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Author Topic: University of Cincinnati?  (Read 8493 times)

iceepop

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University of Cincinnati?
« on: April 14, 2008, 12:52:18 PM »
People don't really talk about Cincy on these boards.  I was wondering if anyone knows much/anything about the school.  I've read that it was T1 until 2002, and is now at 52 in the US News rankings.  Is the school likely to keep going down, or move back up?

I want to work in central Ohio, so OSU is probably the obvious choice, as the two schools are almost equal in terms of admission.  But would a UC degree travel back to Columbus and/or the surrounding area?

iceepop

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Re: University of Cincinnati?
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2008, 12:54:15 PM »
Just some background info on why I'm interested:

Because of my family situation, I am basically confined to Ohio schools (or possibly Kentucky schools), and I am taking the LSAT this June.  I hope that I will do well enough to get into all the Ohio schools to which I apply, but I could see a potential situation in which I get into Cincinnati but not OSU.  Also, even if I get into both I could see Cincinnati ending up being a lot cheaper, as OSU is stingy with scholarships.

Oh, and maybe I should have asked this to begin with, but would Cincinnati have an edge over Case Western in central Ohio?

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Re: University of Cincinnati?
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2008, 01:24:20 PM »
Could not tell you if Cincinnati would have an edge over CWRU in central OH, but I doubt it. I think most people consider Cincy = Case in terms of rep, but obviously Case is for Cleveland market and UC is for Cincinnati market. This is what I've gathered from talking to UC/Case students and talking to a few associates in Cleveland and Cincinnati.

Of course, UC is much, much cheaper. UC has a small class size (like ~130 I think) but is also in a smaller legal market, so that might be a wash.

I have no idea how UC or Case place in Central OH; you might try a search for UC alumni at big Columbus firms or something.

iceepop

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Re: University of Cincinnati?
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2008, 01:38:15 PM »
Thanks for the response.

Actually, though, I'm not solely thinking of working BigLaw in Columbus.  I would be fine working in a smaller market in the suburbs and making around $50,000-$60,000 to start.  I am from a small town and would be fine working in one.  On the other hand, if the right opportunity were to present itself, I wouldn't rule out going into BigLaw for a little while.

Having said that, does anyone have any insight as to how well the Cincinnati or Case degrees would travel for a small- to mid-size firm job in central Ohio?  I'm just worried about not having summer jobs in the exact area where I eventually want to work.

zdub378

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Re: University of Cincinnati?
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2008, 11:23:52 AM »
I went to Cincinnati's ASD last week.  I was pretty impressed by it, and my impression from talking to folks here in Columbus is that it's got a good reputation here.  The career services people talked a lot about the market, and it sounds like they place well in Ohio.  We have both UC and Case people in the firm I work at-their advice is go to the cheapest school you can find in the area you want to practice and work your ass off.  Unless you go to a T14 school or are related to the managing partner, you're gonna have to be ranked high to compete anyways, so save your money.

It seems like UC is much more geared towards corporate law than Case, from what I've seen at both of them-CWRU does a lot more international law stuff, UC does a lot more corporate/business type things. Of course, UC also has the Urban Morgan Center and the Innocence Project, and CWRU does have a fairly good BigLaw placement, so that's not a hard and fast rule.


iceepop

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Re: University of Cincinnati?
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2008, 12:53:42 PM »
I went to Cincinnati's ASD last week.  I was pretty impressed by it, and my impression from talking to folks here in Columbus is that it's got a good reputation here.  The career services people talked a lot about the market, and it sounds like they place well in Ohio.  We have both UC and Case people in the firm I work at-their advice is go to the cheapest school you can find in the area you want to practice and work your ass off.  Unless you go to a T14 school or are related to the managing partner, you're gonna have to be ranked high to compete anyways, so save your money.

It seems like UC is much more geared towards corporate law than Case, from what I've seen at both of them-CWRU does a lot more international law stuff, UC does a lot more corporate/business type things. Of course, UC also has the Urban Morgan Center and the Innocence Project, and CWRU does have a fairly good BigLaw placement, so that's not a hard and fast rule.



When you say that it sounds like Cincy places well in Ohio, though, do you think that that means throughout Ohio, or just in the Southwestern part of the state, etc.?

Also, do you mind telling me your numbers and the scholarship amounts at the Ohio schools to which you've applied?

zdub378

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Re: University of Cincinnati?
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2008, 02:12:31 PM »
Placements seems to be pretty good from southern to central Ohio.  Not sure about north of here-it gets a lot more crowded with Case, CSU, Ohio Northern, Akron, and Toledo.  I'm in Columbus, and I don't think I'd have any trouble finding a job around here. 

chammon2

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Re: University of Cincinnati?
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2008, 11:58:30 PM »
I talked to a part-time professor at Toledo (he was an OSU grad)and asked him what lawyers thought about grads from the three Ohio schools.  He told me that most employers (including those at his firm in Toledo) consider OSU=Case and Cincy to be just below them.  Granted, it's just one guy but he said when he was going to law school in the mid-90's the people who got scholarships to Case went there and if you couldn't get a scholarship to Case you would go to OSU.  I think a lot has changed since then.  I know two 2L's at Case who are both top-25% who have landed Big Law in Columbus.  Martindale lists around 1,500 Case lawyers in Cleveland so obviously a ton will stay.  There are just under 150 in Columbus vs. almost 1,700 from OSU.  I would have to imagine that you'd have a better Columbus Big Law shot from the OSU alumni in Columbus.  But if you just want to be in Columbus and don't care about Big Law and have the potential to get into OSU, then Capital might be a nice option.  You could get great money and would almost be guaranteed a 50-60k job in the suburbs.  Martindale has 1,339 lawyers from Capital in Columbus.

But as OSU is getting more difficult to get into, you could see more Case lawyers try to get into the Columbus market in the future.  In the past, Case lawyers may have gone with Case because they preferred Cleveland.  But now, OSU and Case aren't that similar in terms of acceptances.  Some people may have to settle on Case because OSU is not an option.  And Case and Cincy will become rivals as I'm sure they clearly share the Tier 2 spot for Ohio law schools in the future.  Cincy has almost the same number of lawyers in Columbus as Case on Martindale.

I continue to wonder if this will catch up to the legal market in Ohio.  It won't be too long until people realize that OSU is accepting a "higher level" (don't know how else to phrase that) applicant than Case.

The nice thing about Case is how much money they throw out.  I'm a 159/3.76 and was rejected by OSU, but offered $13,000 a year at Case while only having to maintain a 2.33.  I don't know too much about Cincinnati, but since they are public I'm sure you could go there for a lower cost than Case.  I doubt there are any serious advantages in Columbus from Case or Cincy, but if you want to be in Columbus, I'm sure that most people would agree that OSU is your best bet.  But if you have a great financial offer from either of the other two, I don't think it would hurt your chances at Columbus employment.  But I don't see why you would rule out Capital if you're only shooting for Columbus.

iceepop

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Re: University of Cincinnati?
« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2008, 11:52:20 AM »
I talked to a part-time professor at Toledo (he was an OSU grad)and asked him what lawyers thought about grads from the three Ohio schools.  He told me that most employers (including those at his firm in Toledo) consider OSU=Case and Cincy to be just below them.  Granted, it's just one guy but he said when he was going to law school in the mid-90's the people who got scholarships to Case went there and if you couldn't get a scholarship to Case you would go to OSU.  I think a lot has changed since then.  I know two 2L's at Case who are both top-25% who have landed Big Law in Columbus.  Martindale lists around 1,500 Case lawyers in Cleveland so obviously a ton will stay.  There are just under 150 in Columbus vs. almost 1,700 from OSU.  I would have to imagine that you'd have a better Columbus Big Law shot from the OSU alumni in Columbus.  But if you just want to be in Columbus and don't care about Big Law and have the potential to get into OSU, then Capital might be a nice option.  You could get great money and would almost be guaranteed a 50-60k job in the suburbs.  Martindale has 1,339 lawyers from Capital in Columbus.

But as OSU is getting more difficult to get into, you could see more Case lawyers try to get into the Columbus market in the future.  In the past, Case lawyers may have gone with Case because they preferred Cleveland.  But now, OSU and Case aren't that similar in terms of acceptances.  Some people may have to settle on Case because OSU is not an option.  And Case and Cincy will become rivals as I'm sure they clearly share the Tier 2 spot for Ohio law schools in the future.  Cincy has almost the same number of lawyers in Columbus as Case on Martindale.

I continue to wonder if this will catch up to the legal market in Ohio.  It won't be too long until people realize that OSU is accepting a "higher level" (don't know how else to phrase that) applicant than Case.

The nice thing about Case is how much money they throw out.  I'm a 159/3.76 and was rejected by OSU, but offered $13,000 a year at Case while only having to maintain a 2.33.  I don't know too much about Cincinnati, but since they are public I'm sure you could go there for a lower cost than Case.  I doubt there are any serious advantages in Columbus from Case or Cincy, but if you want to be in Columbus, I'm sure that most people would agree that OSU is your best bet.  But if you have a great financial offer from either of the other two, I don't think it would hurt your chances at Columbus employment.  But I don't see why you would rule out Capital if you're only shooting for Columbus.

Thanks a lot for the post!  Your stats are similar to what I project mine to be.  In fact, I presently have the exact same GPA (3.76) and my practice LSAT average has been around 160.  My most recent ones have been in the mid-160's, but I'm expecting my actual score to be 158-162. 

I guess I really just wasn't considering Capital because I have heard bad things about it.  For example, someone in one of my classes last year (who was headed to Moritz) said that she was going to OSU despite little scholarship money because she had talked to lawyers from the area who had said that their firms would not even consider hiring Capital grads.

I guess that I should take the school into consideration because it might be able to provide me with the type of job that I'm looking for but with less financial burden than other schools (depending on the financial package). 

Interesting...

iceepop

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Re: University of Cincinnati?
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2008, 11:20:42 AM »
Anyone else have any input on these schools?