Is Drexel hard to get into?

[amk320]

Ok, so you might have a chance at Drexel with your numbers and potential personal statement.  HOWEVER, lets be practical.  It is almost March, deadlines are right around the corner or already passed, admissions offices are tired of reading personal statements and lots of scholarship money will be gone by the time your file is complete.  Oh, and the letters of recommendation, which you need to get the recommender to prepare, mail to LSAC so they copy and send to your school.  So, as it is, you are better off sitting out and sending your applications during the first month of the next cycle.  While you prepare for the next cycle, you might as well study hard and make the LSAT your female dog by the time you retake in the summer or fall.  A couple of extra points in the LSAT together with a well prepared application could land you money in Temple, which is regarded better than Drexel for what I gather.  Just so you know, I got a 156 in the LSAT, a lower GPA than yours, but took time to prepare my application and statements and by January I got full tuition at Temple.  About the debt as an undergrad, loans don't come knocking for about 6 months, so you can put some money together, make a payment arrangement for the other 6 months, then go back in forbearance, deferment or whatever it is called.  In sum, retake the LSAT, take time to prepare your applications and apply this fall. 

That's pretty cool.  I was under the impression Temple wanted mid-160s and 3.5+ GPAs to offer that kind of money.  Drexel's deadline is May 1st, which is one of the latest I've seen.  So like I said, I'm not so sure I'd be SOL for Drexel considering their application process continues through March and April.  My letters of recommendation are in, and my personal statement will be finished this weekend.  I plan on having my applications out before March 1st.  As for working after college, I've been planning on doing law school for the better part of thirteen years, and I've never really had a back-up plan.  I have absolutely no idea what I would do, what I'd enjoy doing, or what I'm even qualified to do, but I bet I wouldn't enjoy it since I know it's not what I want to do with my life.

I still don't see why I can't bust my ass and try to transfer to a school like Temple.  That's not unheard of.

[nealric]

Plus, the question of whether or not Drexel would accept someone like me hasn't been addressed.  Like I said, the info on lawschoolnumbers is kinda misleading.

Don't just use the graph, check the individual profiles. 9/10 times it is immediatly clear why someone was accepted/rejected outside of the normal number range.

With your background, it is safe to say that you have a good chance of doing better than your numbers might otherwise indicate.

I heard somewhere that because they're not accredited, you can't count the credits if you were to transfer to an accredited school.  Is that accurate?  Also, I'm not sure how that would work now that they have provisional accredation. I've also heard that it's harder to get into Drexel because they're keeping the class size small at around 120 or so?  And they're throwing money at people to go there, apparently.  Not that someone with my stats is the sort of applicant to have money thrown at, but I think it's too early in the game to make the claim I'll have 200k in debt.  It's possible I could transfer to Temple and pay 16k a year tuition, or get some sort of scholarship at Drexel were I to do well enough initially.

The credit transfer would depend on the school accepting the credits. I would't count on being able to transfer.

I have never heard of anyone getting scholarship money just for doing well. Maybe you could work out some kind of deal in exchange for not transferring were you to be at the very top of the class, but its very very unlikely. As for transferring, the odds are against you. To make a siginficant jump in school quality, you would likely need to be top 20% of your class. There is an 80% chance it won't happen.

As for not wanting to make "only" 30k with just your UG. Just how much do you expect to make with a degree from Drexel? Since it's not ABA fully accredited, it's hard to get specific salary information about the school, but at the lower ranked ABA approved schools, it is not at all uncommon for grads to start at 30-40k for their first job (if they are lucky enough to get one practicing law at all.

The system is not fair, and its not an accurate reflection on the candates caught up in it, but those who chose to ignore how it works risk some very tough times. Good luck with what ever you chose to do. 

[amk320]

Plus, the question of whether or not Drexel would accept someone like me hasn't been addressed.  Like I said, the info on lawschoolnumbers is kinda misleading.

Don't just use the graph, check the individual profiles. 9/10 times it is immediatly clear why someone was accepted/rejected outside of the normal number range.

With your background, it is safe to say that you have a good chance of doing better than your numbers might otherwise indicate.

I heard somewhere that because they're not accredited, you can't count the credits if you were to transfer to an accredited school.  Is that accurate?  Also, I'm not sure how that would work now that they have provisional accredation. I've also heard that it's harder to get into Drexel because they're keeping the class size small at around 120 or so?  And they're throwing money at people to go there, apparently.  Not that someone with my stats is the sort of applicant to have money thrown at, but I think it's too early in the game to make the claim I'll have 200k in debt.  It's possible I could transfer to Temple and pay 16k a year tuition, or get some sort of scholarship at Drexel were I to do well enough initially.

The credit transfer would depend on the school accepting the credits. I would't count on being able to transfer.

I have never heard of anyone getting scholarship money just for doing well. Maybe you could work out some kind of deal in exchange for not transferring were you to be at the very top of the class, but its very very unlikely. As for transferring, the odds are against you. To make a siginficant jump in school quality, you would likely need to be top 20% of your class. There is an 80% chance it won't happen.

As for not wanting to make "only" 30k with just your UG. Just how much do you expect to make with a degree from Drexel? Since it's not ABA fully accredited, it's hard to get specific salary information about the school, but at the lower ranked ABA approved schools, it is not at all uncommon for grads to start at 30-40k for their first job (if they are lucky enough to get one practicing law at all.

The system is not fair, and its not an accurate reflection on the candates caught up in it, but those who chose to ignore how it works risk some very tough times. Good luck with what ever you chose to do. 

The point I was driving home is that I'd prefer to make 30k a year doing something I want to do than 30k a year doing something I don't want to do.  I only get to be alive once, it doesn't seem worthwhile to spend time doing things I don't want to do.  Already had to spend five years in undergrad learning about obscure political theories and ancient history so I can go to law school..

And is it that unbelivable to pull the top 20% of the class?  I'm sure it's difficult, but the chance is still there.  Even if the odds are stacked against me.  I mean, they've more or less been stacked against me my entire life, it wouldn't be that big of an adjustment for me.

[SabrinaK]

Apparently nealric's never seen Rudy. 

We've determined there's no app fee, so just apply.  What's the worst that will happen?  They'll say no?  So then you wait until next cycle and retake the LSAT in the meantime.  If you want it enough you can make it work.  I have faith in you, paduan.

[amk320]

Well, I think if Drexel shoots me down, I'm going to follow another close friend of mine who plans on going to Roger Williams.  He pulled a 160 on his LSAT, but his GPA's only 2.98.  Still, they offered him like, 75% tuition or something.  So it's either that, or take the plunge at Widener and try to get out of there by my second year.  Or, do something meaningless for a year and live in a box while I pay off my $1,000 a month student loan bills with my $2000 a month take home pay.

[SouVitor]

That's pretty cool.  I was under the impression Temple wanted mid-160s and 3.5+ GPAs to offer that kind of money.  Drexel's deadline is May 1st, which is one of the latest I've seen.  So like I said, I'm not so sure I'd be SOL for Drexel considering their application process continues through March and April.  My letters of recommendation are in, and my personal statement will be finished this weekend.  I plan on having my applications out before March 1st.  As for working after college, I've been planning on doing law school for the better part of thirteen years, and I've never really had a back-up plan.  I have absolutely no idea what I would do, what I'd enjoy doing, or what I'm even qualified to do, but I bet I wouldn't enjoy it since I know it's not what I want to do with my life.

I still don't see why I can't bust my ass and try to transfer to a school like Temple.  That's not unheard of.

You have no idea what you are qualified to do, what you would enjoy doing?  Even more reason to take a year off to explore what is out there while preparing for the LSAT.  You could take a legal or nonlegal job and see firsthand what you can or cannot do.  Who knows, maybe you would enjoy something else or discover that there is a niche in the law that you feel passionate about and would enter law school with a better idea of where your legal career will take you.  I took 4 years off.  The first year, I thought it was gonna be just one year and then head to a PhD History program but I liked the legal job I took that decided to change career paths.  After that I worked more because, honestly, I got lazy about the LSAT.  But the point is that the one year, apart of being able to help you prepare your applications and improve your LSAT enormously, can help you professionally. 

And law school is an investment in every sense of the word.  Invest more time in the test.  I'm sure if you do that and improve, your chances at getting at a better regional school will improve, as well as the likelihood of scholarship money that could reduce your final debt load.  You could always try to transfer, but that is never guaranteed to occur.  If you want to transfer to a school, you might as well fight as hard as possible to get into that school. 

[nealric]

Well, I think if Drexel shoots me down, I'm going to follow another close friend of mine who plans on going to Roger Williams.  He pulled a 160 on his LSAT, but his GPA's only 2.98.  Still, they offered him like, 75% tuition or something.  So it's either that, or take the plunge at Widener and try to get out of there by my second year.  Or, do something meaningless for a year and live in a box while I pay off my $1,000 a month student loan bills with my $2000 a month take home p

Why not work as a legal assistant for a small firm or solo practitioner? (I have been there)

Working for a solo, I was given the opporunity to do almost everything a lawyer does short of argue in court (I even got to go to court, just not argue). That way your year off would not be meaningless.   

[woeisme]

RETAKE THE LSAT

You can't afford NOT to retake it- even with the year off. Talk with your lenders, something should beable to be worked out.

The only schools that will enable you to reasonably pay off that kind of debt are the kind that require a 160+ LSAT. You are only digging your hole much deeper by attending third tier law school. You would graduate with 200k+ debt and little more earning potential than with just the undergrad degree. Thaats getting to the point of might as well flee the country.

As to the difficulty of getting into schools, check out www.lawschoolnumbers.com

Also, a good personal statement about your background would go a long way towards making up the UG GPA.

I haven't found www.lawschoolnumbers.com to be very helpful. For most schools the average GPA/LSAT for "accepted" applications seems a good bit higher than what their medians actually are.  Further, it doesn't really tell you *why* people were accepted or rejected.  Taking Drexel for example, you see people with 158 LSATs, and 3.6 GPAs rejected, and people with 152s and 3.5 GPAs accepted.  That's not informative to me.  I've also heard enough about taking time off.  I'm not going to work for $30,000 a year or have to bust my ass working overtime just to pay off my loans so I can better study for the next LSAT.  There's no guarantee I will score higher, and if I have to work that much just to stay above the poverty line, I'll probably be too bummed out and unmotivated to even bother studying.  I'll take my chances at a crappy school and see what I can do to transfer somewhere that might more reliably provide me with a good income at graduation.  I don't think it's too unreasonable to think I might be able to transfer into a school like Temple if I did well enough.

Plus, the question of whether or not Drexel would accept someone like me hasn't been addressed.  Like I said, the info on lawschoolnumbers is kinda misleading.

Okay... yeah, if you're convinced you want to go now and you're happy with Drexel here's what I have to say:

Is it hard to get into? Eh, it's all relative, but I'm going to say no, not really.

Will it be hard for you? Somewhat. You have some things against you: an unimpressive LSAT score/GPA, and you're applying late.

BUT... you're a good writer (that's evident from your posts). You're smart and determined. Why not visit Drexel and talk with someone on the admissions committee? Take a tour there. Apply ASAP and draft something really well written explaining to them that despite your low numbers, you really can and would do well in law school, and further, that you are really eager to attend Drexel in particular. Law schools, like their applicants, like to feel wanted. Give them some love, and you have a reasonable shot at receiving it.

Good luck, friend! 

[amk320]

RETAKE THE LSAT

You can't afford NOT to retake it- even with the year off. Talk with your lenders, something should beable to be worked out.

The only schools that will enable you to reasonably pay off that kind of debt are the kind that require a 160+ LSAT. You are only digging your hole much deeper by attending third tier law school. You would graduate with 200k+ debt and little more earning potential than with just the undergrad degree. Thaats getting to the point of might as well flee the country.

As to the difficulty of getting into schools, check out www.lawschoolnumbers.com

Also, a good personal statement about your background would go a long way towards making up the UG GPA.

I haven't found www.lawschoolnumbers.com to be very helpful. For most schools the average GPA/LSAT for "accepted" applications seems a good bit higher than what their medians actually are.  Further, it doesn't really tell you *why* people were accepted or rejected.  Taking Drexel for example, you see people with 158 LSATs, and 3.6 GPAs rejected, and people with 152s and 3.5 GPAs accepted.  That's not informative to me.  I've also heard enough about taking time off.  I'm not going to work for $30,000 a year or have to bust my ass working overtime just to pay off my loans so I can better study for the next LSAT.  There's no guarantee I will score higher, and if I have to work that much just to stay above the poverty line, I'll probably be too bummed out and unmotivated to even bother studying.  I'll take my chances at a crappy school and see what I can do to transfer somewhere that might more reliably provide me with a good income at graduation.  I don't think it's too unreasonable to think I might be able to transfer into a school like Temple if I did well enough.

Plus, the question of whether or not Drexel would accept someone like me hasn't been addressed.  Like I said, the info on lawschoolnumbers is kinda misleading.

Okay... yeah, if you're convinced you want to go now and you're happy with Drexel here's what I have to say:

Is it hard to get into? Eh, it's all relative, but I'm going to say no, not really.

Will it be hard for you? Somewhat. You have some things against you: an unimpressive LSAT score/GPA, and you're applying late.

BUT... you're a good writer (that's evident from your posts). You're smart and determined. Why not visit Drexel and talk with someone on the admissions committee? Take a tour there. Apply ASAP and draft something really well written explaining to them that despite your low numbers, you really can and would do well in law school, and further, that you are really eager to attend Drexel in particular. Law schools, like their applicants, like to feel wanted. Give them some love, and you have a reasonable shot at receiving it.

Good luck, friend! 

Would I include such an addendum with my personal statement?  I planned on discussing my personal upbringing in the statement, since I think that's my best chance for admission.  If I can illustrate that I represent a minority group (albeit just a socioeconomic one) and that I have, time and time again, beat the odds to succeed, there's a strong chance I'll suceed in law school despite a poor LSAT score and UGPA.

EDIT - Reason for my inquiry, I know that Dickinson requires both a general personal statement and then a specific "Why Penn State Dickinson?" letter.  I also plan on applying to Dickinson, though it is my absolute last choice after spending the last five years here in State College.  Penn State is the reason I have the crippling financial burdens I do.  Being the MOST expensive state school in the U.S and A. as it is...

[woeisme]

RETAKE THE LSAT

You can't afford NOT to retake it- even with the year off. Talk with your lenders, something should beable to be worked out.

The only schools that will enable you to reasonably pay off that kind of debt are the kind that require a 160+ LSAT. You are only digging your hole much deeper by attending third tier law school. You would graduate with 200k+ debt and little more earning potential than with just the undergrad degree. Thaats getting to the point of might as well flee the country.

As to the difficulty of getting into schools, check out www.lawschoolnumbers.com

Also, a good personal statement about your background would go a long way towards making up the UG GPA.

I haven't found www.lawschoolnumbers.com to be very helpful. For most schools the average GPA/LSAT for "accepted" applications seems a good bit higher than what their medians actually are.  Further, it doesn't really tell you *why* people were accepted or rejected.  Taking Drexel for example, you see people with 158 LSATs, and 3.6 GPAs rejected, and people with 152s and 3.5 GPAs accepted.  That's not informative to me.  I've also heard enough about taking time off.  I'm not going to work for $30,000 a year or have to bust my ass working overtime just to pay off my loans so I can better study for the next LSAT.  There's no guarantee I will score higher, and if I have to work that much just to stay above the poverty line, I'll probably be too bummed out and unmotivated to even bother studying.  I'll take my chances at a crappy school and see what I can do to transfer somewhere that might more reliably provide me with a good income at graduation.  I don't think it's too unreasonable to think I might be able to transfer into a school like Temple if I did well enough.

Plus, the question of whether or not Drexel would accept someone like me hasn't been addressed.  Like I said, the info on lawschoolnumbers is kinda misleading.

Okay... yeah, if you're convinced you want to go now and you're happy with Drexel here's what I have to say:

Is it hard to get into? Eh, it's all relative, but I'm going to say no, not really.

Will it be hard for you? Somewhat. You have some things against you: an unimpressive LSAT score/GPA, and you're applying late.

BUT... you're a good writer (that's evident from your posts). You're smart and determined. Why not visit Drexel and talk with someone on the admissions committee? Take a tour there. Apply ASAP and draft something really well written explaining to them that despite your low numbers, you really can and would do well in law school, and further, that you are really eager to attend Drexel in particular. Law schools, like their applicants, like to feel wanted. Give them some love, and you have a reasonable shot at receiving it.

Good luck, friend! 

Would I include such an addendum with my personal statement?  I planned on discussing my personal upbringing in the statement, since I think that's my best chance for admission.  If I can illustrate that I represent a minority group (albeit just a socioeconomic one) and that I have, time and time again, beat the odds to succeed, there's a strong chance I'll suceed in law school despite a poor LSAT score and UGPA.

EDIT - Reason for my inquiry, I know that Dickinson requires both a general personal statement and then a specific "Why Penn State Dickinson?" letter.  I also plan on applying to Dickinson, though it is my absolute last choice after spending the last five years here in State College.  Penn State is the reason I have the crippling financial burdens I do.  Being the MOST expensive state school in the U.S and A. as it is...

Yeah, I mean I'm no expert on this, but I'd suggest writing your Personal Statement. Maybe that will incorporate your upbrining. If so - perfect if not, then have an addendum for that.

Then have another separate addendum that essentially would be a "Why Drexel" ... though I wouldn't call it that or anything.