Wayne (50% tuition) v. MSU (Full ride)

[andrewje]

I thought MSU was T3...no?

Last year is was but it dropped to T4 this year because of a bad bar passage year and incomplete graduate placement data (according to MSU).  It's bar passage rate the past few years has been 95%ish and it's median LSAT is higher than many T3's and some T2's, so it should move at least back to T3 in April.  We'll see.

[holler21]

wonder how many heads were rolled because of that @#!* up

[bigfatbox]

I would pay first tuition deposits to both for now and then see how MSU does in this year's USNWR rankings.  If MSU goes back to T3 or possibly even T2 (I said possibly) like they hope, then your decision gets tougher.  If MSU still ranks T4, then your decision is easy, IMO. 

Paying both deposits might be good advice if the OP is trying to decide might be a good idea.

However, basing the decision on where MSU ranks is a joke. The difference between tier 2/3/4 isn't really as big as a lot of people like to make it. Especially people who aren't in law school yet. In particular, the job opportunities aren't all that different at these types of schools.

For example, to even get a screening interview with one of the big Detroit firms, you need to be need to have a top 10% ranking and be on law review if you go to Wayne(tier 3), Detroit-Mercy(tier 4), or MSU (tier 3/4). The same is probably true if you go to a tier 2 a few hours away.

In the Michigan legal market, employers won't care. They already have fixed ideas about where the schools stand that aren't going to change that because of the USNews rankings.

[andrewje]

I would pay first tuition deposits to both for now and then see how MSU does in this year's USNWR rankings.  If MSU goes back to T3 or possibly even T2 (I said possibly) like they hope, then your decision gets tougher.  If MSU still ranks T4, then your decision is easy, IMO. 

Paying both deposits might be good advice if the OP is trying to decide might be a good idea.

However, basing the decision on where MSU ranks is a joke. The difference between tier 2/3/4 isn't really as big as a lot of people like to make it. Especially people who aren't in law school yet. In particular, the job opportunities aren't all that different at these types of schools.

For example, to even get a screening interview with one of the big Detroit firms, you need to be need to have a top 10% ranking and be on law review if you go to Wayne(tier 3), Detroit-Mercy(tier 4), or MSU (tier 3/4). The same is probably true if you go to a tier 2 a few hours away.

In the Michigan legal market, employers won't care. They already have fixed ideas about where the schools stand that aren't going to change that because of the USNews rankings.

Easy there. I completely agree.  And the schools definitely have different feels so the OP should go where he/she feels most comfortable.  Although I do think that down the road if one wants to practice outside of the midwest, MSU will have better name recognition.  But by then, employers will care more about your previous job than your school.

[bigfatbox]

Easy there. I completely agree.  And the schools definitely have different feels so the OP should go where he/she feels most comfortable.  Although I do think that down the road if one wants to practice outside of the midwest, MSU will have better name recognition.  But by then, employers will care more about your previous job than your school.

MSU's name recognition may help a little at small firms out of state. However, they will still probably want to see good grades or some other compelling factor to justify hiring an out of state student over the local school students they usually favor.

As a general rule, employers favor students from the top law schools and the very, very top students at the local schools. Pick any decent sized city in America. Go to the websites of the large law firms there. Scan the attorney profiles. Look at who was hired from the local school (i.e. tier 2/3/4 school). Chances are they graduated with latin honors and were on law review.

Big firms, competitive government agencies, etc. know that MSU law is not a top law school and not on the same level as the other big ten law schools even though MSU is well known and decently respected as a university. Thus, I doubt the "name recognition" really helps there.

Again, employers have fixed ideas about where schools stand. They don't need the USNEWS rankings to tell them anything.

[molaw]

I'm in a similar boat - except full-rides at both Wayne & MSU.  Same GPA requirements as OP - Wayne 3.25 MSU 3.0.

I go back and forth every minute!  I really liked MSU from their open house on Friday.  I'm hoping that after Wayne's open house in a few weeks the decision will seem more clear.

[nonamesleftforme]

I would go to MSU.  Full ride (yeah for you!) and a lower GPA. 

You can do great things out of a lower-ranked law school (I don't even know where MSU is in the ranking, nor do I care).   But if it is lower than the other option, you'll also be a bigger fish. 

Good luck.

[Lucero]

I would have to go win MSU despite the lower USNews ranking. #1) Quality of Life - East Lansing is a great college town with a beautiful campus, great atmosphere and beautiful undergrads (if that's something you care about. Happy hours, football games...you get the picture. Wayne...umm, downtown D-town campus (I use the term loosely here). Pretty rough areas around it. Commuter school. #2) MSU's alumni network - MSU grads, business and legal, make up a huge amount of MI's population. UM grads seem to head out of state more frequently. Wayne? Umm...What it comes down to is job placement is going to be pretty dicey either way unless you are tip top of the class which means you are going to have to put in a lot of your own legwork, whichever school you decide on. Why not enjoy your three years with fun classmates at a fun school? Plus the extra money doesn't hurt. It sounds like you've already checked the curves out, but talk to some students about this as well.

[andrewje]

Does anyone know the grading curves at MSU and Wayne?

[TheJesus]

I was in a similar boat, but I thought Wayne was the easy choice...so that's where I am now...