Some things about LS Confidential

[LostMyMonkeys]

I agree that waiting until the end of the semester to outline is a horrible idea.  At the end of the semester, you should be doing practice questions and exams.  I don't have a "schedule" for outlining, like I don't do it every Sunday like Jumboshrimps.  I typically group it my classes in sections.  For example, when we finish talking about the Erie doctrine in CivPro, I'll outline those lectures in a lump, and then I wait until we finish another "section" and outline that, etc.

I've done it both ways and while when I did it at the end of the semester, I did ok. I passed with ok grades and all, good enough, I never got in any practice exams or review questions (ala PMBR or similar MC types). I think the way I am doing it this time, which is that I have time builti in on Fridays (no classes) to outline what I learned that week, will give me more of the time I need to do pracice exams and all that...give me the boost I need to go from grades that are just a'ight to really good grades.

[Jumboshrimps]

I'm sure this question has been asked on here before . . . but I'm reading PLS II now and was planning on picking up LSC (b/c of the good things I've heard about it), but was wondering which book current LS students think is most useful.  I'm only about 100 or so pages into PLS, so I'd be perfectly fine seting it aside to read LSC instead (or reading both). But I don't want to waste my time reading the next 700 pages of PLS if the 400 or so of LSC will suffice (or be better).

Thanks!

I'd avoid anything comprehensive like the PLS thing. My best advice would be to learn the structure of your state's court system, and the federal court system, before law school starts. (If you live in Texas, this is no small undertaking). This will help you understand procedure bettter, and will be especially helpful if you become a clerk of any kind.

[tacojohn]

I'm sure this question has been asked on here before . . . but I'm reading PLS II now and was planning on picking up LSC (b/c of the good things I've heard about it), but was wondering which book current LS students think is most useful.  I'm only about 100 or so pages into PLS, so I'd be perfectly fine seting it aside to read LSC instead (or reading both). But I don't want to waste my time reading the next 700 pages of PLS if the 400 or so of LSC will suffice (or be better).

Thanks!

If you're not at least willing to read all 1100 pages, law school is not for you.

[jessieivy1]

I'm sure this question has been asked on here before . . . but I'm reading PLS II now and was planning on picking up LSC (b/c of the good things I've heard about it), but was wondering which book current LS students think is most useful.  I'm only about 100 or so pages into PLS, so I'd be perfectly fine seting it aside to read LSC instead (or reading both). But I don't want to waste my time reading the next 700 pages of PLS if the 400 or so of LSC will suffice (or be better).

Thanks!

If you're not at least willing to read all 1100 pages, law school is not for you.

If you read my post more carefully, you would have seen that I said I was willing to read BOTH BOOKS, if both were useful.

[burghblast]

I have delved into Law School Confidential recently and have a few things to bring up and see if anyone else feels this way. First of all does anyone else feel who has read it that it definitely has a slant.. in the sense that this guy thinks that getting 4 B's in your first semester of 1L is just horrid? I mean come on.. the book gives the sense that anything except mostly As and a B+ is bad and makes it unable for you to find a 1L summer position.


Blegh... and the highlighter trick? Im not sure how I feel about highlighting my books in a rainbow of colors.

What do you guys think of this book and its particular study methods?

I think LSC was geared towards people attending the top 20 or 30 schools in the country.  I know that most of the people they quote went to top schools; they interview the Cornell dean; and their law review/writing competition chapter focuses on the Penn Law Review. I think grade inflation tends to be more rampant at the top schoos.

I'm at NU, and our mandatory curve for first year classes requires no grade lower than a B-.  For the most part, the presumption is that professors don't grade any lower than they have to, which means in a section of 65 people only 11 would get a B- and the rest would get a B or better. 

Professors have some discretion, but assuming a typical distribution within the mandated ranges:

A+ = 95th percentile and above
A = 80-95th percentile
A- = 70-80th percentile
B+ = 45-70th percentile
B = 15-45th percentile
B- = 15th percentile and below

Someone who gets straight B's would be near the bottom of the class here.

[giraffe205]

It should be mentioned that the "bookbriefing" thing will have absolutely no effect on how well you do on exams. It's for getting through being called on only. I've finally resigned myself to the fact that the best way to be both prepared for class and able to distill the case law is to brief each case. Problem is, most people forget that a brief is supposed to be brief. My briefs have one or two sentences of facts and one or two sentences of law. A side benefit is that forcing yourself to do this makes you a concise and focused writer.

Absolutely. It's the difference between preparing for class and preparing to be a lawyer. Reading and briefing so that you can be prepared in class and not look like an idiot versus reading and briefing to learn the law, commit it to long term memory and have it retained so that come end of semester, you don't need to cram and re-learn all the material but rather you can focus and review and do practice exams and all that.

The difference b/w using the bookbriefing method to be prepared for class and regular briefing to memorize cases has no correlation to preparing to be an attorney. If passing the bar required sheer memory, I would pass w/ a 98% or better. But being an atty is not simply about memorizing old cases but apply the rule of law to a unique fact pattern. Thus, neither bookbriefing or regular briefing will help a student in this area. Rule application is something that you either can or can't do well.

[LostMyMonkeys]

It should be mentioned that the "bookbriefing" thing will have absolutely no effect on how well you do on exams. It's for getting through being called on only. I've finally resigned myself to the fact that the best way to be both prepared for class and able to distill the case law is to brief each case. Problem is, most people forget that a brief is supposed to be brief. My briefs have one or two sentences of facts and one or two sentences of law. A side benefit is that forcing yourself to do this makes you a concise and focused writer.

Absolutely. It's the difference between preparing for class and preparing to be a lawyer. Reading and briefing so that you can be prepared in class and not look like an idiot versus reading and briefing to learn the law, commit it to long term memory and have it retained so that come end of semester, you don't need to cram and re-learn all the material but rather you can focus and review and do practice exams and all that.

The difference b/w using the bookbriefing method to be prepared for class and regular briefing to memorize cases has no correlation to preparing to be an attorney. If passing the bar required sheer memory, I would pass w/ a 98% or better. But being an atty is not simply about memorizing old cases but apply the rule of law to a unique fact pattern. Thus, neither bookbriefing or regular briefing will help a student in this area. Rule application is something that you either can or can't do well.

I disgree that one does regular briefs for the purpose of memorizing old cases. I never memorize cases. That's not the purpose of reading them. By doing a regluar brief, I am learning to pick apart the facts and apply the rule of law to that unique fact pattern.  I belive that briefing is designed PRECISCELY to teach a student to apply tht law.

Highlighting a few passages in a bookbrief only helps me understand what happened in that case. Writting out my own brief, in my own words, teaches me to pull out the applicable information and put it into application

[jacy85]

Absolutely. It's the difference between preparing for class and preparing to be a lawyer. Reading and briefing so that you can be prepared in class and not look like an idiot versus reading and briefing to learn the law, commit it to long term memory and have it retained so that come end of semester, you don't need to cram and re-learn all the material but rather you can focus and review and do practice exams and all that.

I disgree that one does regular briefs for the purpose of memorizing old cases. I never memorize cases. That's not the purpose of reading them. By doing a regluar brief, I am learning to pick apart the facts and apply the rule of law to that unique fact pattern.  I belive that briefing is designed PRECISCELY to teach a student to apply tht law.

Highlighting a few passages in a bookbrief only helps me understand what happened in that case. Writting out my own brief, in my own words, teaches me to pull out the applicable information and put it into application

So, uh....you disagree with your own statement??  Learning to pick out relevant facts is very different than memorizing anything.  Very little about the law, beyond law school and the bar exam, is about memorization.  It's the ability to discern what facts are relevant, the ability to read a case and to be able to formulate a rule that the case stands for, and the ability to apply such rules to your facts.  It's a process, a skill, and involves absolutely no memorization.  I'm not sure if this is what you're trying to convey with your posts, but your statements are somewhat inconsistent.

[lincolnsgrandson]

As to the OP's first question.  Get used to law school curves and their effect on your future.  At my school, a B is worth 3.0.  The median after my first year was 3.21.  You have a first year of mostly B's?  Do the math. 
And keep in mind that it's not good grades that will get you coveted summer associate jobs, it's excellent grades.  You might feel proud of yourself if you just nudge the top third, but you'll still probably be a non-winner.

As to "book-briefing," I thought it was a waste of time.  I used multi-colored high-lighters my first year, and I all I wound up with at the end of the year was several hundred dollars worth of coloring books.  I think it was a big factor in my not having an excellent first year.
I find that system unnecessary in the age of laptops, where it really isn't much of a problem to take notes as I read.  I don't care if I take too many notes - it's easier to delete (or cut and paste) than it is to add later.
But a lot of people love to highlight.  Just don't feel like you have to do anything other than what works for you.   

[jacy85]

Just don't feel like you have to do anything other than what works for you.   

Amen.