Law School Discussion

Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT


Re: Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT
« Reply #20 on: October 30, 2004, 11:50:41 PM »
A few points, for all of you (I can't discuss my background here, but please trust me):

1. Undergraduate grades are heavily deemphasized for transfer applications to most schools. There are two reasons for this: First, law school grades (assuming good law school) are a better indicator of law school performance than are undergraduate grades. Second, the USNWR doesn't count grades from transfers for rankings purposes, so the school can accept you (if it wants to) without having to worry about a rankings drop.

2. A few particular schools (Harvard is one, but there are a few others) do count undergraduate grades for transfers with the same weight they would have been given for first-year students. So below a 3.7 or so, don't waste your time with these schools. (The admissions office will normally tell you their policy if you ask.)

3. Part-time programs are easier to get into than full-time programs, in almost every case. That, plus your background, should help you, Eileen.

4. A PhD helps, but less than you would expect. Once again, blame the USNWR. Schools simply can't take many chances with first-year GPA's, or their rankings will tank. It's too bad people are so obsessed with rankings, but it nevertheless is the case. Publications do help, however, as they indicate potential for legal publication.

5. To transfer up a "tier" (the quotes are there to indicate my distaste for USNWR's rankings), you would normally need to finish in the top 10% of your class, although this is not a firm rule. Some schools *love* transfers; others don't. Find out how many transfer students a school takes each year, and target the ones that take more than twenty.

Re: Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT
« Reply #21 on: November 10, 2004, 08:28:50 AM »
For those with a below 3.0 gpa and a good lsat score (158+) may want to at least apply to Touro.. I know the reputation it has, as I grew up on Long Island, but am also the cousin of a multi-millionare attorney who went there and barely graduated (private practice).  My point being that on Long Island, although it wont give you the same interviews as St Johns and Hofstra straight out of school, it is considered a decent school simply because of its location.  Furthermore, and maybe more importantly for those that do not plan on staying in the NYC tri-state area, they are building a new campus this year that is sick and incorporates three different courts.  The law school will actually be built and work in conjunction with the courts; Touro will be the only law school to offer this kind of accessibility.  I am sure that in the near future Touro will see some increased attention simply due to this fact.

I would highly suggest that you check them out and apply... also, although it is a bit harder to get in to, Hofstra waives the application fee if you get it in by mid-Decemember (dont quote me on the date).  All I know is it is a free application right now so fill that female dog out!

Re: Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT
« Reply #22 on: February 10, 2005, 07:00:55 PM »
Just to let people with similiar situations know how it turned out for me: I retook the LSAT, made a 165 the second time. I have been accepted to two third tier schools, McGeorge and Akon, and was rejected by a second tier school, Oklahoma University. I'm still waiting on some other schools. The third tier schools I've been accepted to say I'm being considered for scholarships, although no specifics yet.


Re: Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT
« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2005, 05:51:11 AM »

Glad to hear things are working out okay for you.  Good luck with your remaining applications!

Re: Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT
« Reply #24 on: February 11, 2005, 10:50:40 AM »
Just seeing if anyone has been (or is) in my boat and can share how the application process turned out for them.  I am a URM with a 2.7 GPA and a 174 LSAT.  I applied pretty late so I haven't heard anything yet.  I'm pretty anxious and can't find anything to compare to, so any insight would be welcome.

Re: Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT
« Reply #25 on: February 11, 2005, 11:03:05 AM »
I have a worse GPA and a worse LSAT and I have gotten into two tier 2 schools.  I had a very good upward trend in grades but other than that I don't see why you couldn't get into a few tier two schools now (except for it being so late in the app cycle, if you applied early next year I would say your chances are great).  Just target schools that put more empahsis on LSAT (like Miami and Denver) as that can make a huge difference.

Re: Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT
« Reply #26 on: February 14, 2005, 03:53:43 PM »
Much like the previous poster said, you can get into tier 2 schools as well. One of the common misconceptions that this message board propagates is that 160s aren't very good - and that's complete bull. A 164 is in the 90th percentile of LSAT scores - do you realize what that means?

Unless you're aiming for Yale, Harvard, or one of those schools, you don't need a 168+ to look good. Sure, your GPA isn't high, but with good writing skills (to make for a decent personal statement) concise applications, a decent resume, and some luck - you can get into some damned good schools.

I wish you the best!

Re: Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT
« Reply #27 on: February 15, 2005, 02:45:12 PM »
I have a 2.14 GPA and a 170 LSAT.  So far I've gotten in at Illinois (With money), WUSTL, Ind-Bloomington, Washburn, and AZ State.  I have a bit of work experience, but it seems kind of a crapshoot, as I got waitlisted at Wisconsin, and Denied at Kansas.  Still, I'd rather get denied at KU and accepted at WUSTL than the other way around.

Re: Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT
« Reply #28 on: March 16, 2005, 11:14:49 AM »
For GPAs below a 3.0, I would not go straight from UG.  Unless you have shown a definite upward trend, you might be selling yourself short for the schools that will accept you, but more importantly, being convinced that this time around you will buckle down my just be a dream.

I had a low undergrad GPA, but went to the working world.  I had high test scores, and knew I would do well on the LSATs, but this indicated that the thing bringing my UG grades down was my discipline and work ethic.  I don't think those things magically change overnight.  A few years in the work world gave me time to grow the hell up and let school sound alluring again - and judging by the way I hit the books for the LSATs, I am not the same kid that slept through 8:30 chem.  Not only that, but time made my GPA seem less relevant, and my LSATs seem more indicative of my abilities. 

That being said, I still am left wildly guessing about why i got in where I did.

For caffeine and nicotine - if you have a chance at any T-14, I would think it would be NW.  They seem to be the ones that prize people w/ work experience, or more accurately disdain people coming straight from UG.  I heard they were bragging last year about not accepting a single applicant straight from college without an interview.  If you've been in the working world, your interview skills are probably a lot sharper than a 21 year old student's, as well.

Re: Bad G.P.A./ Okay LSAT
« Reply #29 on: March 23, 2005, 08:48:43 AM »
A friend of mine has similar stats: gpa around 3.00, lsat above 160. He has been admitted to St. Louis Univ, Rutgers-Camden, Univ San Diego, Syracuse Univ, and St. Johns. And still is waiting for the majority of his decisions!

I think he is doing great. And he was praised on his personal statement.

With those stats, Tier 2 is definitely a possibility. If we are just going based on ranking, lower/mid Tier 2 schools are good shots, and the upper Tier 2/lower Tier 1 schools are reaches.