itself.  Now if you are just talking personal preference, fine.

6) Would like to hear more (if you have the time) on why RU in your opinion has gone downhill.

Nothing personal, just happen to disagree with you on some of your  reasoning.

Good luck at Brooklyn

Re: JUST GOT INTO BROOKLYN - NEED ADVICE
« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2005, 05:49:39 AM »
Enough about everyone else.  Will my numbers get me into Brooklyn?

Re: JUST GOT INTO BROOKLYN - NEED ADVICE
« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2005, 09:51:20 AM »
You have a chance, but not definitely.

Re: JUST GOT INTO BROOKLYN - NEED ADVICE
« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2005, 10:05:58 AM »
I really like that school and I hope that my soft factors will play a big role.  Congrats to all of you who are starting there soon.

Re: JUST GOT INTO BROOKLYN - NEED ADVICE
« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2005, 02:40:29 PM »


1) You  stated Brooklyn was a "better school".  In my mind that equals a clear difference.

2) You say rankings are not important and yet your main basis for calling the 3 NJ schools overrated is because they aren't top 50, correct?  Additonally, in your initial post you mention one reason to choose Brooklyn is because "we're ranked higher".  You then express the wish that more qualified applicants choose Brooklyn in order to boost their rank.  It certainly appears to me that you place a very high emphasis on the U.S News rankings.  Not trying to be an ass, just saying that from this thread the impression I got was that rankings are important.

3)You reasons for preferring Brooklyn are very valid and it certainly is an excellent school.

4) Interesting theory you have on the NJ schools being overrated because of the lack of competition?  I honestly do not understand your logic here, especially since NJ judges are not allowed to participate in the U.S News reputation survey, so it's not like they get a bump from that. I would be interested in hearing your theory (seriously)



5) You also say the NJ schools are overrated because of their locations, and quite frankly that makes no sense at all to me if by over/under rated you mean the quality of the school itself.  Now if you are just talking personal preference, fine.

6) Would like to hear more (if you have the time) on why RU in your opinion has gone downhill.

Nothing personal, just happen to disagree with you on some of your  reasoning.

Good luck at Brooklyn
Quote

I'm trying to pack for move-in tomorrow & still have time to get sloppy drunk, so I'll keep this as concise as possible...
1. OK, If "better" means a "clear significan difference." I meant it as more of a preference ie Coke is better than Pepsi, but I'll concede that point if need be.

2. The fact is Brooklyn isn't even ranked in the Top 50. When I referenced the Top 50, I was saying that I think that we should have a school that isn't just good, but EXCELLENT, in a state as populated as NJ. I think that Rutgers & SHU's rank shows that they aren't very good in that they were unable to rise to that challenge even though they had no other serious competition. If Rutgers was located in DC & ranked in the 60s or 70s, I'd say that they're a good school, but just can't compete with the likes of GW, Georgetown, American, etc & there's nothing wrong with that. However, with virtually no competition in NJ, there's no reason not to be ranked higher. I feel it is just one of many testaments to the fact that they're not that good. I don't live & die by the rankings, but I still give them some weight. It's one of the reasons that I don't think they are great institutions. They have no competition, but their product (their JD degree) still isn't that good.

3. I agree. Ha

4. My theory doesn't have anything to do with NJ judges voting. I'm saying that when the US News rankings are formulated, location does play a big role. For example, one reason Texas is so well respected is there is no other huge law schools in the immediate area. Same with Uni of Michigan. There just aren't any Michigan schools that even come close to them. You could say the same about Uni of Minnesota, Washington St Louis, Iowa, etc. This inevitably boosts their ranking b/c when students graduate from Texas, Michigan, etc & choose to remain in-state, every employer wants them since there are so few other well qualified law school grads. This translates into more demand for them & better starting salaries. This inevitably influences the rankings. This SHOULD be the case with schools like SHU & RU-Newark/Camden. I know that NJ is a small state, so we do draw grads from other metropolises, but those 3 schools should still have a certain dominance & respect in the NJ. The fact is, they don't. Every law firm in New Brunswick, Morristown, Freehold, etc should be clamoring for Rutgers grads, but they simply aren't. Many of them choose to look out of state for employees. This is because, once again, they just haven't taken enough measures to make themselves the best. They should have a virtual monopoly over the best jobs in NJ, but they don't.

5. Re-read my post. I never said that they are overrated b/c of their location in lousy cities. I was saying they're overrated b/c they have no competition b/c they are the only NJ schools (So, I'm saying 1 point that they are ranked higher than they deserve to be and on a second point, if they were truly a good school, they'd be ranked EVEN HIGHER b/c it is easy to move up in the rankings when noone is around to compete with you). I referenced their location in crappy cities when I was explaining why I would choose Brooklyn over RU or SHU. It's an aesthetic choice. Disagree if you want, but I'd just rather live in Brooklyn Heights than Newark or Camden.

6. Most of my reasons why RU is going downward is because of anecdotes I heard from my old professor who used to work there about how they let key members of their faculty leave, don't do enough to recruit, & haven't seized opportunities (like to hire big names in the field) when the opportunities have presented themselves. My own experience reaffirms his point on recruitment after watching the pathetic way they recruited me (Sent me a Survivor theme postcard that said if I applied to their school I'd get a t-shirt with some tacky slogan like "Application Cycle Survivor" or something. Really cheesy & kind of pathetic that that is the only way they tried to recruit a well qualified Rutgers grad).

So much for being brief. Off to packing, poker, & alcohol! Be good.

Re: JUST GOT INTO BROOKLYN - NEED ADVICE
« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2005, 06:53:09 PM »
Stop bullshitting about those #'s. There are so many ppl on the waitlist that it just makes no sense whatsoever that you got all that without great numbers. So, lets here those numbers.

In regard to your message, I'm not bsing about anything.  I said that my #'s are not worthy of being mentioned.  What you might think are "great numbers" might not be considered great to me.  It's about standards and my privacy.  There are more than just lsat scores and ugpa to determine whether or not a person can go to a specific school.


Anyhow, I finally arrived at feil hall just to move in but went back home to care of more stuff. Does anyone know if there's ethernet in the room?  I didn't see a jack for ethernet.  *sigh*

Re: JUST GOT INTO BROOKLYN - NEED ADVICE
« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2005, 11:15:58 PM »
Welcome to BLS. Yes, there is ethernet. There are jacks in your room (was behind the desk in my room), & there is also wireless internet access. Once you set up your email account, there should be an email explaining how to set up the wireless. Good luck.

Stop bullshitting about those #'s. There are so many ppl on the waitlist that it just makes no sense whatsoever that you got all that without great numbers. So, lets here those numbers.

In regard to your message, I'm not bsing about anything.  I said that my #'s are not worthy of being mentioned.  What you might think are "great numbers" might not be considered great to me.  It's about standards and my privacy.  There are more than just lsat scores and ugpa to determine whether or not a person can go to a specific school.


Anyhow, I finally arrived at feil hall just to move in but went back home to care of more stuff. Does anyone know if there's ethernet in the room?  I didn't see a jack for ethernet.  *sigh*

Re: JUST GOT INTO BROOKLYN - NEED ADVICE
« Reply #17 on: August 20, 2005, 11:36:00 PM »
We're all going to finf out exactly who you are if you tell us your #'s. And actually, if you stay on here long enough we might find out who you are, and so your privacy might not be protected. So, please don't tell us your #'s, because we don't want to see what might happen if as a result of you telling us your #'s we're going to find out who you are.