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Author Topic: Schools that will be moving up in rankings  (Read 5398 times)

GO_PTO

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Re: Schools that will be moving up in rankings
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2004, 06:22:44 PM »
Cooley is def gonna be movin up. I hear that this other ranking systems puts them in the 20s!!!!
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Regal_Muse

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Re: Schools that will be moving up in rankings
« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2004, 06:33:58 PM »
I think USC is due for a major jump in the near future. Awhile ago, they were at 25 and now ranked 18. I do believe within the next few years USC might actually make top 14. They're getting amazing professors from all over the country. I know Boalt just lost one prof to USC this year I believe.

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Re: Schools that will be moving up in rankings
« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2004, 10:28:55 PM »
i'm hoping boalt moves up, esp if i go there :)  also thinking penn might move up, if the 72% increase in apps holds up somwhat.  dunno about the rest.
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nekko

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Re: Schools that will be moving up in rankings
« Reply #13 on: December 21, 2004, 01:28:28 AM »
I think it would be hard for USC to move up in the short term. I mean it's hard for reputations to improve (figure it takes years). Right now there's a pretty strong perception of UCLA still being the better school. But hey once upon time Stanford was viewed in a similar way to USC so things do change, take a long time though.

I'm not sure Boalt will move up and I'm not sure it has to move up. I mean it'd be nice but as long as it's rep. doesn't take a huge dive it's still the number 2 school in CA. So as long as you want to practice in CA, Boalt is still fantastic. Of course some people don't want to practice in CA but we wont discuss those misguided individuals.

Penn I think has difficulty, they really seem to underperform in things like Supreme Court clerkships which has a huge effect on prestige. Also there don't seem to be a lot of academics that come out of U Penn. I think as long as U Penn primarily cranks out lawyers as opposed to academics, clerks I think they'll have trouble moving up from their already high ranking. But one never knows.

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Re: Schools that will be moving up in rankings
« Reply #14 on: December 21, 2004, 01:56:33 AM »
selectivity counts as 25% of the score though, which is why i guessed that penn would go up.  with their huge increase in EA apps, i assume their acceptance rate will be lower and their ultimate scores will be higher.  even if their quality score stays the same, if all else remains constant, penn could at least hit top 6.  they're only one point away from chicago as is.  from there, there's a 5 point gap before hitting top 5, so i guess moving from #7 to #6 isn't that big a jump :)

boalt too is in a tight spot points-wise, where a couple points could mean a nice little hop up in ranking.  they fell quite a bit this year (from #8, i believe, to #13), so i'd like to see that go the other way now.
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St. Shaun

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Re: Schools that will be moving up in rankings
« Reply #15 on: December 21, 2004, 02:35:04 AM »
selectivity counts as 25% of the score though, which is why i guessed that penn would go up.  with their huge increase in EA apps, i assume their acceptance rate will be lower and their ultimate scores will be higher.  even if their quality score stays the same,...

Your assuming that other schools will remain the same.  I heard that Michigan also had a record number of ED apps, and that NYU is accepting close to half the students it did last year.  With michigan tied with UPENN and NYU ahead, I wouldn't expect much of a jump.  Also I wouldn't count on ED apps effecting overall stats too much since it only makes up a small percentage of the total apps, they only allow a certain percentage of their class to be filled by them, and that most applicants (historically, which may be different this year from the looks of it) haven't even submitted their apps yet.

My guess is that the amount of early applicants will effect the overall number more than the yield since they will be able to fill the early app spots with higher numbers because of the increased number of applicants.
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nekko

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Re: Schools that will be moving up in rankings
« Reply #16 on: December 21, 2004, 02:36:02 AM »
I don't think selectivity counts for 25% of the score (in terms of USNWR rankings). I believe it only counts for 2.5% (at least according to Leiter).

In terms of Boalt I've seen them around 13 (I've sort of followed Boalt rankings since I'm from the Bay Area) before I think and while I'm sure some people were upset about it I think the next year they bounced up around 9 or something but it's not like the school was any different. Boalt got hit pretty hard this time around but I think a lot of that had to do with changes in budget and stuff like that which were sort of outside of the school's control and which didn't really have an impact on the school in an academic sense.

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Re: Schools that will be moving up in rankings
« Reply #17 on: December 21, 2004, 02:49:59 AM »
selectivity counts as 25% of the score though, which is why i guessed that penn would go up.  with their huge increase in EA apps, i assume their acceptance rate will be lower and their ultimate scores will be higher.  even if their quality score stays the same,...

Your assuming that other schools will remain the same.  I heard that Michigan also had a record number of ED apps, and that NYU is accepting close to half the students it did last year.  With michigan tied with UPENN and NYU ahead, I wouldn't expect much of a jump.  Also I wouldn't count on ED apps effecting overall stats too much since it only makes up a small percentage of the total apps, they only allow a certain percentage of their class to be filled by them, and that most applicants (historically, which may be different this year from the looks of it) haven't even submitted their apps yet.

My guess is that the amount of early applicants will effect the overall number more than the yield since they will be able to fill the early app spots with higher numbers because of the increased number of applicants.

right, i stated my assumption of all else remaining constant.  where are you getting that NYU is accepting close to half?  are you saying their matriculation rate is really high (i.e., double what it was last year), or that they're cutting their class size?  i e-mailed them and asked about class size, and they said it's the same as last year's.  they cut their class size when construction was going on because they didn't have room for the same number of students, but now that construction is complete, they went back to the class size they had before.

which yield are you talking about?  matriculation rate (% of accepted that actually attend)?  that's not part of rankings.  acceptance rate?  i don't think that's consistent with what you're saying.

i think that people are applying earlier this year, and that factors in as part of that 72%.  people understand the importance of applying early better than people did in previous years, perhaps.  i think there's something else behind the 72%, perhaps fee waivers, perhaps something else. 

I don't think selectivity counts for 25% of the score (in terms of USNWR rankings). I believe it only counts for 2.5% (at least according to Leiter).

In terms of Boalt I've seen them around 13 (I've sort of followed Boalt rankings since I'm from the Bay Area) before I think and while I'm sure some people were upset about it I think the next year they bounced up around 9 or something but it's not like the school was any different. Boalt got hit pretty hard this time around but I think a lot of that had to do with changes in budget and stuff like that which were sort of outside of the school's control and which didn't really have an impact on the school in an academic sense.

nope, selectivity is 25%.  quality assessment, 40%.  placement success, 20%.  faculty resources, 15%.  page 23 of USNWR 2005 edition rankings.  which came out in 2004.

so last year boalt was ~#8, but the year before it was right around #13?  you could well be right.  i only started paying close attention last year.
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nekko

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Re: Schools that will be moving up in rankings
« Reply #18 on: December 21, 2004, 07:27:17 PM »
Quote
nope, selectivity is 25%. 
Sorry for some reason I was confusing yield with selectivity.

Quote
so last year boalt was ~#8, but the year before it was right around #13?
No, sorry for being confusing. Let me actually look it up...hmmm well a poster on xoxo put up these historical numbers which sound right:
1987 Berkeley 7

1990 Berkeley 13

1991 Berkeley 12

1992 Berkeley 12

1993 Berkeley 12

1994 Berkeley 10

1995 Berkeley 8

1996 Berkeley 12

1997 Berkeley 9

1998 Berkeley 7

1999 Berkeley 10

2000 Berkeley 8

2001 Berkeley 9

2002 Berkeley 7

2003 Berkeley 10

Average: 9.73

and of course 2004 13

Basically I'm just saying there isn't a clear reason to be too concerned with Boalt's rankings since it shifts all the time and the reputation rankings are still quite high. A bit of historical perspective seems to indicate that last years dip wasn't something so out of the ordinary to mean the end of Boalt as most Californians know it.


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Re: Schools that will be moving up in rankings
« Reply #19 on: December 21, 2004, 10:05:25 PM »
where are you getting that NYU is accepting close to half?  are you saying their matriculation rate is really high (i.e., double what it was last year), or that they're cutting their class size?  i e-mailed them and asked about class size, and they said it's the same as last year's.  they cut their class size when construction was going on because they didn't have room for the same number of students, but now that construction is complete, they went back to the class size they had before.

I thought the construction was this year (and thus the smaller class size).  USNEWS REPORT changes their methodology from time to time, but I think it's been over a decade since the last change.  Either way a change of methodology would effect the rankings somewhat.
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