Law School Discussion

What do you think?

What do you think?
« on: January 30, 2007, 10:56:21 PM »
I am a 1L T4 student with a 3.91 GPA (class rank still not out but thinking top 3%) - what do you think my chances are at GULC?  My undergrad GPA and LSAT are not all that hot but I am hoping that they can look past all of that.  Any help would be appriciated- thanks in advance

UChi2L

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Re: What do you think?
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2007, 05:02:28 AM »
I'd guess 40-50% chance of getting in.  To be honest, it depends on which T4 you're at (and where it's located).

Re: What do you think?
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2007, 08:34:15 AM »
Well its in Chicago (there is only one, so you do the math)- and I would say as far as T4's go its pretty competitive and fairly well respected (at least in Chicago)

Re: What do you think?
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2007, 09:22:33 AM »
As in all things related to transferring:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/transferapps/

The database should answer a lot.

Ronald Hyatt

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Re: What do you think?
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2007, 03:44:41 PM »
Assuming you finish out the year in the top 5%, I would say your chances of transferring to a T14 are pretty good. Do you have your heart set on GULC? If you are flexible enough to move, you might as well cast a wider net and apply to several of the so-called elite law schools. Definitely go to the Yahoo Group and peruse the databases for past years' transfer results. They are replete with examples of average to poor UGPA/LSAT scores transferring to top-notch schools after placing in the top of their 1L classes. Also, if you search through old messages in there, you should be able to find out which schools accept more transfer students (e.g. - NYU, Columbia, Harvard, Boalt, GULC) and those which only accept enough to make up for first year attrition (e.g. - Yale, Stanford).

One more piece of advice. While it is not a bad idea to ponder the possibility of transferring now, realize that there is no rush. Applications aren't due until mid-summer (mid-June-ish, depending on which school). The most important thing for you to do right now is to concentrate on finishing 1L and staying at the very top of your class--with the notable exception that you should approach professors for recommendations at some point before the year is over. After you you ace your finals, you will have plenty of time to submit applications.

UChi2L

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Re: What do you think?
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2007, 05:20:11 PM »
T4 to t14 is exceedingly rare.  You should pepper all the schools you're interested in that are in the first tier ... even if you're in the very top of your class, it's hard to go from a T2 to t14.

If you have phenomenal life/work experience, it's possible, but in addition to the t14 schools measured, I would aim at the t14-25 at the very least.

Ronald Hyatt

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Re: What do you think?
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2007, 06:18:29 PM »
T4 to t14 is exceedingly rare.

Yes, but students in the top 3% of their classes are also exceedingly rare.

You should pepper all the schools you're interested in that are in the first tier ... even if you're in the very top of your class, it's hard to go from a T2 to t14.

Agreed--like I said, cast a wider net. Apply to any school that you might rather go to. Roll the dice. It is certainly no guarantee, but it definitely happens. I transferred from a low T2 to a T14, and I know of at least five or six students who spent last year at a T4.

If you have phenomenal life/work experience, it's possible, but in addition to the t14 schools measured, I would aim at the t14-25 at the very least.

Me personally, I didn't really want to leave my school that badly. I mean, hey, when you are at the top of your class, your future opportunities are already looking pretty good... scholarship money, law review, good job prospects, friends and network, etc. So I only applied to three schools--all within the T10 and only in two cities. I figured if I was going to give all that up, it needed to be one of the top schools in the country and someplace I wanted to live. That's just my experience, though.

UChi2L

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Re: What do you think?
« Reply #7 on: February 04, 2007, 08:31:15 AM »
If you don't want to leave your school that badly, I assume you don't "cast a wide net."  Just my advice to the OP.

Ronald Hyatt

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Re: What do you think?
« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2007, 12:34:47 PM »
Right... so the size of your net is directly proportional to the reason why you are interested in transferring.

Reason:    Pure Upgrade <---------------------------------------------------------> Dream School
Net Size: All T25 Schools <------------------------------------------------------> Only one school

In between you have some combination of factors such as:

  prestige whore-iness,
  geographical preferences/constraints,
  personal/family considerations,
  convenience,
  (dis)pleasure with your current situation, and
  target school specific factors such as
    specialty programs,
    job placement,
    clerkship placement,
    law review/journal memberships,
    class ranking/grading

Each of these will shift your net size somewhere along the continuum. My point is that it is a highly personal decision... luckily, you have plenty of time to think about it.

The original question, though, wasn't "how wide should my net be," it was "what are my chances?" The later question can't really be answered with any certainty, since the whole thing is such a crap shoot, except to say that if you cast a wider net your chances must certainly increase of being accepted somewhere. If you just apply to GULC, I would say that you have a decent shot (~33%) with your ranking. If you apply to every school in the top 25, then I'd say your chances go up considerably (~90%). So indirectly, the answer to the "net" question will affect the answer to the "chances" question. HTH.

Re: What do you think?
« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2007, 01:23:49 PM »
Thank you everyone for your help it has really helped.  The original question was based around GULC just because of their early admission cycle.  Ideally I would want to stay in Chicago (U of Chi, Northwestern) but I would definately move if I got into a dream school in another city.  The decision is difficult because I am happy at my current institution (w/friends, classes, etc) except there have been many instances already that have led me to question the quality of the schools administration.  This reflects poorly on the school and I think has hurt its reputation among firms in the city.   This has almost made me feel like I NEED to transfer or else doors will be closed.  We finally got our class ranks and I am indeed in the top 3% so hopefully this will get me somewhere great!  Thanks everyone again for all of your help- GO BEARS