Law School Discussion

Performance Enhancers

guyutegirl (Jew-Lo)

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Re: Performance Enhancers
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2004, 07:27:06 AM »
Thank you guyutegirl! I will visit as many doctors as I need to until I get it tommorow.

Adderall! Does it take effect immediately or would I have to take it for an indeterminate amount of time before I started noticing the effect.

I actually tried to get Adderall about 6 weeks ago but I got scared off when my doctor was completely against it; instead he recommended that I take Zoloft (the anti-depressant) to increase my concentration. Been on that for about 6 weeks. Havent noticed any spectacular change. Hopefully I can start Adderall tommorow.



No problem. I would like to take this opportunity to throw in a disclaimer. Anyway, like I was saying, don't worry about what other people say. They don't want you to get a leg up. Don't waste time thinking about that nonsense. Now, as far as Adderall is concerned, I'll give you the facts because I was being slighty facetious in my prior post. It's something that takes about a half hour (or less) to kick in. And you'll know when it kicks in. It's nothing like an SSRI or anything where you have to wait weeks for results. Plus, an SSRI won't do anything for your concentration (Noticeably, at least). It is not something you want to take for an indeterminate amount of time--unless it's medically necessary--because it can be habit-forming. I'm not surprised that your doctor is against it. They are unlikey to prescribe it (unless you have a *good* doctor) purely for concentration; if you're looking for a prescription, you would have to have (or acquire) an ailment that is alleviated from Adderall-also something not hard to do. There are (obviously) other ways to get it but i don't want to come off as more of an enabler than i already am (too late). And in terms of "mood enhancers that are not prescribed for people who whine to their doctors about taking the LSAT's"-@#!* that. If your doctor prescribed it for you, s/he may genuinly see an anxiety (or possible depression) problem. So don't listen to jacy about the zoloft thing. That's sounds legit. It's very effective on anxiety. And as far as the Adderall is concerned, use at your own risk. If you have personal "ethical" problems, don't use it. But i don't think that's really the case. It's usually the people who knock it who are or become neck deep in it. Ignore people trying to chastise you who don't want you to get a leg up on the competition. It's not their place to determine whether what you're doing is 'ethical' or not. They only reason i find that complaint particularly obnoxious is because for people who are concerned about helping you, they would talk to you about the effects it could have on your health, including addiction. People who bring in the "ethics" argument aren't interested in helping or informing you, they're looking out for #1 (which isn't necessarily bad, but you gotta be sure you don't invest any energy in listening to that because it's not an extension of information that benefits you) You do what you need to do for yourself, but be sure you know what you're dealing with.  :)

nathanielmark

Re: Performance Enhancers
« Reply #11 on: June 02, 2004, 07:54:35 AM »
i would have no qualms with taking it.  i used to take dex for ADD.  in all sincerity, i dont see how it could really help you.  its speed.  it could bump up your concentration a notch but you should have that effect just from adrenalin.  it can also make you feel high, and take focus away from work stuff because you feel good.

i would take it if i thought it would help, but i think it is a questionable approach at best.

jew-lo, how specifically did it help you?  did it help you with games, avoiding careless erros?  I am just curious

jacy85

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Re: Performance Enhancers
« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2004, 07:55:05 AM »
Get off your high horse.  Just to clarify, I am not only out for myself, and my rant concerning unnecessary prescription drugs has nothing to do with "looking out for #1."  If that were true, I wouldn't post on this board when people ask for help or advice.  I happen to feel very strongly, however, that "performance enhancers" are not the way for someone to go about getting "help."  You're right, Jew-Lo, I'm not interested in helping sones if it means advising him to waste time and money.  If he had questions about actually *studying*, sure.  But not for something I feel is unethical, inadvisable, and ineffective.

And my statement on ethics was nothing more than my opinion, as I'm very well aware.  I'm sure it's an opinion that some people share, and it's obviously one that quite a few disagree with.  In terms of being anxious for the test, I'll conceed that a doctor prescribing Zoloft could help.  It's for anxiety, however, not improved concentration in the sense that sones is looking for.

It's one thing to take Zoloft for anxiety.  Sones, however, is taking salmon oil, ginko-baloba stuff, zoloft, *and* is now looking to pair that with Adderall.  He seems more focused on improving his score with anything and everything but hard work.  There comes a point where loading yourself with supplements, herbs, vitamins and drugs will become detrimental to your health, and sure as hell won't help your lsat score.

So you advise for Adderall all you like.  We're all free to advocate whatever we like on this board.  And of course, Sones is free to do whatever he likes.  While he's out looking for whatever supplements/drugs he can find, however, I'll be at home, studying.  And we'll see which method is more effective.

M2

Re: Performance Enhancers
« Reply #13 on: June 02, 2004, 07:58:11 AM »
... There are (obviously) other ways to get it but i don't want to come off as more of an enabler than i already am (too late). And in terms of "mood enhancers that are not prescribed for people who whine to their doctors about taking the LSAT's"-@#!* that. If your doctor prescribed it for you, s/he may genuinly see an anxiety (or possible depression) problem. So don't listen to jacy about the zoloft thing. That's sounds legit. It's very effective on anxiety. And as far as the Adderall is concerned, use at your own risk....


Are you actually saying that adderall can be good for someone with anxiety?!?!
Sorry if I am misunderstanding you but that is some very bad advice...

Amphetamines for anxiety...

Amphetamines only serve to calm people that have a disorder like ADD(cant remember the term for this)...In most people they raise anxiety levels.

Although maybe you were referring to Zoloft?
If so that is also soem very bad advice...SSRIs are well known for reducing mental capacity and stifling logical ability. I can bring up the the relevant studies if you wish.


nathanielmark

Re: Performance Enhancers
« Reply #14 on: June 02, 2004, 08:03:39 AM »
right SSRIs would be one of the worst thing to take if you want to boost your score.

... There are (obviously) other ways to get it but i don't want to come off as more of an enabler than i already am (too late). And in terms of "mood enhancers that are not prescribed for people who whine to their doctors about taking the LSAT's"-@#!* that. If your doctor prescribed it for you, s/he may genuinly see an anxiety (or possible depression) problem. So don't listen to jacy about the zoloft thing. That's sounds legit. It's very effective on anxiety. And as far as the Adderall is concerned, use at your own risk....


Are you actually saying that adderall can be good for someone with anxiety?!?!
Sorry if I am misunderstanding you but that is some very bad advice...

Amphetamines for anxiety...

Amphetamines only serve to calm people that have a disorder like ADD(cant remember the term for this)...In most people they raise anxiety levels.

Although maybe you were referring to Zoloft?
If so that is also soem very bad advice...SSRIs are well known for reducing mental capacity and stifling logical ability. I can bring up the the relevant studies if you wish.



guyutegirl (Jew-Lo)

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Re: Performance Enhancers
« Reply #15 on: June 02, 2004, 08:43:44 AM »
Listen, i wrote a follow up post after my initial post because i was being facetious, i thought it was evident so i didn't want to mislead sones. In terms of Zoloft, i don't think that will do *&^% for your LSAT, specifically. All i was saying in terms of Zoloft is that while Sones was seeing his doc, maybe the doc thought it ought to be presribed for him not for purposes of taking the LSAT, but because it may have been evident there are general levels of heightened anxiety, and possibly depression, and so it may have been prescribed for unrleated reasons. that's all. Egs: As far as my own personal experience with Adderall, it was prescribed for me for OCD. I don't have ADD or ADHD. My OCD would severely affect my test-taking abilities. I know a lot of people say they have OCD when they don't, some forms are more mild, and i know the idea that every prospective law student has to have OCD since they're going into law. So many people have it to so many different degrees that it's hard to qualify. But I've had it since i was really young, and while taking tests in college, i would start doing all that bizarre *&^% like counting, or requiring things involving even/odd numbers, to the point where i was totally involved in "evening things out" (an OCD thing) etc, that i couldn't even get to the questions. After trying a few things, my doctor finally prescribed Adderall and ever since, i can actually take the test without having to resort to counting, or those other things mental patients like me have to do. I know other people without any disorder, who take it to cocentrate, and they don't get all speedy, they actually can focus and get their *&^% done. Jacy: no disrespect, i know we may have conflicting views, it was just clear that Sones has no ethical qualms about using it. So i had just sorta moved on from the ethical discussion. No disrespect meant. Anyway, I ahve known a lot of people who have taken it (unprescribed) in college and it worked for them, they focused well, and did better overall. But maybe that won't be the case for you, Sones. I'm just saying from what i know with my experience and that of those around me, it's definitely helped them perform better overall.

$ones

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Re: Performance Enhancers
« Reply #16 on: June 02, 2004, 10:26:21 AM »
I appreciate your advice jew-lo and I LOVE you! I dont see it as unethical to take adderall. In my opinion, nutritional supplements or pharmaceuticals is just part of game, its an avenue that needs to be explored. If one feels like it can help their perfomance, its a choice one needs to make with oneself.

Jacy, I respect your opinion even though mine conflicts with it. But I dont think for a second that any drug will replace hard work and practice. I've been working very hard studying for approximately 6-7 weeks and I seek these peripheal measures as just that, a secondary component to a well rounded study plan.

ZOLOFT! WHAT THE @#!*? STIFLING LOGICAL ABILITY AND REDUCING MENTAL CAPACITY? M2 COULD YOU GIVE ME A LINK TO OR BRING UP THOSE STUDIES PLEASE. What do you guys think? Should I get off it? I think I had a mild depression when I started but I dont think I really need it. I took it soley to improve concentration. Do you know if there somekind of rebound effect if I get off it abruptly?

nathanielmark

Re: Performance Enhancers
« Reply #17 on: June 02, 2004, 10:28:29 AM »
how long have you been on zoloft?  if its been a long time then coming off it will do more to disrupt your thought processes then to help it.  the cognitive effects of zoloft are primarily transient.  i dont think it will matter much if you have been taking it for a while.

if you just started then i would stop ASAP, unless you need it to function.

$ones

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Re: Performance Enhancers
« Reply #18 on: June 02, 2004, 10:30:23 AM »
Been on it exactly 34 days....

nathanielmark

Re: Performance Enhancers
« Reply #19 on: June 02, 2004, 10:35:30 AM »

that actually sucks.  if you quit taking it you will go thru withdrawel.  2 weeks before the test you will probably still be experiencing the effects.  its also short enough that it is probably still having subtle effects on your thinking.

i doubt it will impact your score greatly, but could make a slight difference.

Been on it exactly 34 days....