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Author Topic: Military Draft Coming back?  (Read 16608 times)

thechoson

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Re: Military Draft Coming back?
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2004, 01:40:14 PM »
I agree that we have no business being in Iraq, but pulling out now would be a logicial nightmare and a grave tactical error.  How would it look to go running away from a region with our tail between our legs because people start dying...as if we didn't forsee that as a consequence.  Did we really think we were going to be in and out in 2 months?  That was obviously not going to be the case.

We need to build more of an international coalition to lessen the burden to our soldiers and citizens.  The fact remains that the U.S. is more interested in hoarding the spoils of war then building an international coalition.

My understanding is that being in school may no longer be sufficient to dodge the draft.  I am going to be 26, though, so I know I don't have to worry. 

With regard to compulsory service...it seems like a good idea on the face of it.  But, how would many of you feel having to fight in some of these b.s. wars...is that freedom?  If we were truly fighting to prevent global oppression or really prevent terrorism, then maybe it would seem like a good idea.  We must not forget, we are there for oil...the killing of hundreds of thousands of Iraqi citizens is not why we are there...if it was, we could stand to save a lot more folks being killed in Africa.

I don't think it's oil necessarily, and it's definitely not the citizens.  I honestly believe Bush was convinced this war was necessary for America's security.  That's the bottom line.  He was wrong, but he believed in it enough to send this country to war.  Kind of scary

tahoetahoe

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Re: Military Draft Coming back?
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2004, 01:45:45 PM »
I agree it wasn't just oil that sent us to Iraq, but it was one of the reasons.  Think about it...how many billion barrels of oil are over there...multipy that by how much each barrel is worth...do the math.  Of course, there are other idiotic reasons we are there.  It is scary.  Yeah, I feel a lot safer.
W Bush: I think if you know what you believe, it makes it a lot easier to
answer questions. I can't answer your question."
In response to a question about whether he wished he could take back any of his answers in the 
first debate. Reynoldsburg, Ohio, Oct. 4, 2000

Kerry 2004!!!!!!!!!

thechoson

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Re: Military Draft Coming back?
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2004, 01:46:55 PM »
Bush is an idiot.  Geez... let's just ignore Colin Powell.  a f-ing 5 star GENERAL.  If he doesnt' think war's a good idea, hmm... maybe he's onto something

jgruber

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Re: Military Draft Coming back?
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2004, 01:49:35 PM »
Is the world safer? 
I've been to Europe about seven times and would like to go again, but I'm not planning any vacations outside the country anytime soon.

Findedeux

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Re: Military Draft Coming back?
« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2004, 01:52:30 PM »
If a draft was approved I would definitely dodge it if I was fighting in a war like Iraq. If a war is waged for the self-intersts of a country, and is unneccessary and detrimental to all, I think it would be immoral to fight in it. While I think Iraq may have been waged more for interests of welfare than normal, it still tends to fall under the unneccesary and detrimental heading. How long do you think it is going to take before a country uses pre-emptive strike policy on the U.S.? Which is why I don't feel bad towards politicians that dodged the draft for Vietnam. I think very rarely does America exhaust all its options before going to war. Just look at the evidence that Bob Woodward presents towards Bush's deliberation before attacking Iraq.
While the middle east certainly has large problems with democracy, free rights, etc, it has frequently been the case that America has prevented these formations (at least to the extent that they exist in the Middle East) in order to take advantage of natural resources in the area. Iran is one example, in which we supported Raza Shah, because the existing leader wanted to take back the natural resources of Iran for its people (the British and Americans wanted that oil, as well as tobacco).
   While I obviously hate the fact that we are in Iraq, I think we have a responsibility to stabilize the nation before we leave. We created this mess, we have to clean it up. I think leaving pre-maturely would be very detrimental in terms of regional stability and terrorist activity.
   I don't believe Israel is a good example of democracy. When you have to expel 3 million people from their land to found your democracy and kill thousands of innocents I think democracy is the wrong word. That's not to say I'm against zionism or the Jewish people, but I think the way they've gone about creating a Jewish state is wrong. I don't believe religious claims that are 2000 years old (I'm a religion major so I know Jewish history) justify what occurred in Palestine in 1948. I also think that the Israeli army tends to react with excessive force towards Palestinians. This does not erase the fact that Palestinians do bomb Israelis everyday, but looking at the issue from a strategic point of view, this seems to be a result of the fact that Palestinians have no hope of beating the Israelis face to face. When you have two enemies, one strong and one weak, guerilla warfare is frequently used by the weaker enemy. I would argue you can interrpet the bombings as such, though I would also admit that they are religiously  motivated.

jgruber

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Re: Military Draft Coming back?
« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2004, 01:53:52 PM »
If you go without a draft, you fall into the 'forcing the poor to fight our wars' thing.


thechoson

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Re: Military Draft Coming back?
« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2004, 01:55:21 PM »
This is a scary thought for a mother of a 17 year old son (18 in a few months).  I would not like to see his college interrupted.  I also am a strong believer that both men and women should be drafted if it is put in place.  Doesn't Israel have a compulsory service for both men and women?  Does anybody know how that works?  Also, what about gays?  The military doesn't really want them now with that "don't ask don't tell" policy.  Will they be forced to deny their sexuality in order to meet their obligations.  Lots of thorny issues here.  Could simply be resolved by getting the hell out of Iraq and making the military service a viable altenative for our young people.  Perhaps they could raise pay and benefits to start with. That alone may bring in enough volunteer recruits.

Yes, honestly, this issue should concern younger men more than even me (though I will be 22 this year).  If they do implement a draft, it won't be for a while.  Israel does have compulsory service for men and women.  And yes, the gay issue would be difficult.  They might give exemptions to those who are gay, so then you might have guys that start faking it.  All these issues, not to mention the fact that the draft has such a black eye even now from Vietnam, is going to make it very unlikely.  Instituting a draft would also be murder on the administration, because everyone knows it is a last resort that will turned to in desperation.  If a draft does occur, it would probably be for young people in civil service duties, such as national security, making patrol at airports, securing public events, things of that sort.  Money is also a factor.  It take a LOAD of money to train each and every awesome American soldier these days (a lot of people seem to underestimate just how well American soldiers are trained and what effective soldiers they are).

jgruber

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Re: Military Draft Coming back?
« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2004, 01:56:02 PM »
With regard to compulsory service...it seems like a good idea on the face of it.  But, how would many of you feel having to fight in some of these b.s. wars...is that freedom?

Are you suggesting that the draft is never justified?  Or that we should can only be compelled to fight in wars we approve personally?

thechoson

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Re: Military Draft Coming back?
« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2004, 01:58:02 PM »
With regard to compulsory service...it seems like a good idea on the face of it.  But, how would many of you feel having to fight in some of these b.s. wars...is that freedom?

Are you suggesting that the draft is never justified?  Or that we should can only be compelled to fight in wars we approve personally?

WWII- justified
Iraq- bull

jgruber

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Re: Military Draft Coming back?
« Reply #19 on: April 21, 2004, 01:59:10 PM »
Normally we don't get to vote on wars.  Ah, but in November...
oh, never mind.  Even I don't believe that fairy tale.


With regard to compulsory service...it seems like a good idea on the face of it.  But, how would many of you feel having to fight in some of these b.s. wars...is that freedom?

Are you suggesting that the draft is never justified?  Or that we should can only be compelled to fight in wars we approve personally?

WWII- justified
Iraq- bull