1L's & Current Black Law Students

[The Infamous "Most Difficult Law School Class" Poll:]

The Infamous "Most Difficult Law School Class" Poll:

I'm a law student and K is the most difficult class.

 17 (8.9%)

I'm a law student and Torts is the most difficult class.

 4 (2.1%)

I'm a law student and Crim Law is the most difficult class.

 2 (1%)

I'm a law student and Civ Pro is the most difficult class.

 23 (12%)

I'm a law student and Con Law is the most difficult class.

 12 (6.3%)

I'm a law student and Property is the most difficult class.

 16 (8.3%)

I'm a law student and LRW is the most difficult class.

 7 (3.6%)

I'm not a law student but I think Contracts would be the most difficult class.

 13 (6.8%)

I'm not a law student but I think Torts would be the most difficult class.

 13 (6.8%)

I'm not a law student but I think Criminal Law would be the most difficult class.

 3 (1.6%)

I'm not a law student but I think Civil Procedure would be the most difficult class.

 25 (13%)

I'm not a law student but I think Constitutional Law would be the most difficult class.

 14 (7.3%)

I'm not a law student but I think Property would be the most difficult class.

 17 (8.9%)

I'm not a law student but I think Legal Research & Writing would be the most difficult class.

 26 (13.5%)

Total Members Voted: 145

[Bubbazzz]

dont even get me started on the rule against perpetuities....what was it about an after-born-child? fee simple subject to condition WHAT??? THANK GOD i dont have to worry about that again until the bar. property was def. the worst subject first semester, and the only reason being the damn R.A.P. You will not feel totally law-school-lawyerly-like until you have felt the wrath of the R-TO-THA-IZZ-A-TO-THA-MOTHAF'N-P. yeah civ pro sucks some major donkey genetelia(sp?). contracts wasn't that bad, torts is by far the easiest. this second semester - DO NOT EVEN GET ME GOING ON CONSTITUTIONAL LAW!!!!!!!!! damn class gives like 3 hours a night, supreme court justices always feel the need to chime in with like 3 concurring opinions and ALWAYS ALWAYS 4 dissenting opinions. i can handle property II, contracts II, and criminal, but toss a night of con law reading in, and then sprinkle a nice persuasive memo on top of that. DAAAAAAYUM!!!!!! i thought first semester was kickin like karate - boy was i wrong.

[Made4law]

Thanks for the detailed info. this just reaffirms what I was thinking anyway. I am going to try to use some of the studying and note taking advice that I pick up from LS confidential and I will grab PSII off of Amazon.  I have a very hectic summer planned and this has eased my mind a bit.  Luckily I'm selling my house and moving to a much cheaper state, I don't have very much undergrad debt and am already in the saving conserving mode. The fact that I'm coming from a nontrad position is actually helping me.  I feel like one of those college ball players and just got drafted to the pro's I don't care if I go number 1, I just wanna be in the show. Because once training camp starts (school, after the bar, court etc.) we are all pretty much on equal footing.

[Burning Sands, Esq.]

dont even get me started on the rule against perpetuities....what was it about an after-born-child? fee simple subject to condition WHAT??? THANK GOD i dont have to worry about that again until the bar. property was def. the worst subject first semester, and the only reason being the damn R.A.P. You will not feel totally law-school-lawyerly-like until you have felt the wrath of the R-TO-THA-IZZ-A-TO-THA-MOTHAF'N-P. yeah civ pro sucks some major donkey genetelia(sp?). contracts wasn't that bad, torts is by far the easiest. this second semester - DO NOT EVEN GET ME GOING ON CONSTITUTIONAL LAW!!!!!!!!! damn class gives like 3 hours a night, supreme court justices always feel the need to chime in with like 3 concurring opinions and ALWAYS ALWAYS 4 dissenting opinions. i can handle property II, contracts II, and criminal, but toss a night of con law reading in, and then sprinkle a nice persuasive memo on top of that. DAAAAAAYUM!!!!!! i thought first semester was kickin like karate - boy was i wrong.

Bubbazzz - NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO DOUBT!!!!!!!  *Dap*

I'm sitting in Con Law right now.  Supreme Court Justices can talk.  Tell me those maf*ckas don't know they're on stage!  15 page dissenting opinions.  Did Justice Harlan EVER write a majority opinion?  In life?  That cat ALWAYS be on the dissenting side to every issue.  Just disagreeign to be disagreeing for no damn reason. I like how he was on the dissent in Plessy v. Furguson and then goes on to say that the white race is the clearly the master race.  That just lets you know he just wants to disagree for no reason; he didn't even believe the stuff he was spouting off about equality.

Property wasn't so bad, ya'll.  It was just those damn future interests.  That could be a whole class on its own.  I personally hated Contracts.

I started off hatig Civ Pro, but I'm starting to see the light.  This just might be the best class in law school. Its all rules.  None of that wishy washy foreseeability bullsh!t.  Rule 12(b)(6) Biiiiatch now get to steppin and get the f*ck outa my courtroom!!!


Made4Law - that's right, once you get into the league its all aobut your effort and what you put in.

[Burning Sands, Esq.]

52 Vand. L. Rev. 871

Dear Law Student:
 I have good news and bad news. The bad news is that the profession that you are about to enter is one of the most unhappy and unhealthy on the face of the earth--and, in the view of many, one of the most unethical. The good news is that you can join this profession and still be happy, healthy, and ethical. I am writing to tell you how.

TEXT:
 [*872] 
 I. The Well-Being of Lawyers
 Lawyers play an enormously important role in our society.   n1 "It is the lawyers who run our civilization for us--our governments, our business, our private lives."   n2 Thus you might expect that a lot of people would be concerned about the physical and mental health of lawyers.  [*873]  You would be wrong.   n3 Contrary to the old joke,   n4 scientists have not replaced laboratory rats with lawyers, and medical literature has little to say about the well-being of attorneys. At the same time, many law professors--at least those teaching at the fifty or so schools that consider themselves to be in the "Top Twenty"--do not care much about lawyers. Increasingly, faculties of elite schools and aspiring elite schools consist of professors who have not practiced law,   n5 who have little interest in teaching students to practice law,   n6 and who pay scant attention to the work of practicing lawyers.   n7 Even law professors like me--law professors who practiced law for several years, who love teaching, and who are intensely interested in the work of lawyers--often do not have the training or resources to conduct empirical research about the legal profession.   n8 As a result, legal scholarship also has little to say about the well-being of attorneys.   n9
 If one looks hard enough, though, one can scratch up some information about the health and happiness of attorneys. And this information--although rather sparse and, in some cases, of limited value--strongly suggests that lawyers are in remarkably poor health and quite unhappy.   [*874] 
 A. Lawyers' Poor Health
 1. Depression
 Lawyers seem to be among the most depressed people in America. In 1990, researchers affiliated with Johns Hopkins University studied the prevalence of major depressive disorder ("MDD") across 104 occupations.   n10 They discovered that, although only about 3% to 5% of the general population suffers from MDD,   n11 the prevalence of MDD exceeds 10% in five occupations: data-entry keyers, computer equipment operators, typists, pre-kindergarten and special education teachers, and lawyers.   n12 When the results were adjusted for age, gender, education, and race/ethnic background to determine to what extent those in each occupation were more depressed than others who shared their most important sociodemographic traits,   n13 only three occupations were discovered to have statistically significant elevations of MDD: lawyers, pre-kindergarten and special education teachers, and secretaries. Lawyers topped the list, suffering from MDD at a rate 3.6 times higher than non-lawyers who shared their key sociodemographic traits.   n14 The researchers did not know whether lawyers were depressed because "persons at high risk for major depressive disorder" are attracted to the legal profession or because practicing law "causes or precipitates depression."   n15 They just knew that, whatever the reason, lawyers were depressed.   n16
 Other studies have produced similar results. A study of Washington lawyers found that "compared with the 3 to 9 percent of individuals in Western industrialized countries who suffer from depression, 19 percent of . . . Washington lawyers suffered from statistically  [*875]  significant elevated levels of depression."   n17 A study of law students and practicing lawyers in Arizona discovered that when students enter law school, they suffer from depression at approximately the same rate as the general population.   n18 However, by the spring of the first year of law school, 32% of law students suffer from depression, and by the spring of the third year of law school, the figure escalates to an astonishing 40%.   n19 Two years after graduation, the rate of depression falls, but only to 17%, or roughly double the level of the general population.   n20
 Another study, making use of the data generated by the Washington and Arizona studies, reported that while "the base rate of any affective disorder (which includes depression) is 8.5% for males and 14.1% for females, . . . the percentage of male lawyers . . . scoring above the clinical cutoff on the measure of depression is nearly 21% and for female lawyers 16%."   n21 And finally, a study of North Carolina lawyers found that almost 37% reported being depressed and 42% lonely during the previous few weeks,   n22 and that 24% reported suffering symptoms of depression (such as appetite loss, insomnia, suicidal ideation, and extreme lethargy) at least three times per month during the previous year.   n23  [*876] 
 2. Anxiety and Other Mental Illness
 Depression is not the only emotional impairment that seems to be more prevalent among lawyers than among the general population. The Arizona study also found elevated rates of anxiety, hostility, and paranoia among law students and lawyers.   n24 Over 25% of North Carolina lawyers reported that they had experienced physical symptoms of extreme anxiety (including trembling hands, racing hearts, clammy hands, and faintness) at least three times per month during the past year.   n25 And the Washington study found indicia of anxiety, social alienation and isolation, obsessive-compulsiveness, paranoid ideation, interpersonal sensitivity, phobic anxiety, and hostility in "alarming" rates among lawyers--rates many times the national norms.   n26 For example:
 The base rate [in the general population] for obsessive-compulsiveness is 1.42%, yet nearly 21% of the male lawyers and 15% of the female lawyers in the study score above the clinical cutoff on the measure of obsessivecompulsiveness. The same pattern exists in regard to generalized anxiety disorder where the base rate is 4%, while 30% of the male lawyers and nearly 20% of the female lawyers in the study report scores above the clinical cutoff on the measure of anxiety.   n27
 Needless to say, these studies "give[ ] substantial indication of a profession operating at extremely high levels of psychological distress."   n28

[Burning Sands, Esq.]

 3. Alcoholism and Drug Abuse
 Lawyers appear to be prodigious drinkers. The North Carolina study reported that almost 17% of lawyers admitted to drinking three to five alcoholic beverages every day.   n29 One researcher conservatively estimated that 15% of lawyers are alcoholics.   n30 The study of Washington lawyers found that 18% were "problem drinkers," a percentage "almost twice the approximately 10 percent alcohol abuse and/or dependency prevalence rates estimated for adults in the United States."   n31 Moreover, the Washington study "revealed an astounding  [*877]  number of lawyers with a high likelihood of developing alcohol related problems."   n32
 Little is known about the frequency with which lawyers use illegal drugs, but the little that is known is not encouraging. The Washington study found that 26% of lawyers had used cocaine at least once, a rate over twice that of the general population.   n33 True, the Washington study found that only 1% of lawyers had "abused" cocaine, as compared to 3% of adults generally.   n34 But that is hardly cause for celebration. According to the Washington study, one third of lawyers in Washington suffer from depression, problem drinking, or cocaine abuse.   n35 There is no reason to believe that Washington is anomalous.   n36
 4. Divorce
 Marriage is good for people. "The research on marriage is striking. For decades, studies have shown that the married live longer and have a lower risk of a variety of physical and psychological illnesses than the unmarried."   n37 Also, those who are married report higher levels of career satisfaction than those who are single.   n38 The North Carolina study confirmed that what is true for people generally is also true for lawyers specifically: Among lawyers, "changing from single to married status directly increases happiness and satisfaction with life. Marriage also leads to greater job and career satisfaction . . . and improves health."   n39 The North Carolina study identified unmarried lawyers as one of three categories of lawyers least satisfied with their lives.   n40  [*878] 
 Likewise, divorce is bad for people, both physically and psychologically (and, for women, economically).   n41 Those who divorce die younger than either those who never marry or those who stay married.   n42 Indeed, the impact of getting divorced on life expectancy is "only slightly less harmful . . . than smoking a pack or more of cigarettes per day."   n43 Divorced people suffer from cancer, cardiovascular disease, infectious diseases, respiratory illnesses, digestive system illnesses, and other acute conditions more frequently than do single, married, or widowed people.   n44 Divorced people are far more likely to abuse alcohol or become alcoholic than those who have never been divorced.   n45 Psychologically, divorce is devastating: "Of all the social variables relating to the incidence of psychiatric disorders, or psychopathology, in the population, none appears to be more crucial than marital status."   n46 The separated and divorced suffer from psychiatric illness (such as depression and schizophrenia) far more than do the single, married, and widowed.   n47 For example, men who are divorced or separated are admitted to hospitals for treatment of psychiatric disorders twenty-one times more frequently than married men.   n48 And, not surprising, the suicide rate of those who are divorced is almost triple the rate of those who are married, and significantly higher than the rates of those who have never married or been widowed.   n49
 Although empirical research is sparse, there is some indication that the divorce rate among lawyers is higher than the divorce rate among other professionals.   n50 Felicia Baker LeClere of Notre Dame's Center for the Study of Contemporary Society compared the incidence of divorce among lawyers to the incidence of divorce among doctors, using data from the 1990 census. LeClere found that the percentage of lawyers who are divorced is higher than the percentage of doctors who are divorced and that the difference is particularly pronounced  [*879]  among women.   n51 For example, over 16% of female attorneys between the ages of thirty-five and forty-nine are divorced, as compared to 11% of female doctors in the same age range. Similarly, among ages fifty to sixty-four, over 24% of female lawyers are divorced, as compared to about 15% of female doctors.
 LeClere's findings are consistent with an earlier study of divorce rates among female attorneys. That study found that women who have completed six or more years of postsecondary education--a category that obviously includes lawyers--have a substantially higher divorce rate than women generally.   n52 The study also found that, among well educated women, the divorce rate for female lawyers was substantially higher than the divorce rates for female physicians and female professors. Specifically, the divorce rate for female lawyers was twice the divorce rate for female doctors and 25% to 40% higher than the divorce rate for women teaching in post-secondary institutions.   n53 The study also found that, after their first marriages end, female attorneys are significantly less likely to remarry than female physicians and professors.   n54

[Burning Sands, Esq.]

 II. Explaining the Poor Health and Unhappiness of Lawyers
 A. The Hours
 Why are lawyers so unhealthy and unhappy? Why do so many lawyers, in the words of Judge Laurence Silberman, "hate what the practice of law has become"?   n117 Lawyers give many reasons. They complain about the commercialization of the legal profession--about the fact that practicing law has become less of a profession and more of a business.   n118 They complain about the increased pressure to attract  [*889]  and retain clients   n119 in a ferociously competitive marketplace.   n120 They complain about having to work in an adversarial environment "in which aggression, selfishness, hostility, suspiciousness, and cynicism are widespread."   n121 They complain about not having control over their lives and about being at the mercy of judges and clients.   n122 They complain about a lack of civility among lawyers.   n123 They complain about a lack of collegiality   n124 and loyalty   n125 among their partners. And they complain about their poor public image.   n126 Mostly, though, they complain about the hours.
 In every study of the career satisfaction of lawyers of which I am aware, in every book or article about the woes of the legal profession that I have read, and in every conversation about life as a practicing lawyer that I have heard, lawyers complain about the long hours they have to work.   n127 Without question, "the single biggest  [*890]  complaint among attorneys is increasingly long workdays with decreasing time for personal and family life."   n128 Lawyers are complaining with increasing vehemence about "living to work, rather than working to live"   n129 --about being " 'asked not to dedicate, but to sacrifice their lives to the firm.' "   n130
 To cite just a few examples: A national survey of lawyers by the National Law Journal reported that "most attorneys in the survey believed their careers were putting too much of a burden on their personal lives. When asked what they especially disliked about practicing law, more than half (54 percent) mentioned too many hours/not enough time for a personal life."   n131 The 1990 ABA study, after describing increasing job dissatisfaction among attorneys, said that "this increased dissatisfaction is directly caused by a deterioration of the lawyer workplace . . . . In particular, the amount of time lawyers have for themselves and their families has become an issue of major concern for many lawyers."   n132 The North Carolina study identified as "a major factor" in attorney dissatisfaction the "lack of enough time to balance work with time for self, family, the community, pro bono, etc."   n133 Respondents to the Michigan Law School survey reported themselves far less satisfied with "the balance of their family and professional lives" than with "their career as a whole" or any of four other measures of "life satisfaction."   n134 And the report of a national conference convened by the ABA to address "the emerging crisis in the quality of lawyers' health and lives" singled out as a "significant" cause of this crisis the fact that lawyers "do not have enough time for themselves and their families--what many have come to call 'the time famine.' "   n135  [*891] 
 Lawyers often suffer from a nostalgic longing for a past that never really existed.   n136 But when it comes to their brutal work schedules, lawyers have reason to complain, and they have reason to believe that the problem has grown worse. "Conventional wisdom just a few decades ago was that lawyers could not reasonably expect to charge for more than 1200 to 1500 hours per year."   n137 Thirty years ago, most partners billed between 1200 and 1400 hours per year and most associates between 1400 and 1600 hours.   n138 As late as the mid-1980s, even associates in large New York firms were often not expected to bill more that 1800 hours annually.   n139 Today, many firms would consider these ranges acceptable only for partners or associates who had died midway through the year.
 A study conducted by William Ross in 1991 discovered that almost half of the associates in private practice billed at least 2000 hours during both 1989 and 1990, and a fifth billed at least 2400 hours in 1990.   n140 Another study conducted by Ross three years later discovered that 51% of associates and 23% of partners billed at least 2000 hours in 1993.   n141 Seventy percent of those responding to the Michigan Law School survey worked an average of fifty or more hours per week; over a quarter of the respondents worked more than sixty hours per week.   n142 The ABA's 1990 study found that 45% of attorneys in private practice billed at least 1920 hours per year, and 16% billed 2400 or more hours.   n143 The same study also found that, although 70% of attorneys are permitted to take more than two weeks of vacation every year, only 48% actually do so.   n144 Finally, an extensive survey by Altman Weil Pensa, a prominent legal consulting firm, found that the  [*892]  median number of billable hours for associates in firms of all sizes in 1995 was 1823; 25% of associates billed 1999 hours or more, and 10% billed at least 2166 hours.   n145 Not long ago, billable hours at these levels "would have been thought unbearable."   n146
 Workloads, like the job dissatisfaction to which they so closely relate, are not distributed equally throughout the profession. Generally speaking, lawyers in private practice work longer hours than those who work for corporations or for the government.   n147 In the 1990 ABA survey, for example, only 56% of those in private practice agreed that they had enough time to spend with their families, compared to 74% of corporate lawyers and 79% of government lawyers.   n148 Similarly, only 46% of private practitioners said that they had enough time for themselves, compared to 53% of corporate lawyers and 66% of government lawyers.   n149 In the words of the study, "time for family and self is a real problem for lawyers in private practice. Far fewer lawyers in corporate counsel and government settings have insufficient time."   n150 The findings of the Michigan Law School survey were similar: Only 20% of the respondents working in private practice were "quite satisfied" with "the balance of their family and professional life," as compared to 35% of those working in corporations, 45% of those working for the government, and 50% of those doing public interest work.   n151
 Within private practice, the general rule of thumb is the bigger the firm, the longer the hours.   n152 For example, a recent study found that over 41% of associates in firms of under 101 lawyers billed fewer than 1800 hours, as compared to about 16% of associates in firms of over 250 lawyers.   n153 At the same time, almost 27% of associates in the smaller firms billed over 1900 hours, as compared to approximately  [*893]  36% of associates in the larger firms.   n154 At the biggest firms in the biggest cities, associates commonly bill 2000 to 2500 hours per year.   n155 Big firm partners do not have it much better. Junior partners at the nation's 125 largest law firms average 1955.5 billable hours per year,   n156 almost 300 hours per year more than partners in small firms.   n157 At some big firms, the average number of hours billed by partners and associates alike is 2000.   n158

[1LWhit]

My #1 complaint about law school...Uncle Toms!

There is this one black 1L and I swear...he goes out of his way to be in every white person's face!  When he comes into the library he can't just sit his ass down and crack open a book, he has to make about 6 stops at tables and kiss white ass.  I swear...he makes me sick and he won't even SPEAK to black people.  He just looks straight through us!  But you know what's funny?  During exam time he was studying all alone...the white people left his ass high and dry...LOL!


Another thing...there is this Latina girl that looks down on me, gives me bad looks, bit my head off in a negotiation exercise and gives me dirty looks when I get called on in class.  I saw her resume and guess what her GPA is???  A 2.73!!!!  Dumb chick doesn't even have a 3.00!!!  Ha ha ha...I'm smarter than you are!!!  LOL!  (btw...that's why you never tell your grades!)

[seu2002]

Thanks for hyping the legal profession so much, Redman. 

I only skimmed through your posts, but I agree with them.  The biggest drinkers/alcoholics I know are attorneys.  They're all single, divorced, or they refuse to committ fully to their relationships.  Some of them are really bitter and others are on the worst power trip I've seen.  They at least find comfort amongst each other. 

I'm nothing like them, and I hope I never turn into them.   

[seu2002]

My #1 complaint about law school...Uncle Toms!

There is this one black 1L and I swear...he goes out of his way to be in every white person's face!  When he comes into the library he can't just sit his ass down and crack open a book, he has to make about 6 stops at tables and kiss white ass.  I swear...he makes me sick and he won't even SPEAK to black people.  He just looks straight through us!  But you know what's funny?  During exam time he was studying all alone...the white people left his ass high and dry...LOL!


Another thing...there is this Latina girl that looks down on me, gives me bad looks, bit my head off in a negotiation exercise and gives me dirty looks when I get called on in class.  I saw her resume and guess what her GPA is???  A 2.73!!!!  Dumb chick doesn't even have a 3.00!!!  Ha ha ha...I'm smarter than you are!!!  LOL!  (btw...that's why you never tell your grades!)

I'm sorry to hear of your experience with that Latina.  Some of them can be really uppity, but people behave this way regardless of race.     I just hope you're not lumping all Latina's together and judging based on this woman's behavior, because this Latina (ME) is nothing like her.   

[Burning Sands, Esq.]

My #1 complaint about law school...Uncle Toms!

There is this one black 1L and I swear...he goes out of his way to be in every white person's face!  When he comes into the library he can't just sit his ass down and crack open a book, he has to make about 6 stops at tables and kiss white ass.  I swear...he makes me sick and he won't even SPEAK to black people.  He just looks straight through us!  But you know what's funny?  During exam time he was studying all alone...the white people left his ass high and dry...LOL!


Another thing...there is this Latina girl that looks down on me, gives me bad looks, bit my head off in a negotiation exercise and gives me dirty looks when I get called on in class.  I saw her resume and guess what her GPA is???  A 2.73!!!!  Dumb chick doesn't even have a 3.00!!!  Ha ha ha...I'm smarter than you are!!!  LOL!  (btw...that's why you never tell your grades!)

1LWhit - are you stupid!

I couldn't imagine going to that school.  I need my fam here or else I wouldn't make it!