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Author Topic: Should we right past wrongs?  (Read 604 times)

baileypicks24

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Should we right past wrongs?
« on: March 24, 2005, 08:41:10 PM »
We should, shouldnt we? How else can we ever move on?

Take the Holocaust for example. It would be completely wrong and unethical not to make an attempt to correct it, as Germany still strives to this very day to make land, monetary, and all types of compensation to Holocaust victims...

Or the Japanese who were held in (arguably) concentration camps during WWII. They were all given financial compensation for the crimes committed against them.

Yet what about blacks? The economy of the United States BOOMED during the illegal forced labor of African Americans, very heavily due to this illegal free labor. Yet have we compensated blacks? No...and look at the tension between whites and blacks today. Perhaps if we righted this past wrong, we wouldn't have gone thru segregation and the continued discrimination we face today???

I don't know...I'm just throwing it out for an intellectual discussion. Should we right past wrongs?

mercutio_13

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Re: Should we right past wrongs?
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2005, 09:40:40 PM »
My thoughts on this?

No.

Javert

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Re: Should we right past wrongs?
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2005, 09:52:33 PM »
Quote
Yet what about blacks? The economy of the United States BOOMED during the illegal forced labor of African Americans, very heavily due to this illegal free labor. Yet have we compensated blacks? No...and look at the tension between whites and blacks today. Perhaps if we righted this past wrong, we wouldn't have gone thru segregation and the continued discrimination we face today???

I'm half-Mexican. Ostensibly, the US stole part of my country. Oh, and I'm also part Irish; for a long time, the Irish were discriminated against. Should I get compensation for that too?

[For that matter, why don't the descendents of slaves ever attempt to seek compensation from the descendents of the other Africans who were complicit in the slave trade?]

How far back do you want to go? I'm sure that there are descendents of the villages of Umma and Lagash out there *somewhere*; they should try to get compensation out of the descendents of the King of Kish!

No. Down this path lies madness. The best thing any disadvantaged group in America can do is exploit the ample opportunities this country offers everybody. If compensation is needed, then living in a highly mobile society where anybody can become rich is it.

[Bonus Round: Those who are descended from slaves would never have been born were it not for the slave trade; circumstances would have been that there parents most likely never would have existed. Setting aside that logistical problem, do you suppose said descendents would be better or worse off if they had been born in Africa?]
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mercutio_13

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Re: Should we right past wrongs?
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2005, 09:54:51 PM »
exactly.

I call it as I see it

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Re: Should we right past wrongs?
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2005, 10:00:23 PM »
Damn negros always wanting something for nothing. How about the northern whites that fought for your freedom?

strouse

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Re: Should we right past wrongs?
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2005, 10:08:51 PM »
The biggest difference between slavery and the war atrocities of WWII is that the US righted the wrong (by ending slavery that is) internally and without the need for outside intervention.  And one could argue that AA and the "welfare state" were created to help right the wrong. 

EDIT: Furthermore, the reparations paid to the Japanese Americans was an embarrasment brought about by political correctness.  Roosevelt was just being overly cautious during a time when people weren't so damned concerned about whose feeling were going to get hurt.

Yes, I am drunk right now.

baileypicks24

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Re: Should we right past wrongs?
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2005, 11:12:41 PM »
Hmmm...my intention wasn't to focus on black, but I was speaking in general...

Javert is absolutely correct, though. You can go back in history and find countless examples of unjust atrocities committed against a people, without any attempt of reparation made, on every continent.

But does that make it right to ignore the past and make no attempt to fix it?

Again, my question was in general: should we correct past wrongs??

It seems like the ethical thing to do. Take the Native Americans for example. When we displaced countless Indians farther and farther West, destroying them with our guns, germs and steel, and giving them relatively nothing in reparations, shouldn't we expect little wacko Indians to have a hatred towards us? Take the Minnesota school shooting, oen of the most tragic events in recent memory. The Native American boy had a "chip on his shoulder" against everyone since his race was reduced to nothing. Although NOTHING justifies a school shooting anywhere, anytime, shouldn't we expect violence and hatred from groups of people who've we've done wrong against??

Javert

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Re: Should we right past wrongs?
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2005, 11:38:33 PM »
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Bailey: But does that make it right to ignore the past and make no attempt to fix it?

It doesn't make it right. However, governments and nations don't deal in terms of 'right' and 'wrong'; they deal in terms of practicality. Righting all the past wrongs would be an insurmountable task. It's that simple.

It also has unintended consequences. After World War 2, for instance, it was thought that we should compensate the Jews by helping establish the state of Israel via the mechanisms of the UN. That, um, didn't quite work out the way we intended. In fact, now we're going back and trying to do right by the Palestinians, to... correct past wrongs.

Oops.

Such is the way of the world. If you're obsessed with correcting past mistakes, you're only going to create a new litany of mistakes to correct. It never ends.

Quote
It seems like the ethical thing to do. Take the Native Americans for example. When we displaced countless Indians farther and farther West, destroying them with our guns, germs and steel, and giving them relatively nothing in reparations, shouldn't we expect little wacko Indians to have a hatred towards us?

... sure, probably. But we can't very well give all the land back.

Quote
Take the Minnesota school shooting, oen of the most tragic events in recent memory. The Native American boy had a "chip on his shoulder" against everyone since his race was reduced to nothing.

I haven't read on that case, but the Columbine kids weren't Native American. Neither was the guy who kidnapped and murdered that little girl in Florida. The simple fact is that some people are f-ing nuts, and there's probably not much we can do about it.

The perfect is the enemy of the good. We have a good world (excluding most of Africa and the Middle East); we really shouldn't muck it up by trying to be perfect.
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baileypicks24

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Re: Should we right past wrongs?
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2005, 11:50:11 PM »
Such is the way of the world. If you're obsessed with correcting past mistakes, you're only going to create a new litany of mistakes to correct. It never ends.

True. Every action has a reaction.

Judging from what you've written I think you agree with me that we SHOULD correct past wrongs, but it wouldn't be PRACTICAL to do so, no? And I agree. However, I'm not "obsessed with correcting past mistakes." I do, however, propose that we must be a little more responsible, and take a look at the wrongs our actions may create.

The perfect is the enemy of the good. We have a good world (excluding most of Africa and the Middle East); we really shouldn't muck it up by trying to be perfect.

Well, I'll agree with everything you said other than that statement. Sounds pretty ignorant to me...

PresClay_00

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Re: Should we right past wrongs?
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2005, 12:10:04 AM »
No.

nice Javert