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Author Topic: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire  (Read 12038 times)

amarain

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Re: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire
« Reply #90 on: June 23, 2005, 05:18:16 PM »
You know what really makes me angry about this whole thing? Now I want to watch that episode where she tells her side of the story.  >:(

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Re: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire
« Reply #91 on: June 23, 2005, 05:22:52 PM »
watch out Mobell.  you are starting to get a little militant there.

Am I starting to sound like the type of person who wears locs?! ;)

LMAO.  yes

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Re: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire
« Reply #92 on: June 23, 2005, 05:32:50 PM »
I'm sick of these news stories about millionaire celebs/athletes/rockstars/etc whining about racism. Oprah couldn't shop at a specific place because they were closing...OH THE HORROR :o :o :o. Perhaps she will get pitied by her fan base and parade herself as the "abused black woman" and everyone will race to her aid whilst the black woman with 3 kids who lives in the gutter will get chased out of the 7-11 by a paranoid neo-nazi clerk. Oh but who suffers worst??

Well oprah of course! after all, how can she be expected to be treated like one of the oppressed masses.

Yeah I'll take up oprah's cause when I see her buck naked arse chained, gagged, and drug across stage by a giggling Jaque chirac. But untill then I shall save my sympathy for those who aren't millionaires.

Rudy Huckleberry

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Re: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire
« Reply #93 on: June 23, 2005, 05:35:17 PM »
I'm sick of these news stories about millionaire celebs/athletes/rockstars/etc whining about racism. Oprah couldn't shop at a specific place because they were closing...OH THE HORROR :o :o :o. Perhaps she will get pitied by her fan base and parade herself as the "abused black woman" and everyone will race to her aid whilst the black woman with 3 kids who lives in the gutter will get chased out of the 7-11 by a paranoid neo-nazi clerk. Oh but who suffers worst??

Well oprah of course! after all, how can she be expected to be treated like one of the oppressed masses.

Yeah I'll take up oprah's cause when I see her buck naked arse chained, gagged, and drug across stage by a giggling Jaque chirac. But untill then I shall save my sympathy for those who aren't millionaires.

You can't have sympathy for both?  Money eliminates a person's ability to suffer abuse?

twarga

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Re: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire
« Reply #94 on: June 23, 2005, 05:44:12 PM »
I went to France a few years ago and found them a little less than friendly.  I was living in Germany at the time, so it was nothing new since the Germans are far from snuggly themselves.  I found the Scottish people to be very polite and accommodating, as well as the Italians.  Different countries (and cities for that matter) behave differently toward foreigners.  The French can be cold and aloof, especially to non-French speaking people... NEWS FLASH!!
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angelus

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Re: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire
« Reply #95 on: June 23, 2005, 05:45:06 PM »


You can't have sympathy for both?  Money eliminates a person's ability to suffer abuse?

Yes but not much for oprah. Miss Oprah can rack up a credit card, buy a hundred boxes of chocolate, fly to hawaii to make herself feel much much better. The poor person suffers much more due to several reasons....first being the feeling of being tRaPpEd in a hopeless situation.

No money doesn't solve every problem but it sure does alleviate a lot of them.

I'll also say, I don't hate Oprah or rich people. What I hate is that her petty little problem becomes international news. She couldn't buy clothes or jewelry....whatever. What about the woman who couldn't get to the store to buy milk for her baby? What about having to take three trains to get to the store because all the ones in your neighborhood are liquor stores? What about Oprah's petty gripe eclipses the real problems of the working poor in this country?

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Re: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire
« Reply #96 on: June 23, 2005, 05:46:09 PM »
Yeah, making accommodations like this for celebs is totally standard.  It is odd that they didn't care if Opera talked up their handbags.

They frankly don't need another celebrity talking up their handbags.  They're Heremes. They've been around before Oprah, and they'll be around long after no one cares what bag she has.  I was just at Louis Vuitton and they have an inch thick binder filled with tabloid cutouts so people can figure out which bag they saw which star with and buy it.  I'm sure Heremes isn't going to be that hurt if Oprah starts carrying Chanel instead. 

Yeah, I'm sure it was that kind of attitude that got them where they are.  Look, it's definitely not the smartest way to go to piss off ANY celeb...esp. one like Oprah to whom other celebs listen.  How much you wanna bet her friend Julia Roberts stops shopping there too?

I hate to break it to you, but they look at EVERYONE that way in those kinds of stores. I'm white as can be and I feel incredibly uncomfortable at those high end places, even when I'm there to actually shop. There's also a huge difference in the way someone carries themselves and presents themselves. If I walk into Gucci wearing Adidas pants and a tshirt, I don't get looked at the same way I do when I walk in wearing a leather coat and button-down. There are always black people in the Louis store nearest me, and the ones who look like they have money are treated with kid gloves, and the rest (black and white) aren't. There are black women in there all the time dressed to the nines, and they have salespeople drooling over them. I also guarantee that if I took my lily-white self to a store in an all black neighborhood, I'd get more than a few looks.

Racism and skepticism is not a white or black characteristic. It affects everyone.

I hate to break it to you, but I'm not just referring to Hermes-esque places here.  When was the last time you were followed around a fish market?  Happened to me more than once.

Yes, people might look at you funny if you walked into a Black-owned establishment in a Black neighborhood.  But how often do you shop there?  Conversely, if I want to eat I have to go to a White-owned grocery store.  If I want clothes, I go to the White man's store.  If I want hair products, even in my own neighborhood, the Koreans own them - and they even follow us around?  Racism and skepticism may affect us all, but they *hardly* affect us equally.

I'm not saying that racism doesn't exist and that people don't encounter it in certain situations.  This discussion revolved around Oprah Winfrey and Hermes, and instead of believing the store that had video evidence to back its claims, everyone immediately acted like it was the "white man" being racist instead of a rich celebrity not getting her way (whether she threw a hissy fit or not).  When a store doesn't want someone to come in, no matter what their race, they don't politely invite you back the next day with an engraved card.  

Secondly, to respond to other points, French nationalism conspires against anyone non-French.  I've spent five years studying comparative politics and international relations, and I hope I would know at least that much.  I guarantee that if Hermes (or any other French instiution) was going to act out of racial motivation, they would have assuredly done so toward more than just Africans.  You are mistaken if you don't think a group of white people talking Italian or a group of anyone even slightly cocoa colored talking Spanish, Arabic or anything else wouldn't be viewed with skepticism.   They are also, given our treatment of their country lately, very unlikely to be openly hospitable to someone they know is a rich American, or a poor American,f or that matter.  The French have a lot going for them, but they aren't known for their politeness, especially to outsiders.        

Lastly, I'm from Detroit.  I don't need a lecture on race relations, and you were very presumptous to assume that I wouldn't have any experiences in non-white establishments.  I shop in multi-cultural and multi-ethnic stores all the time, and sometimes I have pleasant expereinces, and sometimes I don't.  If I go into the Korean market with my Asian friend, we are looked at with horror, as though we are going to go conceive a mixed race child in their frozen foods section.  The English translation for the Chinese term used to define a white person is "white devil," for goodness sake.  As I said, racism and skeptcism affect us all, and you are correct in saying to varying degrees, but it is not the white man constantly seeking to beat down the black man, as it seems to be argued so often.      

As a white person, who has worked in retail, I find it very offensive the conclusion seemingly reached that all, or a majority of us are out to nab black people.  I can assure you I spent much more time following around creepy white guys and unruly white skater teenagers than I ever did worrying about any black people.  I very much doubt that everytime you go to the grocery store you are followed around by detectives, and if you are, you really need to reevaluate where you shop.  Maybe try Marshall Field's or KMart instead of the "white man's store."  

skepticism but not rudeness.  We are in a new era of EU open borders.  Have you actually been to France?  French nationalism as a construct is in part based on the imaginary of the French social pact.  It is not for some reason that the slight tan Nicolas Sarkozy stands a good chance of becoming the next French president even though he is the decendent of immigrants.  The question is to what extent race colors the perceived boundaries of citizenship.  Doubtful that you will get any "French" person to claim the statesman Senghor or Cesaire as French, despite their long residence in the country.

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Re: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire
« Reply #97 on: June 23, 2005, 05:48:39 PM »
For those who missed it:

A) Black person who has been through something similar: "Man sure seems racist to me.  Matter of fact, that's the third time some sh*t like that happened to me and my friends.  Can't be any coincidence!."

B) White person who has obviously never had a similar experience i.e no context:  "you need to show me the ashes from the cross burning in your backyard, or a videotape, something..otherwise, racism? What racism?"

None of us really know what happened.  So we had three pages of speculation so far...great. My question is this: why do you guys think that there is a marked difference in the response in situations like this....almost perfectly aligned by race?  Any thoughts?  Or do you not agree that it's like this?
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Rudy Huckleberry

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Re: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire
« Reply #98 on: June 23, 2005, 05:51:52 PM »
Hmm...okay, FIRST of all you need to calm down.  No one said you never shop in multicultural environments, only that you don't shop in Black-owned stores that often.  Do you?  I know I don't - we don't own that many stores, not even in our own neighborhoods.

2. Did I say that "every time go to the grocery store [I am] followed by detectives?  Please.  All I did was counter your earlier point that my shopping experience as a Black person is the same as yours as a White person - the suspicions leveled against us are not limited to boutiques, as you seem to imply in your earlier response.

3. I'm from South Carolina.  You're from Detroit.  So what?  You think I can't tell you a bit about race relations living my life as a minority while you slip into that status only in situations like visiting the Korean market with your Asian friend?

Look, just like many White people's best friend is Black, my best friend is Asian. :o :D  I know race relations aren't just about White people beating down Black people.  But did you really think we were going to discuss the oppression of Arabs by Israelis on a thread about the Oprah incident?

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Re: Shopping While Black--- Doesn't matter if you are a billionaire
« Reply #99 on: June 23, 2005, 05:53:53 PM »
For those who missed it:

A) Black person who has been through something similar: "Man sure seems racist to me.  Matter of fact, that's the third time some sh*t like that happened to me and my friends.  Can't be any coincidence!."

B) White person who has obviously never had a similar experience i.e no context:  "you need to show me the ashes from the cross burning in your backyard, or a videotape, something..otherwise, racism? What racism?"

None of us really know what happened.  So we had three pages of speculation so far...great. My question is this: why do you guys think that there is a marked difference in the response in situations like this....almost perfectly aligned by race?  Any thoughts?  Or do you not agree that it's like this?


BP, I am enjoying discussing the French imaginary with such distinguished colleagues.  Might I suggest you refrain from bringing us back to topic until I have properly delineated the discursive process that defining citizenship within Republicanism creates.