Law School Discussion

Done With Property!

Done With Property!
« on: December 13, 2004, 03:24:06 PM »
So I think I just completely failed by property exam.  Which makes absolutely no sense.  The class that I did the MOST reading for, pulled cases off the shelf for, kept up on all the reading for... the end it didn't matter.  I am thoroughly conviced that Property is the toughest class a 1L can take.  There's no way you can know all that *&^%!  I had a 5 hour exam that took every minute of 5 hours until time was called.  My professor (who is cited as an authority in the E and E) threw all kinds of loops in the fact pattern.  Just when you thought you had an issue that you could debate one, she took it away so that you couldn't debate on it.  For example, in one question she gave an ambiguous conveyance that could have been either a joint tenancy or a tenancy in common, in which a mortgage was taken out on the property.  normally this leads to a debate of lien theory vs. title theory when somebody dies and is left in sole possession where the bank will say title theory so the loan will stick and the surviving tenant who did not make the loan on his half will say lien theory so that the mortgage dies with the tenant who made it....

...but then she goes and says that BOTH tenants signed the mortgage so it didn't matter anyway which freakin type of cotenancy it was since both of them made the mortgage!  Took away my entire argument!

Let's hope the curve gods grant me safe passage on this one.

Re: Done With Property!
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2004, 04:05:58 PM »
You know what though, that you recognized that trick probably means you did okay - how many students do you think overlooked that both tenants signed the mortgage?  I was told, the more you more, the worst you think you did because you start to think of all the issues you missed... if you didn't know so much, would you even think of it? 

At any rate, I have property Thursday and am DREADING it!  I hear it's the class that makes or breaks a 1L, that is, F's are common, and one F equals goodbye.  Although, mine is only up to the RAP,  I have another semester to look forward to (if I am so fortunate). 

5 hours of Property? That is worse than Abu Grahib prison!


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Re: Done With Property!
« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2004, 05:41:50 PM »
i agree 100%. property was by far the hardest exam i ever took. i have property for a year also, so it was only up to the RAP but......we had one fact pattern that incorporated adverse possession of real property and chattels, bailments, acquisition by find and capture, gifts, and there were even a couple facts that made conveyances. It was 3 pages long and the worst fact pattern i have ever encountered - my repsonse was 12 pages. and that was only worth 25% of the test. The rest was on future interests. My prof is cited in the dukheimer book, as well as written the lexis-nexis review book on future interests. This was his area of expertise and i guess he wanted everyone and their mother to know it. Last year, the person who got an A on the exam got a 47. So, i completely empathize with ya sands.

p.s. my spelling sucks.


Re: Done With Property!
« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2004, 10:09:57 PM »
excellent, i'm taking property next semester.  should i start reading over the break?  i'll have a boring week in London to do nothing ??? ??? ???

Re: Done With Property!
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2004, 12:14:56 AM »
Lipper - Yo we used the Dukheimer book for property, small world.  Some of these professors are really into their field.  My professor will fly out to the sites in the Dukheimer book and take friggin pictures of the case locations during her vacation.  Talk about obsessed.

DP - I guess you're right, i never thought of it like that.  If I didn't know anything about the class I probably would have thought that what I put down was fine, but since I know so many details, more than I can possibly ever put down on any one exam, I felt like I didn't get a chance to talk about this or that.  On my K exam I learned about 1/2 of the material 2 weeks prior to the exam, so when I took that exam I felt great.  Probably b/c I didn't really know enough to think I did bad.

Dgatl - it doesn't matter man.  It all comes down to that exam.  Speakin of which, i've noticed that law school professors like to pull the old undergrad tactic when it comes to making up the exam, meaning you'll have an entire semester of stuff to go over, but the exam will focus around the last couple of things you "learned" at the end of the semester.  She threw a few old zingers on there that made me flip toward the front of my outline around future interests and life estates, but for the most part she focussed on covenants and easements since that was the last thing we covered.

One of the questions I swear took me about 45 minutes just to friggin READ and understand.  I kept lookin at the clock thinking to myself "this is rediculous, i cannot believe its taking me this long to read this stupid problem! I must be retarded!"  if it didn't take up so much damn space I'd post it up here since I still have the exam.  It was a covenant question, with all kinds of details in the fact pattern that you had to pay attention to in order to figure out if the covenant ran with the land or not, was a scheme developed, was it not developed, if it was developed who were the strangers to the deed, who did it effect, etc.


the grand mother of all 1L classes.


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Re: Done With Property!
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2004, 08:23:20 AM »
Well, burning, you just made me glad I'm in a part-time program.  We get property next year.  Maybe I'll be ready for it by then, if I survive that long.

Re: Done With Property!
« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2004, 05:45:31 PM »
Hey Sands,

I agree with everyone else, the fact that you knew that you did not have time to address everything proves that you knew your stuff.  A few 2Ls told me that you should never walk out of an exam thinking that you covered everything.  I'm sure that you did great.

I'm dreading my Property Exam which is on Friday.  My professor has written a Casebook on Wills, Trusts and Future Interests so I am NOT looking forward to the FI fact pattern that he has created for the exam.

Re: Done With Property!
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2004, 06:14:39 PM »
I'm studying for my property exam next Monday.  Two fact patterns and 8 conveyences to figure out who has what interests.

Burning Sands - I agree if you could find issues others didn't, you probably did OK.  But I'm not sure what you mean by the professor "took away your whole argument."  I hope you argued or discussed all sides; didn't just blow it off.  That's what she probably wanted.

Dgtl - You might try the E&E for property.  It isn't too hard (not as many questions as Civ Pro) but will get you off and running a bit on the subject.

Re: Done With Property!
« Reply #8 on: December 15, 2004, 09:05:13 AM »
Let's hope you guys are right.