Visiting Case

[ahsidib]

What is CaseArc all about? Does it add a lot of work on top of the regular class load?

[jhertzo]

CaseArc is just your basic legal writing class.  During 1L you have to take core 1 first semester & core 2 your second semester.  During core 1 you write 2 memos and learn how to research, the class will be tied to another regular class (ours was with torts but its different every year).  In core 2 you write a motion to dismiss & a motion for summary judgment and its also tied to a regular class (property for us).  Each semester is only 2 credits and the class isn't that much work except for right before rough/final drafts of the papers are due, then it is a lot of work which is frustrating because it is only worth two credits.  But I think most schools make their students take legal writing & it is obviously an important skill so I guess it's not too much added work.  This year for CaseArc we have to take Core 3 which I think deals with learning how to write contracts, & FPS.  I think the note that everyone has to write is also included in CaseArc, but I'm pretty sure most schools make you do this too. 

[thecrashlawyer]

I'll be attending Case this fall and am curious as to your summer employment post-1L.  Was it difficult getting a job?  Paid or unpaid?  Cleveland or elsewhere? 

[jhertzo]

I do think it is more difficult to find a job after 1L than I expect it to be after 2L, but overall it wasn't too hard for me.  I only applied for positions in Cleveland because I plan on staying here after graduation (I'm from here, family is here..).  So it may be harder (if you want to go to a big city Case isn't that national) or easier (there are just more options and more places to apply) if you plan on relocating.  It was harder than I expected because I applied to several bigger firms from NALP and didn't get any offers even though my grades put me in top 10%.  However, there is OCI in the fall (with smaller firm jobs, government jobs) where a lot of friends found jobs.  There are also judicial externships (which a lot of my friends did, and I got offered) which you can get credit for (although it is unpaid) if you have the grades.  I decided to take a job as a law clerk for an insurance company because I plan on doing corporate law, the position is paid. I also got offered a position at a mid-sized firm and at another companies legal department.  Overall, I think there are definitely opportunities out there, just not positions at huge firms unless you are a URM, very top of the class, or have really good connections.  We are in the process of doing OCI which starts right before 2L now and there are a lot of big firms (all of the biggest in Cleveland) that come, so I'm hoping to get a summer associate position with one of them for next summer, we'll see!

[ahsidib]

Thanks for all your help jhertzo and congrats on doing so well in 1L. Do you know what the curve is at Case? What would you say your hardest 1L class was?

[kipford]

Thanks for all your help jhertzo and congrats on doing so well in 1L. Do you know what the curve is at Case? What would you say your hardest 1L class was?

I'll jump in on this.  I'm also a soon to be 2L at Case.

First, nice job Jessica!  Are you accepting Law Review?

My experience with finding a 1L job was a little different.  I decided early on to do the externship program, so I only did a half hearted search for summer employment until I was accepted to the externship program.  If you are looking for well paid 1L jobs I would suggest applying early (like in November probably).  Don't wait until for the OCI spots.  I did get a few interviews/calls but got the externship spot which I took, but I was surprised at how little interest there was in me 

That said, if you have connections or are able to do patent work, the going is much easier.  Several of the adjunct faculty members (who you will have for simulations as part of the CaseARC program) work in firms that hire, so if you do well there you will have a leg up.  I heard that there were a lot of people who didn't find work, but everyone I actually talked to had a good job.  Not necessarily well paid, but good on the resume.

The curve at case for 1L is a 3.0.  I believe our median GPA was just above that (like 3.03).  Top 10% was a 3.6 and I believe top 20% was about a 3.4.  They are changing how the curve is calculated a bit starting next year, but it will still be a 3.0 curve.  I think that the curve moves up a bit for 2L and 3L classes and if they are small enough there is no curve at all (well, no enforced curve).

As far as hardest class-I think it all depends on the student and how you learn.  I didn't find any of the concepts to be all that difficult, its just a matter of taking the time to do the work and make sure you understand the material.  That said, I probably found Legal Writing the hardest.  My professor was stellar (if you have Professor Cupar you are in for a treat), but I'm not a naturally gifted writer (competent, but not naturally proficient).

Hope that helps!

[ahsidib]

Thanks guys, it really nice to have someone around to answer our questions --which now i find myself having a lot of.

this whole commerical outline debate...did you guys find them useful for your classes?

[kipford]

Thanks guys, it really nice to have someone around to answer our questions --which now i find myself having a lot of.

this whole commerical outline debate...did you guys find them useful for your classes?

I think, like a lot of things in law school, it's what works for you.

Personally, I hardly used any supplements at all.  I think they are kind of a moral hazard.  Its always a slog to read through the cases and brief them.  It is, in my opinion, WELL worth the effort.  If I had commercial briefs or outlines I may have been tempted to just read through them instead.  Reading the cases, and working through them, is the best way to really understand the principles (its not just about the black letter law, but getting the nuances of how it is applied).

That said, late in the semester I would buy a book of commercial briefs for the text we used (if available) and the Emmanual's Crunch Time books.  These were just to help me outline.  The briefs were basically a way to check that I got the rule/black letter law right from each case.  The crunch time books were there just to help me through any topics that I didn't quite grasp fully enough.

A lot of professors will say that the commercial outlines are a waste of money because they don't really corespond to how they teach.  I don't really buy that-they will help if used as a supplement, and not the primary resource.  I would also recommend going to the AEP sessions-tutors hired by the school.  They will likely share student outlines from past years.

In the end its about doing the work itself.  Yes, a good outline is critical (for an open book exam) but the most important thing is making it yourself...

That said, there could be others who never opened the case book and did well, but that wouldn't have worked for me.

Hope that helps!

[thecrashlawyer]

Thanks for all the info guys.  Hopefully we'll meet IRL at Case.

[ahsidib]

Another question:

I noticed that case does not have a laptop requirement, is it okay to use a MAC? Do people usually take a laptop to class?